This game look cool, never played it before. I know the newer ones have bad reception, but is Disciples 1 still worth playing with it's own merits or is 2 just an overall improvement?
>>1746910You only play 1 if you want the story. 2 is just a straight upgrade.
>>1746920There are anons who much prefer the original's art style and I definitely can't blame them. Both games have quality art.
>>1746910Yeah, at the mid of April /vst/ got me to go back to Disciples 2 (again) since it was like 80% off on steam so I bought it even tough I got the original disc and box for Dark Prophecy.And damn I am still at it and loving every second of it, this game has much more than just good art. I think the excellent dark fantasy atmosphere beats Warhammer's "grim darkness" any day. Currently playing the Guardians of the Light expansion saga on max difficulty, shit is rough but I am still enjoying it. Saving the Elf expansion for last.
>>1747015Just having the game on while you do stuff is great. It has one of t he the best atmospheric sound designs and contemplative strategy soundtracks.
>>1747029Honesty I admit I turned off the music and the ambient sounds. I am horribly tired of the magic shop constantly repeating their incantations on a loop.
>>1747015btw it's 40k that's more grimdark played straight, warhammer fantasy is considered more light hearted and openly comical
>>1747032You dare?
How good are werewolves really?
If you haven't played them before I don't see why you would not play 1 first. Sure, 2 is better, but if you want more after it it can be hard to go back to 1.
>>17469101st one has great art and music but the gameplay is…let’s just say dated.2nd one is kinda easier to play but it doesn’t realy do anything new. Now there is auto combat but at the cost of being ugly…yeah it’s stylized but ugly. Sorry I just don’t dig it. All knights are 300 year old geezers. All demons have 7 mouths and 6 gorriluon teeth. Undead look like they permanently pass a kidney stone for eternity and dwarfs look like they have serious health problems.I know I am at a minority here but I prefer the 3rd one.Comber is more interesting. Humans look like humans. Demons like enemies from doom. Undead like skeletons. Finally. It’s 3d but 3d done right. Each model looks gothic and magicle. You can tell what you are looking at. Get ressurection for full content. It’s like 10 bucks.
>>1747062They are good against enemies they are immune against and shit against others of course.
>>1747032Just move the viewport away.>>1747062Okay for some rushes, great for giving to Banshees once you have excess gold to spend on secondary and tertiary priorities.
>>1747170>I know I am at a minority here but I prefer the 3rd one.You're not just a minority. The "third" game has unimaginative, featureless "fantasy" art. I get preferring the original's art over II, but that's just nonsence.>Each model looks gothic and magicle. You can tell what you are looking at.You fucking what? All of it looks bland and indistinct. The palette is bleak and everything blends together into a giant brownish mess.
Disciples 1 look great.
Those fucking midgets get big mom Valkyrie as a female lord.
She hopes anons aren't falling for the hot goth gf lord the Undead lure the unwitting supporters with.
Legions lord isn't very cute so have a witch instead.
>>1747174But does it worth to build their building for 750 gold and then spend 1000 gold just to get one?
Weird thing. The stand-alone expansion to Disciples II, Rise of the Elves, works fine on my win10, but the base game when boot up shows black screen for split second and then crashes to desktop no matter how I tweak the settings. Disciples I works fine as well. All three are gog version. Although I think the expansion still has the base game campaigns, so I guess it doesn't matter?
>>1747284You are not good at the game. This is not an insult or any other kind of derogatory remark. Once you are good enough it comes to you immediately that yes, they are sometimes good when you often face fighter-heavy parties that deal physical, and especially if you face few mages.Homework: what factions are werewolves really bad against and why?>>1747293I'm using a cracked Gold version (with the two extra campaigns) because it works well on 7. You've bought it on GoG so the current rights owners can have their ROI, good boy. Now get a version that works well.
>>1747211You just don’t get it.You need to be a slav to understand
>>1747512Ironic. You probably just have shit taste, mate.
>>1746910Disciples 2 is the best, 1 was like a prototype with 2 being the main game in this series which had a number of versions and expansions I usually play the Rise of the Elves one these days since it adds the Elves as a faction. There were no real sequels in this series beyond that and maybe its for the best.
>>1746910It’s great but no one I know plays it. Maybe one person other than me.
>>1747272Embodiment of a Becky, no chance of competing with the undead Stacy.
>>1747437>You are not good at the game. This is not an insult or any other kind of derogatory remark. Gee, thank you captain obvious! If I were good I wouldn't be asking stupid questions.>Once you are good enough it comes to you immediately that yes, they are sometimes good when you often face fighter-heavy parties that deal physical, and especially if you face few mages.Thing is from 1750 gold you can practically buy 2 heroes with a full party and have 550 gold left to spare. If I take just 150 gold/turn as the starting gold that is 11 turns of buying nothing just to get 1 werewolf out. With 2 extra parties that could have already explored and looted half the map and likely killed several neutral creeps and leveled up everyone to level 2 already.>Homework: what factions are werewolves really bad against and why?I don't know, I haven't played all factions yet.
>>1747293https://heroes3wog.net/disciples-12-hd-mod-gl-wrapper/
>>1747284>But does it worth to build their building for 750 gold and then spend 1000 gold just to get one?No. See this anon's breakdown:>>1747894I'd also like to add that you actually pay 1050 for buildings (300 for doomdrake pre-requisite). 300 is 2 days worth income, plus you often don't even build the dragon tree in the first place, so it's waste too.>>1747293Use Verok's wrapper.>>1747896
>>1747894There are two ways to get more gold. One includes a variation that can be considered a third way.It's a game where you need to experiment and learn how it works to become capable of making accurate estimates from the information you have. Me or anyone else spoonfeeding you again and again would only let you get stumped in new places.>neutral creepsAh, so ASSFAGGOTS background. Figures.
>>1747512in your first post combat was corrected to "comber"... that doesn't sound like any slavic word i knowt. slav
>>1747437They can have these 2 dollars I spent on these games. Doesn't matter to me.>>1747896>>1748037Thanks. It works perfectly.
>>1748138>Me or anyone else spoonfeeding you again and again would only let you get stumped in new places.What your problem is with someone asking questions? This could be his first time playing this isn't some competitive PVP shit where you have to gatekeep.>neutral creeps>Ah, so ASSFAGGOTS background. Figures.Seriously, who hurt you? What is your problem?
>>1747622Seems to be a standalone instead of expansion, do I miss out on content if I don't play prior D2 releases?
>>1749719D2 has its own self contained story. I never played D1 and I didn't feel like I needed it.
>>1749719You can play D2 as standalone since game provide some context for D1 events. Just like anon above said. But you miss on some more obscure LORE. Which no one gives a shit about. Almost deal for Rise of the Elves, which for whatever reason exclude Warriors of Light/Servants of Darkness expansions. Eh. To not make it super complicated. Don't play Elves before you finishing at least Undead Hordes and Empire campaigns which are fortunately included in RoE.
>>1748166Alright I admit it…..you got me…..I…am….french….
>>1749880that's "almost" a slav, you are cool friendo!
>>1748138You can get gold by >taking territory with gold mines by conquering towns or planting rods.>clearing dungeons>selling items to shops, you can even steal stuff from shops using thieves and then resell what you stole although that is heavy RNG.>Alternatively selling spell/items to allies which is something rare and you probably shouldn't bother with.How fucking difficult is it to figure that out?
>>1746910Oh shit a Disciples thread! Currently doing the campaigns on max difficulty with rod planter heroes. Empire was okay because they are so op even if their campaign is the toughest. Undead is easy, the banshee actually feels better than the other leaders once you get her to lvl 3.>>1747062Dogshit. They cost way too much for a fragile gimmicky unit.
>>1747269My favorite portrait is one used for Bonelord in sequel
>>1747062They are broken when dealing with map enemiesStory missions are often trivial once you get them. For fighting other players, its not really worth it
>>1751017>rod planter heroesDruid and Baroness is where it's actually becomes torture. Dwarf champion is just King's guard but with handicap.
>>1751017>>1752859>Undead is easy, the banshee actually feels better than the other leaders once you get her to lvl 3.Banshee's only problem that her "attack" doesn't scale with levels, only gets better accuracy. After that she can only tank hits or use items when not attackingArch-angel is just a glorified acolyte but I admit did use one as the main hero for a Empire Saga play though just to see what happens. She was okay both as a tank and single target healer that can tank a lot of damage. Which is otherwise the biggest problem with healers is that they get sniped. Was a cool combo with an AOE healer.I think druid is the toughest Rod planter on level 1 and using only a lvl 1 escort. However on higher levels getting a bigger party defeats his main purpose of summoning free units.Baroness is also great but it is more annoying than effective since she just forces enemy to flee. It is cool but mostly just delays and separates the enemy and can take multiple battles to pick them off each. Plus it is useless when attacking cities.
