So where did she end up after this?When he says 'she can finally rest' does he mean as dying as human?
Is Norstein Bekker a Jew clown?
>>3686153>Pay 80 GoyPoint to see your GF get burned alive meanwhile you get gangraped
>>3686110Guessing they're talking about the Queen and I'm guessing they tidied up the language to make it sound less like she got her shit pushed in and died.
Everything regarding the blue haired ones is purposefully left vague. At the end you can see Magus looking after his sister meaning that nobody knows what happened to these guys.Chrono cross then came and shat all over the previous story. It's a dead IP so just make your own ending.
>>3686110One theory says that the Black Omen's mass was converted into a special portal. Buuut, another theory says it's still floating around in space. The "unwritten" plot of Chrono Cross told of multiple "Arbiters". It's wasn't just Serge. There was also Schala and others before her that were connected to the frozen flame, which gave rise to the Magic Users and the floating city of Zeal.
>>3686176The Kingdom of Zeal "fell" not long after the creation of the Mammon Machine.
>>3686177It was speculated that the Mammon Machine contained the frozen flame. But if the Black Omen was destroyed what happened to the Frozen Flame? Well, we know that Chronopolis (and the FATE supercomputer) went back in time, sealed the elemental dragons. Terraformed the island setting of Chrono Cross. And presumably recreated the events of Chrono Trigger using the "Records of Fate"; up to a point at least.
In an alternate timeline, the Reptites had also evolved, along with beastmen, also known as the Dragonians. They foresaw the awakening of Lavos, but rather than destroy it they just leapt forward in time to when Lavos was gone.
>>3686187So they leapt forward, while Chronopolis, using Lucca's theories, traveled back in time. And they met in the middle. And there was a showdown. But FATE split the Dragon God.
So. Either the Red Moon was a Dragonian "Ark". OR. It's how FATE sealed and split the dragon god.
It's assumed the Dragonians had an "Arbiter" of their own who was connected to Lavos through the frozen flame. So the timeline they're escaping from was one where the Arbiter chose the annihilation of their race.
>>3686193Another interpretation is that the Arbiter jumped forward in time with the Dragonians who were counting on the FATE of the humans to deal with their problem for them once they got there. And it does. But of course, FATE has to insure it's own glorious future. Or else it creates a paradox.
>>3686198
>>3686199
Which brings us to the OTHER unresolved plot thread of Chrono Cross which people often forget.
The Isle of the Damned. It just changed overnight, and nobody knew why.
>>3686203
Had the Chrono Cross plot continued to a 3rd, or even 4th disc, I assume Chronopolis and Dinopolis wouldn't have been the only time-displaced landmarks.
Which brings us to FF8's plot mystery. And the theory that speculates that Ultimate Weapon and Hyne are the same being
>>3686208Sorceress Power can't be contained by death. It is never explain why this is.
>>3686211The Dragonians leapt forward to a time where there were humans. However there were other futures. One without humans and a chronopolis. One with...
>>3686213
So Mother Brain exists in a future timeline where the robots live, post-Lavos. Had the Dragonians traveled to this time, they too would have been turned to capsules, and perhaps give Mother Brain the capacity to create organic host vessels, else a means to transmit itself into the past from the "geno-dome"Or even sabotage the "records of fate". The business with Lynx being Serge's father was weird. We're told FATE was trying to regain control of the Frozen Flame and Arbiter. It makes more sense that it was Mother Brain who needed control of the arbiter and annihilate the human race, ensuring her future. FATE on the other hand just needs human life to continue, since it can manipulate memories, it doesn't actually need anyone in particular to survive.
>>3686225FATE uses Serge's father to try and drown Serge. If the timeline didn't split because of Project Kid, then presumably FATE would reestablish its connection to the Records of Fate and change everyone's memories as if Serge hadn't died. Or even replace him with a clone, with all the memories Serge was meant to have.
>>3686230Kid herself is a replica body of Schala, just without the memories.
>>3686232Anyways. Queen Zeal was drawing her power from Lavos through the Mammon Machine. We assume this makes her an Arbiter, and the frozen flame must be part of the mammon machine and/or The Omen. She threatened to throw the heroes into the Mammon Machine as well. To be one with her, lavos, and the omen. Which suggests 1- the Mammon Machine is just a Junction Device. 2- the omen is alive.Perhaps meaning that The Omen itself is the Dragonian Arbiter, and Queen Zeal was just controlling it. A Dragonian version of the Epoch maybe.
Queen Zeal wanted to draw out the Mammon Machine's full potential. Which the wisemen feared was humanly impossible. The literal translation of "Black Omen" is "Black Dream". It was a metaphor. The Kingdom of Zeal was doomed to fall. Literally and figuratively. The Queen didn't want the dream to end. When the Omen rose into the sky it transcended time and appears across ALL eras. You might even call it an "aeon" Square-Enix uses this kind of language in a lot of games. The sun would never set on Zeal. Zeal would never be forgotten, as dreams are. Dreams fade with the light of dawn. I could name a dozen different Animes too that also use these motifs. Come to think of it, Chrono Trigger came out in 1995. That was the same year of Sailor Moon SuperS featuring the "Dead Moon Circus". Which was lead an evil queen obsessed with consuming dreamings and obtaining the dream of dreams. Although I wasn't the biggest fan of Sailor Moon and couldn't tell you anything about how the cosmology or timeline work.
thread ruined by the square schizo spammer faggot
>>3686824What the fuck is wrong with that guy? I swear Ive seen him ruin and make threads like this for 5 years. He doesn't reply to anyone even if you're being schizo with him.