>>1752884>Plus it is useless when attacking cities.When attacking cities or dungeons fear becomes paralyze.
>>1752884 >I think druid is the toughest Rod planter on level 1 Without mods summons don't scale with hero LVL either. Even if Sage is amazing road planter since he can create frontline and fight back. And enemy AI is also try to avoid them. Once you unlock all leadership slots it's just sorta dead weight beyond tanking and items. At best you can keep ents as fodder to hard LVL your arches/mages and keep sage unique summon gimmick. But I don't see a reason to do so. Elf campaign is filled with backline snipers. >Baroness is also great It's from my memory. But she has terrible base accuracy. And Legions require insane amount of XP and gold investment to not feel like shit. And they don't get werewolves or elderly unlike undead. So you sorta just build gargoyle and spend eternity to LVL it enough. First few mission I straight up had to cheese and I don't remember If ever managed to beat it or just gave up somewhere along the way. And this was on normal. Just not good.
>>1751017Archangel's "damage" scales worse than Empire healers and doesn't get an "attack" upgrade (reach 6 + cure or resurrect). Banshee is actually great compared to the faction's archer branch even right off the bat and only her low starting leadership is a downside compared to most other heroes. Before the patches that enabled locking unit progression she was an incredibly good choice, her only other flaw being lack of flight.Werewolves are great if you can knock out enemy party members with damage sources other than weapon. Just like Wraiths and their derivatives are except you just recruit furballs right away. They also can lead you into fun "OH SHIT" situations against hostile Horde parties.
>>1752884Banshee lacks flight (or even "hover" as her sprite implies), which is easy to mod in.Archangel does have flight which gives her a pretty good advantage over Ranger and Archmage.Another anon already addressed Fear attacks paralyzing when retreat is impossible.
guys hear me out. what if we combine disciples overworld/kingdom management with etherlords combat
>>1753169Etherlords is gay and retarded, sorry to tell you. Anything else is better, starting from Spectromancer or whatever casualised MTG clone was the first.
>>1752909Shit really? Wow I didn't remember that! Thanks for correcting me!
>>1753121>Archangel's "damage" scales worse than Empire healers and doesn't get an "attack" upgrade (reach 6(+ cure or resurrect).Yes, Archangel's main niche is that she can become a very tanky healer compared to other healers since she can wear defensive items, while not having any special ability Which is an okay niche since healers tend to be squishy but the Arch Aangel can tank damage and keep others healed. And since she can fill in the single target healer role you can take the AOE healer branch of the healer buildings.>Once you unlock all leadership slots it's just sorta dead weight beyond tanking and items. Yes this i what I said it is the best Rod planter on LVL1. But having more leadership actually is counter-productive since if he has a full party he cannot summon disposable minions which defeats the purpose of summoning disposable minions.
>>1753230>ArchangelYou do have a point but since there are only 6 party slots you are better off having an Archmage anyway. Empire mages are terrible while their archers and especially warriors are awesome. Single-target heal is now achievable by locking an Acolyte at XL1 too.>it is the best Rod planter on LVL1Disagree. Banshee is better even though Mind war or immunity are the most widespread.Wasn't talking about the Druid, he is terrible, almost worse than the Baroness but still not quite. You can opt out of taking 5 leadership in favour of other things like Natural Armour or even First Strike. That way his summoning "attack" remains useful all the way. Still having him upgrade his "attack" in some way similar to how Occultist -> Master Occultist progresses would've been great. Unfortunately that would require modifying the binary which is pretty damn difficult.
>lowers your level
>>1747062Better as a deterrent than a real unit. I've found they're not awful for keeping enemies honest and they make good city defenders if you need em. There are a couple races that struggle against weres too, but unless you can get a spy onto the enemy they aren't that great.
Cool game, but sometimes the balance annoys me and I wish the combat system gave you more options.Why the fuck didn't the undead get any damage sources other than weapon and death unless you're running Lich Queen?My favourite party to run with is Nosferatu lord + Phantom Warriors, Elder Vampires and Shades, but there's those undead v undead fights where everyone is immune to everything.
>>1755265>My favourite party to run with is Nosferatu lord + Phantom Warriors, Elder Vampires and ShadesNoob. I don't mean that as an insult. Keep playing, you'll discover new depths.
>>1755266Yes you did mean it, just like with >>1747437 you just want to feed your precious ego by putting other people down instead of actually helping them. And no telling people "GIT GUD SCRUB" is not helping. If you knew anything about the game you could demonstrate it by trying more than than calling other people names.
>>1755265>Why the fuck didn't the undead get any damage sources other than weapon and death unless you're running Lich Queen?This is likely an oversight on the devs for fluff reasons. You can work around this by items and overland spells, Undead have one of the biggest selection of pure damage map spells of multiple elements. You can use items like orbs and talismans in battle or scrolls to combat these situations.
>>1755478>This is likely an oversightSince it's only for one mission. I bet this is fully intentional for the most part.
>>1747062*poof* Your 1000 gold Werewolf is now an imp with 20 less HP than a 50 gold fighter that is also an imp. What a shame...
>>1756715Witch branch is possibly the worst supports in the entire game.
>>1758031>Succubus>40 (FUCKING 40)% chance to imp-ify the enemy party. At best you'll maybe hit 2. And if you're unlucky they'll just untransform before they start their turn.>Incubus>65% chance to petrify enemy party, potentially stun locking them endlesslySome real 300 IQ choice right here
>>1755266Oh, I don't mean in terms of gameplay, in terms of cool factor. I'm aware it's not the optimal party.>>1755478I know but it sucks, Undead by default don't get any buffing spells so you have to rely on items and spells you get if you're lucky enough to have access to a neutral building or other faction allies in dungeons and towns. Iirc there aren't any official scenarios in which you fight against a weapon + death immune party inside a dungeon or town but it's still limiting.There is no other faction that has this limitation.
I remember trying that game. Got mercilessly filtered, my units would constantly die to mobs, and I end up returning to town to heal them.
>>1759431You just have to work on leveling them up as fast as possible which means keeping them alive as best as you can, once you start getting up to the next couple of tiers it becomes easy.
>>1759448Yeah, but that means knowing exactly who to bully. I suck at Heroes of Might of Magic for the same reason, except HoMM is worse because the AI know where you are at all time and once they know they can take you on, they go toward you in a straight line.And also demons suck in V or IV.
>>1759431Do not worry level 1 units are very cheap just 40-50g heroes dying are what you should worry. Just use cannon fodder if you must and rotate your damaged party members between healing and fighting. (unless you play Empire where healing is pretty much free)
...okay.Well I guess I'll stick to Disciples III.
>>1759557>>1747896
>>1759558Even if I'm using GoG's?
>>1759559Yeah. D2 tends to run like shit on modern systems. Including GOG.
...this game sucks.The AI keep spamming armies that wreck any secondary army I might make, and my main army got wiped in a single attack.I'm refunding it.
>>1759582skill issue
>>1759582I have no idea why you decide to assault legions capital. Don't do that. Please.
>>1759625>not attacking towns in a HoMM-likeWhat the fuck am I meant to do, then? Killing their heroes did nothing, but they kept spamming full stacks.
>>1759636Disciples 1/2 is different, in that the enemy capital is defended by a giganigga superheavy unit that can 1v1 your ass, with the notable exception of a handful end missions, where you can buff your fully-upgraded troops and eventually flatten him. So most missions involve some other objective, like capturing a specific town, or killing a particular enemy, or reaching a marked area.
>>1759625don't answer, he is baiting
>>1759653>the enemy capital is defended by a giganigga superheavy unit that can 1v1 your assI noticed.Motherfucker instantly gutted my entire army of superduper awesome dudes.
>>1759688>>1759582In D2 every player/race has just 1 capital city which is guarded by a guardian. They are there so that one cannot just easily wipe a player out of the game when one starts out with a very high level hero and thus instantly trivializing the challengeCapturing capital cities is >>>NEVER REQUIRED<<< for any victory in the story campaigns so there is no need to focus on them. There are ways to capture capital cities for every faction but you should not really focus on it unless you already have a very high level party and tons of buffs from potions and spells available.
>>1759700How can I tell if a city is a capital or not? Send spies?And how do I counter the constant hero spam the AI do?