>>3686853Use a trip.
>>3686787Adel fits into this somehow, right?
>>3686110She died and was freed from Lavos' malign influence. It's not that hard to understand.
>>3686176What unwritten plot?
>>3687547Adel is less of a character than Zeal. Given that Adel ruled over the city of Esthar that had robot soldiers, she herself was likely meant to be partly cybernetic. There's concept art from Chrono Trigger that suggests Queen Zeal and Mother Brain split from the same concept. There's also a sketch were Robo almost looks like the Mammon Machine. >>3687953They're talking about how Chrono Cross was obviously unfinished. You never go outside the islands to visit the "mainland", even though there is an exit on the map. Many of the characters are from the mainland and there's the whole thing with the Zenan Army occupying Termina in Homeworld, who were also looking for the Frozen Flame. And Lucca being kidnapped and forced to build robots. Lucca's orphanage is on the mainland, we only see it in Kid's "Memory/Dream". You meet Kid in "Otherworld" but there's the implication that there should be a 2nd Kid in "Homeworld" since the worlds split from after Serge was saved from drowning (Kid from the future)
>>3687957Where's this pic from? What artbook?
>>3687960Drawn by Masato Kato 1993. Supposedly part of the CHRONO ORCHESTRA pamphlet. There's a lot of character concepts that are more or less what we got. It looks like they dropped a Ninja and Sage character.
>>3687957There's actually an NPC in Esthar that talks about wanting to create a robot that can "dream". And another NPC that calls Adel's reign 17 years ago a "nightmare" When Ellone sends them into the past, everyone calls this the "dreamworld" before they learned it was real events from the past. This is just speculation. But perhaps in another draft, Adel wanted Ellone as something other than a successor. Or their relationship was something like Queen Zeal and Schala. I see a pretty clear influence from Adel's Tomb in FFVIII to the chambers of the fayth in FFX. But I think Chrono Trigger might have seeded the whole "Dream City" idea, stretching to FFXV's Insomnia.
>>3687957The plot being unfinished and unwritten are different things, and nothing about additional Arbiters is implied.
>>3686110I always assumed that since the Black Omen exists as a sort of temporal constant, active at all points in time, thwarting it creates a sort of paradox. You can't create a state wherein the Black Omen has been brought down in this world, so it creates a sort of split timeline, where because the Black Omen was destroyed, it never existed. It has to either exist or not exist, in an absolute sense, because it transcends time. If it ever exists, it always exists, and if it is destroyed, it can never have existed. You can never experience that timeline, because you experienced it existing, but by destroying it, a timeline where it never existed occurs, and the people of the Kingdom of Zeal just get to live a life of relative peace in their own little pocket of time, unaware of what happened around them. The world in which it never existed, and the people of Zeal prospered, lived, and died in happiness and historical obscurity was bought by you destroying it as a constant. That's how I interpreted it, anyways. I had thought this well before I encountered any of the expanded lore or what Chrono Cross said, and still mostly disregard anything said by it for the discussion of Chrono Trigger.
>>3687978The stuff about the arbiter is in the Japanese Ultimania Guide. Completed with the help of the game's Scenerio Writer (for people who think the Ultimania speculations are just licenced fan fiction)In the English version of the game, "Arbiter" is explained as a kind of privileged User-group set by the Prometheus-Circuit that locks the supercomputer FATE's access to the Frozen Flame. Even though the Flame is right there in Chronopolis with FATE, it can't use it to continue it's time experiments. Reading the Ultimania translation, things make a little more sense. The Frozen Flame decides for itself who the arbiter is. It wants someone that'll make a big impact on history. What the English version fails to clarify is that the super-computer FATE was running the time-experiments without the Prometheus-Circuit. Or rather, Prometheus was "off". When FATE rebooted, Prometheus was "on". This meant it couldn't mess with humans or human history, anymore. That was the "lock". So the Frozen Flame simply picked a new arbiter, one who can dream>>3687974Ah-ha! In CC, when you get to the top of Fort Dragonia you get a little history lesson about life emerging from the sea. The idea is that they were the first dreamers. Primitive life dreamed of life on land; they evolved themselves to make dreams reality. That was BEFORE lavos came. Everyone is a descendent of "dreamers", so everyone has the power to change themselves. The Ultimania explains this was meant to be a story Lucca told Kid; but it never made it into the game. The language is sorta there in English, but it doesn't really explain that Lavos feeds on the potential created by dreams.
>>3686787>>3686239I never knew there was this much lore behind Chrono Trigger, nor people that knew it to this depth. Kudos, that's pretty cool stuff.
>>3688421I wouldn't call it lore. It's kind of an ambient background noise across all the Square games. Even World of Final Fantasy has this thing with Diablos talking about something big happening to the dominion of dreams and fantasy, something intruded, collapsed, displaced all of them. It's vague enough that they could tie-in Lavos and the Chrono games if they wanted to. While a lot of people know how closely related CT, xenogears, and FF7 were. It's surprising to know that Chrono Trigger was meant to be closer to the Mana games than anything else.
>>3688421There isn't. It's all trannylore made up by a schizo.
you'll have to play the games to know for sure.
>>3686853He will reply to some people when it isn't a thread he made about speculating lore implications, but he just uses everyone like a springboard to keep going.
>>3689133Psychopaths like you want to harm schizos for spreading the divine light.