I remember playing it and was shocked at first how hard it was, its one of those old school games which doesnt fuck around
>>1759703>>How can I tell if a city is a capital or not?Only capital cities have their own unique look to the faction. Every other city are "neutral" and have identical looks that changes only with their level but they are identical.>Send spies?Once you had on of your thieves use the "infiltrate spy" action on any party of another faction (this even included other thieves) you can simply right click on any party/city of the faction to see the party in there. Otherwise it will say that you need to spy on the faction to find out information about it. The spy remains for a limited time and randomly gets capture then you must have a thief repeat the action. Not sure how new are you sorry if you already know this. Neutral factions can always viewed with right click without needing a spy.Tip: While on the map press the "B" key on the keyboard to turn the "Banners" graphic on/of which will mark all units and factions on the map, sometimes it is difficult to find parties behind terrain.>>And how do I counter the constant hero spam the AI do?Sadly you have to keep fighting them while you complete the Map objective that is part of the challenge.A Level 1 hero is usually roughly at the power of a level 2 (occasionally 3) unit of the same type, fighter, caster etc. A level 1 hero with a level 1 party is pretty easy to defeat tough. Usually they are just annoying once they ran out of their best troops and your main party already out leveled them I feel you for feeling that. Usually it is better to have more than just one single high level party to do everything.Raising units from lvl 1 to 2 costs much less than level 2 to 3 like around 70-80 XP vs. 475-550 XP and even greater on higher levels and the actual power gain from level ups can vary. For example three lvl 2 knights can beat a single lvl 3 Imperial knight and getting those three lvl2 knights leveled up cost less xp than getting that one lvl3 Imperial knight. You need to find the balance in levels.
>>1759733>Not sure how new are you sorry if you already know this.I played the demo when the game came out.So very, very, very new.>Usually it is better to have more than just one single high level party to do everything.Yeah, I realize that, and honestly, it annoys me. I can do multitasking, but I don't enjoy it, and playing whack-a-mole is prone to annoy me quickly.
>>1759741>So very, very, very new.Going from your previous post I would draw your attention on using thieves. They are 200g which I admit is a hefty sum for doing actions that can just instant kill them but Thieves can do many things to make life easier. From poisoning parties which does % based damage while spells do fixed damage. To dueling and thus damaging the leader to spying on ruins and just generally scouting or being a body block. And even more if you pick the "Guild leader" type.>Yeah, I realize that, and honestly, it annoys me. I can do multitasking, but I don't enjoy it, and playing whack-a-mole is prone to annoy me quickly.Sad to hear if it does. If so there is no shame in just quitting if you do not enjoy it maybe D2 is just not your type. What I can say though that once you get high level starting heroes leveling your units will get much smoother.
>>1759758I think I picked the Warrior General. I wanted to check different generals, but I misread the UI and ended up proceeding.And I dunno, I did the very first map of the original Disciples 2 campaign, the AI made a lot of thieves, they fell as easily as the rod planting guys.>maybe D2 is just not your typeI legitimately fear that. I do like the units progression thing, but playing whack-a-mole and having to follow the game surprisingly fast pace feels frantic.I think turn-based games more stressful than real-time games, that's a problem.
>>1759761Warrior General's main strength is faster play. The +15% regeneration stacks with regen in cities. I think the base regen is like 5-10%. You can rotate your damaged units into your 2nd hero and have them end their turn in cities and regen big chunks of health while saving tons of gold. And all of it is % based so it also scales to high levels. Especially good on the dwarf faction who have much higher than average HP pools on all units.>the AI made a lot of thieves, they fell as easily as the rod planting guys.yes thieves are easy prey even lvl1 summons kill them but their job is to support your other armies. Just getting a few poison rolls off can make a massive difference in a fight. They can also steal from shops/magic shops and save you a ton of gold if you risk the dice.Thieves are expendable but very useful if anything just for scouting the map.>playing whack-a-mole and having to follow the game surprisingly fast pace feels frantic.Could you explain what do you mean under playing whack-a-mole in this context?
>>1759761More than a few maps usually have some sort of chokepoint, which you can exploit to stop the enemy from spreading out. And, if you get a strong enough second army, you can park it in front of the enemy capital and spawnkill his level 1 parties.
>>1759817Oh, yeah, that'd work.
>>1759761I don't know very much about D2, but, in D1, Warrior Lord is the best Saga (campaign) choice. You rarely have enough mana of all requisite types (high level spells require more than 1 mana type) to make the Mage Lord's higher spell access + twincast worthwhile. And the Guildmaster's expanded Thief abilities could be useful in the right circumstances (Counterfeit Orders and Assassinate Weakest in particular), but thieves are expensive, fragile, and their abilities have a failure % (which is invariably lethal for the thief). Also, the Guildmaster Lord's unique hero upgrades are, on average, slightly less useful than the other lords'. >>1759816>I think the base regen is like 5-10%. You can increase regen rate by upgrading the city. Each upgrade level adds one extra garrison slot (up to a total of 5), increases the armor value of defenders, increases regen rate, and increases land conversion rate.
>>1759831>>You can increase regen rate by upgrading the city. Each upgrade level adds one extra garrison slot (up to a total of 5), increases the armor value of defenders, increases regen rate, and increases land conversion rate.Thanks I know! I know was unclear I meant the base HP regen without absolutely anything, no city, no warrior lord, no special effects just standing out on the map. I am not sure if it is 5% or 10%. But ye I know you can upgrade cities and the upgrade effects the highest is 30% so with Warrior Lord effect 15% that is 45% regen per turn in a level 5 town. I am not sure I think it may stack with the absolute base regen of 5-10% making units heal like half their full HP like that.
>>1759850I may be mistaken, and, again, not sure how it works in D2 (only played a bit, a long time ago), but in D1 units don't have innate passive regen. Not yours (player character), at any rate. They either need to be inside a city, or you need to have picked the Warrior Lord player type.
>>1760273Okay I just tested it, I opened save with a Guild Lord and went to fight had a Knight damage with 98 HP at the end of the turn parked out in the open next turn it wan up to 105HP so that is 7HP difference. The knight max HP is 150 and 7 is around 4.6% of that. Since the 5% of 150 is 7.5 I would assume that the base regen is 5% but got rounded down by 0.5 to avoid decimals.Granted I have the Gallean's Return expansion so it may be different in the base game.
>>1760288So they did implement a base 5% HP regen in D2. Probably because the no regen from 1 was a massive penalty to the other lord types.
Not trying to shit on this game, but I remember it being a doomstack fest - you had to feed your primary force every bit of exp possible in order to have a chance at the end of a campaign. There was no room for multiple stacks/armies.
>>1760490That's more or less how it is. Doubly so in the campaign where if you lose your main army you might as well reset, cause you aren't gonna be able to build up enough xp for the end game doom stacks.
>>1760671I'll chime in again to mention that this doesn't happen to the same degree in D1. Unlike D2, troops don't keep levelling up (for stat increases) once they've hit the last available upgrade tier, so killing enemies with fully-upgraded troops is a waste of xp. In D1 you're better off training a secondary army, once your main party has reached max tier.
>>1760490I am currently playing the Guardians of the Light/Servants of the Dark campaign on hardest difficulty. I think the "doomstack focus" idea is only part true. I wrote it in this post >>1759733 that leveling up has very steep diminishing returns per XP spent. For the same amount of XP to raise one single creature to level 3 from lvl2 you can usually raise around 3 lvl1s to level 2 of the same type. And honestly I found it possible to raise multiple creatures to respectable levels of 3-4 over the course of a map.Obviously there is a point where low levels are so weak they cannot even touch the higher levels before being obliterated but this is what spells, items and thief operations for. Also character/unit types do have strengths and weakness like how archers counter mages and some creatures are better in certain situations due to special effects.While having one single overleveled doomstack doing every single fight is obviously a viable choice it is extremely slow, and one single doomstack cannot be present at every corner of the map at the same time while the AI players are approaching from different angles, needing the doomstack to go back and fourth constantly. While even if the map is complete only one hero will go on and the rest of the doomstack will be discarded.
>>1760873>I think the "doomstack focus" idea is only part true. I wrote it in this post >>1759733 that leveling up has very steep diminishing returns per XP spent. For the same amount of XP to raise one single creature to level 3 from lvl2 you can usually raise around 3 lvl1s to level 2 of the same type.This is why a major strategy is to intentionally level lock a lv1 or 2 unit, preventing them from upgrading but allowing them to level up at meteoric speeds. I've used this to great effect in the expansion campaigns where you can have a super tanky apprentice or fiend that hits like a truck and heals after every battle since it barely requires any XP. Also useful for certain units that lose a specific element or property when leveling up, such as the lvl2 elf archers that deal air dmg in range but if you upgrade them they deal either fire or ice and level up far slower.
>>1759412>cool factorFair. Shame that a 5 Elder Vampire party requires too much effort in the campaigns.
>>1760273In the second game pretty much everything has at least 5% base HP regen.>>1760288>Granted I have the Gallean's Return expansion so it may be different in the base game.It was but only before the patches. Used to be 10% as a baseline and higher for some exceptional units, most notably Infernal Knight who had 50%. Only has 20% now.
>>1760490Only in the first quest or two of a given saga. Later on your transferred hero maxes out very quickly and while feeding the XPs to the rest of the party is perfectly good it's not really necessary either.
>>1760891Water is one of the best damage sources as only two units have immunity to it and like 2 more have wards. Losing Air, which is commonplace, for Water is an upgrade.
>>1759412iirc isn't undead the only faction that can actually get a death ward spell down? Or is it just that its lvl 5 for the others? Either way, undead damage types aren't actually the limiter they initially seem. Their debuffs are often better than most buffs at the cost of not being useful for sieges, but imo outside of campaigns with time limits you rarely actually need to debuff inside cities. You can just slap people down with your wallet instead. As for being limited, you could argue other factions are just as limited by not having debuff spells.>>1758031iirc their (sole) appeal is their high base accuracy and one-upgrade access to the debuff. You should always lock before succubus if thats how you go though, the party transform is terrible. Far better to treat them like a ghost with a potentially longer duration and try to one by one their whole backline. But on the whole the incubus is miles better yeah.>>1760891Someone did a post with the math on it a while back here, but locking is basically always better. Personally I'd only skip it for super critical power spikes and even then locking at one evo is usually still ideal. Ironically your elf archer example is one where I'd go for the upgrade. The DoT and the different damage types are usually better.
Glory et devotia!
>>1761247>iirc their (sole) appeal is their high base accuracyIt's more ability to purge any natural armor, wards and immunities excluding mind unit has and cripple all combat capabilities. Unfortunately polymorph comes with major drawbacks that paralysis/petrify don't have.
>>1761247>iirc their (sole) appeal is their high base accuracy and one-upgrade access to the debuff.In theory they're great because they can massively reduce initiative, almost always massively reduce damage, often temporarily remove useful abilities and, as another anon said, even temporarily removal of protections can be very good.The downside is that polymorph duration is erratic and can expire right before the polymorphed unit is about to act.>You should always lock before succubus if thats how you go though, the party transform is terrible.If you have a banner with +20% accuracy and a spare permanent accuracy potion they can be pretty good. Overland spells (bought or looted, obviously not from scrolls) help too but are not as good.>>1761359And Mind ward is very common, probably the most common in the game. Mind immunity is probably the most widespread immunity too.
>>17469102 is where the franchise peaked.
>>1761267Always liked Demonic units>First tier: some fucking peasant or other shit>Second tier: same peasant, but bulkier and armed>Third tier: demonic being>Final form: greater demon
>>1751017do rod planters get leadership 4 times or can they only command 3 units?
>>1761742Rod planters can have a full party like other heroes it just takes more levels for them.
>>1761788>it just takes more levels for them.Which also means they get fewer wards in total.
>>1761914Doesn't matter too much. You can still use them as a main hero to wipe the floor with anything. There's plenty of people on youtube who do campaign runs with a rod planter as a main.
>>1762693I don't need to see someone else did it, I've done that myself. If you fail to see why that post has value to those who actually want to become better that's your problem.
>>1759700There is exactly one mission where you need to destroy a capital but it's at the end of a campaign where it's no big deal really
>>1761359>>1761600I'd forgotten about that part of the transform. Yeah, it's definitely not as bad as it looks, but it's still definitely iffy at best. Personally I remember running into mind ward a few times and then basically deciding I'd never go anything except incubus ever again.imo the accuracy banner is just a band-aid though, far better to run almost anything else like initiative or armor.>>1761788Is that a mod thing? You can only take leadership twice, so they shouldn't be able to hit 5.
>>1763159>Is that a mod thing?Vanilla. Every hero starts with 3 slots by default so you can take it twice to hit the cap. Roadplanters can get full party by level ehhh 10-11 IIrc.
>the one russian site that had all the animations from the game ripped died at some point and the wayback machine archive is full of broken linksfuck
>>1763632isn't there a program to do it yourself? I remember people on steam forums talking about unused assets and moving levels between dark prophecy and rise of the elves
>>1763761Is there? If that's the case that it won't be too big of a problem that that one site died.
>>1761914>>1762693Can confirm that rod planters can get full part in vanilla. I also did my first Empire play-through with an Archangel as main waaay back when, because I was a retarded horny teenager and though she looked hot. And I finished the main campaign with her, granted it was on lower game difficulty and I suffered a lot of save scumming, because I was just a retarded teenager and had little fucking clue what I was doing besides looking at the cool art of my units "evolving". Granted that wast he second campaign my first ever campaign was Legions with Warrior leader.
>>1763159>imo the accuracy banner is just a band-aid though, far better to run almost anything else like initiative or armor.Sort of, but having 100% chance to hit on everything except mages (because they've broken reach 6 attacks in one of the patches, possibly for balance reasons) and some support types is really good. You no longer need to leave room for an odd miss here and there in your combat planning so a bit less pressure.>You can only take leadership twiceNo, there are 5 leadership offers on level-ups but since party size is capped at 6 the excess ones are removed from the list.
>>1763761There is, not sure if I have it and actually turning what you can extract into proper animated GIFs used to be somewhat of a hassle from what I remember. Never cared to delve into that because the engine does not support modding to the extent I want it to.
>>1763787>I also did my first Empire play-through with an Archangel as main waaay back whenShe's flying so that alone is a great advantage over Archmage and Ranger. Empire does have some neat spells to get around those weaknesses but it's a constant mana drain which can hurt you early on.>Legions with Warrior leaderDuke? A decent choice for the faction, I suppose there is no good reason to take 3 Infernal Knights now after the nerf, considering you can match or exceed anything they offer with the warrior leader. Although their direct damage mage tree is arguably the worst.
>>1746910I tried Disciples 2 recently but I dunno. It reminded me a lot of HOMM but it just made me wish I was playing HOMM instead, one of those kinds of games. I didn't play it too long though.
>>1763953what is stopping you from playing HOMM?
>>1761734I like undead for that. It's like Tier 1 : apprenticeTier 2 : necromancerTier 3 : psychopompTier 4 : avatar of Icthlarin
This is the ideal party. You may not like it, but this is what peak performance looks like.
>>1763276>>1763941I went back and looked at my rod planter campaign cause I was absolutely convinced you guys were wrong, turns out I am. I think I took the high level one you get gifted partway through the elves campaign and never got the chance to give him enough leadership levels. In retrospect, playing with a summoner I might have just not wanted full leadership. Either way, my bad.desu I have used accuracy banner just for that reason, but initiative getting me the jump on fear/paralyze spammers really just felt like it did the same thing but a little better since then I wasn't coinflipping who went first. Also the fact that you miss still anyways on hit6 guys is really frustrating and takes away the fantasy of locking down every enemy. I guess it's still technically worth it, but its somehow more frustrating to see perfect accuracy and miss anyways.
>>1764377Debatable whether Archdruidess is better than Alchemist here. Either way it is incredibly powerful, yes.
>>1764692I'd say the Alchemist is the superior choice here.>level 3 access as opposed to level 4>levels up very fast so you can have her accumulate more hp than the archdruidess>damage with the archdruidess bonus caps at 300 as usual. With the alchemist on large maps you easily exceed the cap and can potentially do up to 600 dmg You do however give up the archdruidess cure side ability, but imo it's well worth it.
>>1746910Aside for the gamedev’s blatant fetish why did they make the titan a buff fitness in the sequel?
>>1765930>why did they make the titan a buff fitness>the gamedev’s blatant fetish You've answered your own question.
>>1765930Why not?
>>1765930>men in games is normal>women in games is always a fetish
>>1765930For me it's the Banshee
>>1765945>normal man is normal>not normal woman is not normalImagine a game made by women where all men were buff cheesecakes with pencil eraser nimples
>>1765945>Yes
>>1764614There is a much better leader in the elven campaign. One of the Dryads is pretty much OP due to custom (map settings) buffs unrelated to level-up gains.>>1765924It depends on how long your average important fights are. There is only one support slot in that party and Archdruidess gives a damage increase that lasts for the entirety of a combat.HPs for Clans supports don't matter that much because they start out fairly beefy.
>>1766243>There is a much better leader in the elven campaignNTA Remember using scout leader. He is really beefy compare to vanilla factions counterpart. To the point where I used him as part of the frontline for extra mage/archer slot. Didn't help that elven melee tree is super boring and short.
>>1766305>elven melee treeI thought it was universally agreed that you should take 5 of those double attack archers as it allowes you to wipe out every stack before it can act.
I absolutely digged the story and art direction but omg is the gameplay dogshit. You can't actually strategize like in HoMM and build great armies that can snowball down the line. You always have this stupid JRPG 6 niggas in 2 rows stuff. You can't build an advantage of numbers.
>>1766450Time to learn what troop rotation is, how the amount of XP you need to level something up has hugely diminishing scaling, how upgrade locking can change a unit's role, how different positioning of units can change an entire encounter, how a single potion use can also change an encounter. And most importantly learn how thieves work!This is not HoMM, it is a different game if you want the HoMM experience you could play HoMM instead.
>>1766432Centaurs Chargers are good enough once you have a mass healer.
So I just finished imperial campaign for the first time. I was surprised the only timeline where Uther doesn't get Bethrezen'd is clans' saga, I had expected him to become evil in "evil" storylines and stay good in "good" ones.
>>1769311He is always a demon, staying in Bethrezen's fun place and having a cheating demonic whore mom would do it to a nigger. As I remember the Undead kill him for revival ingredients early on in the campaign and the dwarves just don't care about any of this shit, there's a crazy High King and Ragnarok to deal with, that Apocalypse talk from the Imperials is just superstitious nonsense. Also, the Dwarven King actually did call Uther a demonic asshole before breaking the alliance but it might have just been a case of a madman being accidentally right.And human Uther is one of the top four ugliest niggers in the game, with only peasants and both imps contesting the crown of the great uggo. It's clear there's something wrong with the little shit.
>>1769311Good stuff anon!
>>1769311It has been some time since I've finished the Clans saga, but fairly certain that Uther has not yet revealed his power level and that their saga mostly precedes the events of the Legions and Hordes ones, which do offer different paths.
>>1766499idk I never really bothered with any of that shit and just kept clicking quick battle with my op hero's doomstack and it usually worked. MAYBE put some leveled up units on defense/janitor duty in a few missions
>>1769487>>1770020fuck, maybe my memory is clouded, last time I played clans was over 15 years ago. It would indeed make sense, in all other sagas he stays in human form until he leaves the dwarf lands. Weird he didn't show during the ragnarok though. Gotta play Legions now.
>mass deaths kill any Empire or Legions combo without gargoyles>hermits beat deaths>archons beat hermitsWho beat archons?
What the fuck happened to this series, man. Why did Strategy First end up giving or sealing the rights to Kalypso Media?
>>1771247>Why did Strategy First end up giving or sealing the rights to Kalypso Media?They didn't. ST went bankrupt and the IP ended up with Akella. Akella also went bankrupt. So the rights belong to Kalypso now.
>>1771217any moderately powerful archer unit due to archon's shit health
>>1771636After the very obviously non-disciples rpg inconspicuously wearing a disciples mask that was Liberation I am ready for Kalypso to go bankrupt too and for the IP to finally land in caring and capable hands
>>1772470>and for the IP to finally land in caring and capable handsOf EA, Ubisoft or Microsoft?
>>1773288Well obviously the part where u said "caring and capable" wasn't sarcasm. Besides, why would any of those companies be interested in a niche ip in a niche genre? I was thinking more of one of those new age retro-revival type companies. Worked well enough for system shock (although it took a while to get there)
>>1773910>I was thinking more of one of those new age retro-revival type companies.They always make compromises for the sake of "modern audiences" so while it doesn't result in bad games it can't result in games on par with the originals.
>>1773916While Disciples is definitely my all-time favourite even amongst its contemporaries (AoW/HoMM), I will not allow myself to pretend about its greatness. The game is very basic AND poorly balanced to boot. It was only ever carried by its artstyle, music and atmosphere - and we have plenty of good examples of that in the indie games of today. It's even better since dark fantasy is very much "in" right now, so the style could be preserved quite well. And mechanically, X niggas in a row is also fairly popular - Darkest Dungeon and its knockoffs, fatlus rpgs, various RPGMaker indies all find their audiences. So, mechanically for Disciples there's nowhere to go but up, just gotta make sure not to turn it into something it's not supposed to be, like D3 or Liberation.And as far as including "woke" things that people complain about - I think people will deal with it. D2 already had the "smart powerful female leader" trope with Yata Hali and I don't hear anybody complaining. I think a modern Disciples game would be completely fine, and in most cases better than the OGs, it just has to have developers that give at least half a shit.
>>1773922>The game is very basicDespite seemingly not having lots of things in it it has plenty of depth.>pretend about its greatnessCompared to what? Also something doesn't have to be the apex of creation to be good and for compromises on its core aspects to bring aspiring sequels down a full category or more.>And mechanically, X niggas in a rowIf that's all there is to it for you then you're not qualified to compare the game to others, at which you are probably good.>So, mechanically for Disciples there's nowhere to go but upNot really and you even point out a failed attempt yourself. A failed attempt that did exactly the "let's adapt it for the average modern player" mistake.A modern attempt of a sequel will replace the unit mechanics with resistance percentages, add ATB, in-combat spells, arbitrary upgrades, remove per-game exclusivity from branches, fuck up thieves, fuck up summons, have most overland spells last multiple days, change leader equipment and so on, and so forth. The most likely outcome of "getting on with the times" will be precisely the opposite of>just gotta make sure not to turn it into something it's not supposed to be
>>1773288>UbisoftI think Disciples lead artist is still works there. So maybe. At the very least Ubisoft kept HoMM dead. Right after killing it. Very "noble" thing to do.
>yo astaroth lets leave those lame ass demons and join the empirefuck me, now i remember why i ragequited legions last time, the story makes no fucking sense at all
>>1773922>>D2 already had the "smart powerful female leader" trope with Yata Hali and I don't hear anybody complaining.To be fair that was because of the unforeseen tragic death of Grimnar so there was little choice. Yata Hali didn't do much besides not making the same obvious mistake her father made, despite the writing being on the wall. She was simply listening to the obvious signs from Wotan and the Loremasters' advice that her father ignored.
>>1775179Either early onset of dementia or very poor bait. Consider sudoku.>>1775257Dwarven women have beards so they're honorary men anyway. No, really, look closer at her portrait.
Anyone here ever bother using these? I always go for the Son of Ymir for obvious reasons.
>>1776689Very scary to fight aganist. Not as scary when you use them. It feels like Dwarf campaign was designed with Son of Yumir in mind too. Bane of backline and that's about it to be honest. Clans is the only faction where you can have full party with different elemental damage types too. Heh. So I guess if you want that.
>>1776689Ymir is good because it is a massive single target hit has a standard 50 initiative while most Clans units have 40 or even less. So Ymir can reliably delete one frontline target before it can do much. Just that he gets his turn off faster means so much plus it has the Forstbite effect even which ignores armor making it even better vs. armored enemies and town battles.Elder One has 20 imitative which is one of the slowest and does AOE which can reasonably allow the enemy to survive a few extra turns but it can reach the squish back-line and wipe out an entire party faster. An Alchemist can help with that but druid line is usually better as a general choice since their buff sticks around.The big upside of the Elder One, just like Undead dragons, that it is a tanky AOE damage dealer instead of being a squishy mage that can be sniped by archers before it gets the attack off. For example a Ymir could be worn down by back-line archer fire since it can clear only 1 target per turn in the front line.(Unless you pick an an alchemist.)However the campaign usually has doomstack enemies as bosses/final battles with big HP pools instead of larger number of them with smaller HP pools so the Ymir is generally more favorable in those encounters But personally I do not use giants unless it is absolutely required they take far too long to level up for my short patience.
>>1775285>checks portrait Kek, you're right, she has her beard styled into sideburns.
>>1776689They are good mostly in multiplayer rather than in single player.
>>1776754>The big upside of the Elder One, just like Undead dragons, that it is a tanky AOE damage dealer instead of being a squishy mage that can be sniped by archers before it gets the attack off.Except Clans have their mages grow out of warriors, keeping the HPs. And since Hermits are so incredibly good getting the large-sized guts with Air damage source is a worse choice every time unless you want flavour. 2 Hermits will gain levels faster despite increasing the divisor.
>>1778081Enjoy fighting Blue Dragon with your Hermits.
>>1778081Absolutely, this is why I said I do not use giants in general, they level so damn slowly.
>>1776689They completely mog Beasts and to a lesser extent Tiamaths because of their awful damage types.
>>1747269Disciples 1 is pretty good, but 2 improves on it in every way possible so there's little reason to play it besides nostalgia.
>>1780290It's not a long game, so you can play it for lore. Also, the factions are more clearer-defined than in 2. Disciples 2 went the Heroes 3 route of having every upgrade tier for every unit. In D1, some lines were shittier than others, depending on faction. For instance, the damned have weak infantry, since their possessed tree ends at anti-paladin. Or the empire having weaker mages, since they only get the first two upgrades. Plus it encourages you to spread out, since units don't gain xp/levels once they've reached their max upgrade. So the general game flow is somewhat different.
>>1780346It really feels like the Devil's Guard was supposed to be the level 4 for the Legion fighters and many missions do feature neutral camps where you can hire some.Anti Paladin stats:>220 HP + 75 damageDevil's Guard stats:>250 HP + 100 damageThey are still slightly worse then the level 4 melee units.
>>1781238>It really feels like the Devil's Guard was supposed to be the level 4 for the Legion fightersCertainly fitting if that was the original intent.
>>1780346>some lines are shittier depending on the factionThis is clearly supposed to be the case in 2 as well.>every upgrade tier for every unitidk if this is what you mean exactly, but if you mean every unit can upgrade through all 5 tiers its not the case. To use your example, Legions still have the worst frontline units with the shortest tree except elves. And empire still has a shorter tree for their mages.The issue in 2 is that they didn't make evolves worthwhile compared to powerleveling for most units, so there isn't a strong enough incentive to actually go up the tiers with most units.
>>1781497>empire still has a shorter tree for their magesEmpire shortest tree is their archers. With D2 empire mages actually got more upgrade paths. Unfortunately elementalist is huge meme. I mean who the fuck gives a summoner 95 HP and 40 initiative. Actually who would use summoner in game where party slots are limited to 5. Now if only master occultist wasn't a special boss fight.
>>1781508>Unfortunately elementalist is huge meme. I mean who the fuck gives a summoner 95 HP and 40 initiative. Actually who would use summoner in game where party slots are limited to 5. One of the Russian schizo mods (Norwegian Salmon) buffs them considerably (50 initiative, summon twice, all elemental wards and significantly stronger upgraded versions) and they're still underwhelming af due to the limited battle slots.
>>1781631>buffs them considerablyYeah. But you also get mage with frostbite and buffed white wizard. And elementalist to demiurge is as expensive as upgrades for frontline fighters. So fuck that.
>>1781508I was using the posted example, comparing the empire wizard to other wizards not their other units. In either case, the point stands. Empire wizards aren't upgrading through 5 tiers, and no race gets 5 tiers on every unit.
I like gargoyles. That is all.
>>1782178Marble > default > onyx. Onyx's complete lack of static animation and subsequent violent outburst of attack animation is superb, but the portrait is kinda derpy.
>>1782252you guys play with animation on?
Best parties for each faction in Disciples 1 single-player on Very Hard difficulty:>ClanEngineer + 2x Ice Giant + Dwarf King>EmpireRanger + 3x Angel + Patriarch + Wizard (Actually Ranger + Angel + 2x Red Dragon in the final campaign mission because jesus christ the Empire roster sucks. Not a single backrow unit with above 100 HP when the AI keeps spamming the 100 and 150 damage spells.)>HordesNosferatu + 3x Dark Lord + 2x Vampire>LegionsArch-Devil + 2x Demon Lord + Anti-PaladinExcept for Legions pick Warrior Lord and give you hero Leadership -> Banner Bearer -> Leadership -> Pathfinding -> Might -> Toughness -> Regenration and equip two +20% armor banners.For Legions pick Mage Lord and give your hero Leadership -> Artifact Lore -> Leadership -> Swift -> Might -> Toughness -> Pathfinding and equip two +50% damage artifacts.Discuss.
>>1782269generally yes>>1782252I'm of the opposite opinion. To me the marble gargoyle's portrait looks derpy. I am however glad that we can agree that the Onyx attack animation is amazing.
>>1782269Do you have Pentium III or something? Why is it even a question?>>1782273>(Actually Ranger + Angel + 2x Red Dragon in the final campaign mission because jesus christ the Empire roster sucks. Not a single backrow unit with above 100 HP when the AI keeps spamming the 100 and 150 damage spells.)Actually, there is a staff of invisibility you can capture behind some high level demon mob on your half of the map to save your squads from spell nukes>>1782273>2x VampireQuestionable. Wraiths provide immense temp value when clearing the map. Even against Clans juggling dark lords with elemental wards vs giants (and disable them with specters) and wraiths vs king's guard/melee provides good results. But dark lords are a must over skeletons in D1 without a doubt.
>>1782456P.S.Or you get the staff off some high level enemy hero rushing the city at the etrance of the gorge, I forgot specifics
>>1782456>Do you have Pentium III or something? Why is it even a question?well, when you have animation disabled you don't need to wait for it to finish between units taking turns in combat. Try it anon, it speeds up fights significantly. I'm already frustrated by having to reload each encounter 10 times to try a different combination of buffs and initiative/hit rolls, if I had to watch the sprites bump each other over and over again I would be driven insance.
>>1782456>dark lords are a must over skeletons in D1No they're not. Of course, disciples is a quite easy game and it can be completed with pretty much any party, but still, dark lords, just like empire's inquisitors have a whole 50 hp less than skeletons, unlike d2, where they have just 10 hp less or so - and that's a whole hit from other mobs. Plus, unlike in d2, they can't overlevel, so you're stuck with them while skeletons can be promoted to much stonger champions in almost any mission. I'd say they are only worth it in the third mission of undead's saga - when both empire and clans are spamming endless amounts of heroes, capturing your cities, and throwing tons of spells at you.
>>1775257>Yata Hali didn't do muchAnd then she died. Fucking elven niggers
>>1784055>just like empire's inquisitors have a whole 50 hp less than skeletons3-4 level mages, giants, dragons, enemy mage heroes deal massive elemental damage over the course of several battles in one day even, which is greater than even HP difference between skeleton champion (270) and DL (170). Plus, it means complete immunity to enemy damage spells except for a few mind ones from the Legions.>I'd say they are only worth it in the third mission of undead's saga - when both empire and clans are spamming endless amounts of heroes, capturing your cities, and throwing tons of spells at youThey are better in any mission of the campaign except PERHAPS 2nd one against the Bone Lord. Blocking a single hit from hill giant worth 60 hp >> 25 HP difference between a templar and a zombie. Especially they are great in the 4th mission where Clans have dragons
>>1784188Just like I said - game's pretty easy, so any party comp can do just fine. I just found dark lords to be lacking compared to skeletons in most situations. I mean, the main problem for the front row for me wasn't aoe elemental damage, but focused single target hits that you cant defend from, unlike in d2 and a whole 100 hp is crucial in that. Taking massive aoe damage in battle is just poor battle preparation - mages should always be focused and never gat a turn, for giants you have ghosts that can go faster than them (plus, can be nukes by much stronger skeleton champions), and dragons are far and few between, can be paralyzed, and with warrior lord, damage is easily healed after battles.
>>1784105She died in the elf expansion? They had to beat a super cool looking Knight and a Dwarf operating Rapemachine 1.0 to do that anyway. And you know the Dwarves deserved it, millenia old grudges or something. Also. a beautiful valkyrie lady would fit better as a ruler. I am sure that Wotan would approve and is a bit sad his children got their asses kicked so hard by a bunch of knife ears urged by a dude he once had tossed into the sun.
>>1784419>She died in the elf expansion?Yeah. A single manlet betrayal is all it took and also some magic, but elven magic looks like shit.. IIRC around mission 4-5. So it's way before confrontation with Allemon and Clans engineer.
What the fuck was his fucking problem?
>>1784690I need to replay it. Personally, I liked the elves and didn't even notice that they had a different artist working on them back then. Though I 've read some convincing anon arguments how they were shit and didn't fit the image the Neutral mobs from previous campaigns projected. Getting your own dragons to train would have been cool...
>>1785367>I liked the elvesTo me they just feel really underdeveloped compare to original D2 factions. Dark elves had insane amount of flavour attached to them too. So entire playable race got mogged by 3 variants of neutral unit you fight in a few missions.
>>1785350Nothing really, he just wanted UNLIMITED POWAAAA by taking over the place/soul of Bethrezen, the game's version of Satan.
>>1784188>Plus, it means complete immunity to enemy damage spells except for a few mind ones from the Legions. This is actually a pretty good point. Warded troops are immune to the first casting of an overland elemental damage spell. The computer loves smacking your parties with them (and you won't always have access to either the Sanctuera spell or a Staff of Invisibility).
>>1785413It's actually kinda funny that if you read the lore, you understand the Bethrezen is actually the one in the right and was done super dirty by the "omnipotent" allfather.
>>1785488Both Betrezen and Mortis were wronged pretty hard by the so called ''good'' Gods. For how monstrous they are, it humanizes them a lot paradoxically.Another thing I also like is how surprisingly benevolent Mortis can be at times. In the campaign you see the undead help the merfolk, spare humans that don't go against Mortis and she even has the undead threaten merchants in order to get them to sell to sell them items (instead of, you know, slaughtering them and taking the items). Despite how cruel she is, there is a sliver of honour and ''goodness'' to her, unlike most undead factions in gaming which are pretty much always pure evil.This is all of course a moot point, since she completely loses it when Gallean spurns her post-revival. And I don't really blame her.
>>1785516You can't exactly blame Gallean either, considering a. what become of her and b. the atrocities she had done to bring him back.
>>1784336>mages should always be focused and never gat a turnHow do you "focus" someone as Undead in D1 if you only have melee and 40 ini AoE units? >for giants you have ghosts that can go faster than themDid you play the game, bucko? Ghosts have 20 ini, they always go after melee giants, and tied with AoE giants (due to extremely low basic ini you can't even affect it with spells or potions either way). It is always about suffering a single hit, and then picking the target to paralyze. The point is, if you position your dark lords against giants, they don't suffer ANY damage from them in the first place, while you always have to restore HP on your skeletons.And in D1 there is no free HP regen except for a warrior lord.>>1785427>Warded troops are immune to the first casting of an overland elemental damage spell.Warded troops are immune to ALL castings of overland damage spells of the respective element.
>>1782273>Hordes>Nosferatu Isn't Lich Queen better, for the non-death damage source? >For Legions pick Mage Lord Is it really worth picking anything other than Warrior Lord as campaign boost? That free health regen is really handy. Plus, direct damage and curse spells don't work on garrisons or ruins.
>>1785849>Did you play the game, bucko?Of course I did, and completed it rather easily using warrior lord, nosferatu, a ghost and two mages. It really is a quite useless discussion, since you can complete the game with almost anything. I just valued hp in skeletons much more, than elemental shields that cut your hp by a hundred and your damage by 25. With warrior lord and armor banner, even if you recieve an aoe hit from enemy mage it will be healed next day. Plus, clans' giants are not the only thing you encounter, and against most of the other stuff skeletons seem like a superior choice.
>Primitive Giant hits with a stick>weapon damage>Mountain Giant hits with a stick>earth damageExplain
>>1786151i have never played this game and i stumbled into this thread by accident, but to answer your question, after googling, it seems the primitive giant's stick is fashioned into a club with stubs in it while the other giant's stick is just a tree stump. assuming i've got the right giants
>>1786111In Disciples 1 the +50% initiative skill is exclusive to Mage Lords.
>>1786184You got the correct ones yes, but I would still argue that a simple uplifted tree should count as a weapon too. In the end, the Mountain Giant dealing Earth damage is an improvement imo.
>>1786151>undead are clans arch nemesis Honestly I have no idea beyond that. Runes or something.
>>1786147>using warrior lord, nosferatu, a ghost and two magesTry with a banshee, bucko.https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8IM5n2Mieos&t=355s >clans' giants are not the only thing you encounter, and against most of the other stuff skeletons seem like a superior choice.Except 90% of damaging spells are elemental (and D1 AI LOVES spell nukes), and everyone has elemental AoE. To get use of regen you still need to end up with alive units at the of the day, and make sure that in between turns they don't get nuked to oblivion anyway. Waiting whole 6 turns for entire party to heal up is a so-so strategy. You need replacement troops between cities and your parties on the map, and dark lords get you a lot of value because they have such a staying power. >>1786216Don't bother with him, for a professed Disciples connoisseur he gets even such a basic stuff as ghosts vs giants initiative wrong.>>1784336
>>1786244>the DS1 lords actually have a bit of character written in their bioWhat the fuck. Though after checking the game it is sadly is the same no matter what portrait you choose so it\s definitely half baked. Still, it was almost a nice touch. By the way DS1 anons, do campaigns in it have unique characters (portraits/bosses/heroes) you'd normally not meet outside the campaigns or it's all generic portraits and faction units?
>>1786267>By the way DS1 anons, do campaigns in it have unique characters (portraits/bosses/heroes) you'd normally not meet outside the campaigns or it's all generic portraits and faction units?Yes. Some of them get name dropped in Disciples 2 campaigns.
>>1786244Dude, I never said this is some sort of superior meta strategy - just that it worked just fine for me, and that I personally found templars and dark lords to be lacking. It's an obscure game from 1999, who even cares. Nosferatu is pretty fast, so you can always stay in the city even after battle, for example, so the spells won't get you. But you've convinced me to complete it one more time using dark lords, even though I don't really like the hordes and much prefer legions - 30 movement and flying on every hero (especially on a rod planter) is just so good. >Don't bother with him, for a professed Disciples connoisseur he gets even such a basic stuff as ghosts vs giants initiative wrongBut here you should fuck off, it's obvious that's not me who wrote that, plus I personally think that mage lord works the best for legions - your rod planters dominate the map, so you always have a lot of mana, plus having two times more of illusions for recon, invisibility and paralyse spells is super satisfying.
>Disciples III>hmm yes let's take away the combat style that disciples is famous for and make it more like heroes>also let's make 2 out of the 5 races dlcsWhat were they thinking?!
>>1787729It's fundamentally broken game. They didn't think. Like at all. The credit where credit is due. At least Hex had some grasp on what fans want. Unlike Frima.>combat style that disciples is famour for Arguable? The series (Disciples Sacred Lands and Disciples 2) is mostly renown for unique art-style and unit upgrades.
>>1787740I am 100% convinced that Frima were making an unrelated rpg and were forced to put a Disciples coat of paint on it by Kalypso (to test the waters with the ip they bought)>combat styleYou know what people mean when they said that. If, say, Darkest Dungeon decided that the combat in the sequel would be changed to an isometric grid tactics people would riot. This is the same.
>>1778167Blue dragons aren't very common. If you do meet them, Clans have so many buffs that their Earth damage mage leader can wipe the floor with anything.>>1778329They are fun, however. This is why I tweak the game to make other branches more attractive in general.
>>1782100Don't know what that anon was talking about because I don't remember D1 upgrades well enough, but simply having more buildings to purchase in the capital does not make a branch better. The only way L4 or L5 make something better if they give it something special, like armour or initiative or double attack or at least a ward. Empire mages lack that but at the same time they need the least XPs to reach next level (the DynUpg way) without "locking" feature introduced by one of the patches. Even with it, Wizard needs less XPs than Demonologist and White Wizard less than Pandemoneus (and Lich, but at least Lich gets 10 more damage).Another important factor of shorter branches is that you do not need the huge sums of gold to buy L4 and especially L5 buildings.
>>1784419Wotan is a cunt and his shortstack retards deserve it 100%. Mortis did nothing wrong.
>>1785367>and didn't even notice that they had a different artist working on them back thenI didn't know this until now but this explains a lot. Yes, the "neturals" (which are a full fledged subfaction in game data terms) looked and worked way different in pre-RotE times. I can't say I hate the new Elves but they do look and feel very different. Even their capital looks wrong, they were always giving off more orderly / less savage vibes. The designers incorporating that as the savage/noble split is nice but it still isn't enough.
>>1786151A druidess did it!
>>1788786To be fair elves always made sense to me as splitting into two factions - savage ones considering nobles as too cucked and nobles considering savages as too unga. But having two elf playable races would be too much.This game needed more playable factions in general, I read something about an orc one being planned, but the game died before any of that could be done. I wonder how the terrain would look like for any new race.
>>1788767D2 has no difficulty in the later missions anyway. Each campaign has one of those super broken arrtifacts (Soul Crystal, Hag's Ring, Unholy Dagger and Horn of the Incubus) that let your Leader solo any neutral stack. In the expansion missions especially all you do is run into the next stack you see press escape (quick battle end), run into the next stack and press escape, cast any haste spell, run into the next stack and then end the turn.The hardest mission is probably Undead 2 from the main campaign if you made the mistake on picking the super slow Lich Queen as that one has a very short time limit.The first Disciples was way harder.
>>1789055Hag's Ring is below average. Unholy Dagger is merely good, not broken. Artifacts never let a leader solo everything in the sagas, their high attributes due to high experience level do. Although permanent potions definitely help. You could argue that two Bethrezen's Claws could allow a low-level leader solo anything in a quest but you don't get even one in most sagas.The additional sagas are pretty lame, yeah. Not sure I'd call them expansions, even though they were sold as that before being rolled into "Gallean's Return". Did they even add anything beside the 4 sagas? They sure fucked up computer player scripting by making it omniscient among other things, as well as messed with the balance needlessly.
>>1789072>Hag's Ring is below average.Imps only do 20 damage which is literal nothing so it really is not significantly different from the Soul Crystal.>Unholy Dagger is merely goodUse it with 2x Son of Ymir and Archdruidress. The AI thinks your Leader has the lowest HP so focuses all attacks on him while each attack of your leader fully restores his HP. It's basically an inbuilt immortality cheat.
I've been replaying D1's campaign and 3rd Undead mission reminded me just how fucking ass the magic system is in these games. Death Lords are basically mandatory otherwise your stack gets wiped off the map in one turn.
I just found out that apparently russians play competitive disciples. This has to be the absolute worst game possible for pvp since one loss and your entire army crumbles so good luck catching up with the finite number of stacks available to farm xp. At least pvp heroes makes sense.
>>1792083The limited amount of homm competitive pvp that I've watched on jebus cross also ended pretty much 99% of the time after your main stack was destroyed. Nor that different desu.
Missed this game entirely growing up but it looks neat. Is the steam version fine or do I need t grab the GOG version and do some wizardry to make it work on W10?
>>1793301gog works fine, never a bad idea to use voodoo though
>>1747170i literally get filtered by disciples 3I love the artstyle which is like grimdark anime,But holy shit besides the Human campaign which ic an MOSTLY manage, every single thing in this game beats the shit out of me,How are you even supposed to play it
>>1793327>How are you even supposed to play itFor the sake of your sanity. Pirate Reincarnation. It comes with braindead AI and bunch of fixes. As for gameplay. It's relatively simple. Eh. Shortest branches turbocucked with few exceptions. Same applies with unit locking. So pay attention to resistances, damage types and unit "base" stats. It's very unpleasant game to play. Just pray map RNG is good enough so you can hog a powerspot or two to dish out something that resemble damage. Oh yeah. Game is pseudo-RPG now. Which means units with shitload of levels almost always wins. You going to love fighting trolls with underleveled parties.
>>1793301Get this thing. >https://heroes3wog.net/disciples-12-hd-mod-gl-wrapper/It allows you to set the game to triple speed which is much needed. The only drawback is that the text in the campaign mission introductions scolls too fast.
>>1793327Strange. I found it incredibly easy. Just get 100 armour on your campaign hero and that's it, you've won. Bonus points for levelling a thief to 100 evasion on the side because it can also serve as a damage magnet (computer scripting avoids wasting attacks on 100 armour but not 100 evade).
>>1793303>>1793393Thanks Anons
>>1793393We lucked out a lot with the the gl wrapper. I can play disciples 2 in 4k, while some other games from the era require a ton of hoops to even run on modern systems.
>2x as much XP to overlevel as Hermit>15 less damage>can waste a turn
>>1798477Water Immunities are common just look at stuff like Frost Giants and Blue Dragons.
>>1798477flavourful but terrible units are part and parcel of disciples tech trees
>>1798516>Water Immunities are commonYeah, unless you're playing against Empire, all but 2 creatures from Clans, Hordes, Legions, or almost all neutrals (save like 1 or 2). Other than almost all of the creatures in the game, it is very common among those 4 creatures.
What is wrong with Disciples 3 anyway? I've been playing it for a while and it's pretty alright. Although that might just be me being enamoured with the kino artsyle.I have also installed the Remastered mod. Apparently it makes the game more fun...?
>>1799590>What is wrong with Disciples 3 anyway?Bugs. A lot of them on release. Art-direction is a mess thought I think some models look pretty good. Really mediocre main story with few annoying retcons. Undead Hordes and manlets as DLC. Switch to HOMM style combat. There is a lot of things that wrong with Disciples 3.
>>1799597>Switch to HOMM style combatIt's more Hammer of the Gods like.
>>1799597>manlets as DLCWait, what? There was the Mountain Clans DLC?
>>1799597Also there is nothing interesting on the map anymore. Transforming land is heavily restricted. The home town screen isn't as fin to look at anymore.Unnecessary bloated attribute system.
>>1799643Can't confirm or deny. Since never played it. But used of 3D camera for capital screen and unit animations is very reminiscent of HOMM V. Even if gameplay is not remotely close, games being 3 years apart doesn't help. >>1799720Apologies for confusion. There is no Clans DLC for the third game. It was planned. They even had some concept art for buildings and units. But it never happened. But picking elves over dwarfs was a huge mistake. Doubt clans would salvage anything. But at least they do feel like a proper faction. Meanwhile barely anything was done to elves. And they suffer from that because main advantage of shorter branches, doesn't work in this game.
>>1799950>But picking elves over dwarfs was a huge mistake.It would have make sense if they followed the story line of Rise of the elves but they just had to completely ignore the cliff hanger to do their own thing.
>>1763944>after the nerfWhat nerf?Weren't they always crap?
>>1800107They had 50% regeneration at first. The norm was 10% back then.
>>1800582Why did they do that?Weren't Infernal Knights already underwhelming enough?
>>1800582Which version are you talking about?I've just tested HP regen in Gallean's Return and Rise of the Elves by hitting a neutral squad for 150 spell damage, and skipping a turn.In GR it showed 5% regen for a normal unit, and 20% for Infernal Knight. Same result in RotE except for when it's on neutral terrain, then it's 15% and 30% respectively (since RotE added extra 10% regen on native land).
Since lore wise Galian is back, does that mean the whole Uther plot line is not canon, since the undead killed the boy right away?
>>1800759Because they were nerfing regen for every unit in the game. Probably to make Warrior Lord more appealing. Their main mistake was thinking that getting +150% daily HPs regen was not enough to pick it.Infernal Knights still have high regen (20%, as the anon below said) but it is no longer good enough to save them.>>1800847A version before Gallean's Return or either of the expansions that were mashed together to create it existed. It played very differently, with computer opponents actually simulating map awareness, memory of enemy activities and parties, this kind of stuff. Now computer opponents simply see the entire map and all party compositions at all time like with a cheat.
>>1800998I think all campaigns are canon to a certain degree. It's just actuall events of them branching in "what if" scenarios. I assume hordes, Clans and Empire 100% happened. But Legions have some stuff that don't add up.
>>1800998I might be wrong, but I think the Undead ganked Uther's ass when his seal got released, took his blood without properly checking if he was dead and fucked off. The little bastard then proceeded to stand up and walked off to continue subverting the Empire/Legions/both.
>>1800998I don't remember d2 campaigns as well as I'd like, but coming off of finishing d1 last week the canon in that game is fuzzy - in the campaign you get a magical rod in one of the ruins and in human campaign they destroy it, while in undead campaign they keep and use it (it's the same rid from the same ruins on the same map)
>>1798516I actually decided to test how AI wolf lords will behave against a mixed party.1. 3 WLs in front row vs ice/rock/hill giants: WL use AoE to kill off RG and HG, transform when only IG is left.2. 3 WL vs ice and rock giants only: WL immediately transform.3. 3 WL vs ice/rock/ice giants: they keep AoE form until they kill RG, and only then transform. Incredibly inefficient, but apparently AI takes into account only number of potential targets disregarding immunities, somehow.4. 6 WLs vs ice/rock/ice giants: this is the weirdest result by far. The front row behaves like in scenario #3, while the back row defends instead of preemptively transforming. When the front row is killed off, the back row keeps defending. Maybe something about being positioned in the back prevents WL from transforming, as normally the front row would prevent from using the melee attack.
>Boot up Disciples II for the very first time>Load up the first empire campaign mission>Burn in hellfireThey don't make 'em like they used to.That in mind, any general tips going forward in the game? This the kind of game where you want a lot of armies and varying commander types or is it best to stack all the XP on one guy?
>>1801842During campaign you want to powerlevel one hero, since you get to export them across missions, but it is much more convenient to have several stacks. While you still generally want to funnel XP into one overleveled doomstack, it is very convenient to have replacement units that you can swap around to heal, allowing you to do more fights per turn. It also helps to have extra heroes to guard cities, help chase down stragglers/rod planters, go shopping and all that stuff.
>>1801847Good to know. Combat seems pretty simple so far, does unit XP matter on the campaign missions where their upgrades are capped?Also went for Mage Lord, tons of magic seemed like a good idea.
>>1801848In D2 units continue to get experience and level up even after they reach their max upgrade path, so you can continue pumping exp into them, sometimes that extra health/damage is relevant.
>>1801850So far pegasus knight seems like the best leader just for being beefy and having unbroken movement over terrain. I'm sure my opinion on this will change over time.
>>1801862Flying is indeed extremely good in this game as the forest/water movement penalties are quite brutal. There are arguments for every hero class, all are viable. I personally tend to gravitate towards ranger classes due to high base movespeed and initiative. You also should always have a mage hero as a secondary (unless it is your main hero) as the ability to use scrolls and staves cannot be learned.
>>1801881Mage is my current main just because it's what I started with, squishy little fuck really fears archers though, I've already been getting a lot use out of the +initiative spell
>>1801842A very important tip is to not waste gold buying any items or spells in stores.Thieves cost 200 gold have a 60% steal rate which means they can steal 1.5 items on average before dying. Meaning by stealing you pay an average of 133 gold per item which is cheaper than even the cheapest items. Using stolen healing items to heal is also much cheaper than using the temple so don't build a temple either. It's also worth it to steal any high value you don't plan to use just so you can sell it back to the store as long as it sells for more than those 133 gold.
>>1801842All leaders have XP limits during most of each saga (all but last quest). So only fighting everything with one party ever is pointless, as you can't carry regular troops over into the next quest either.
>>1801983>Using stolen healing items to heal is also much cheaper than using the temple so don't build a temple either.Healing something with items requires them to be where the wounded creature is. Temple allows healing anything in any city you own, instantly.
>>1801984All campaign missions have level caps.>Mission 1 has a cap of level 3>Mission 2 has a cap of level 5>Mission 3 has a cap of level 7>Mission 4 has a cap of level 9>Mission 5 has a cap of level 11>Mission 6 has a cap of level 13>Mission 7 has a cap of level 15Then after that you can export the hero into the expansion campaigns where>Mission 1 has a cap of level 15>Mission 2 has a cap of level 15>Mission 3 has a cap of level 18You don't learn any new skills after level 15. It's hard to reach the level cap in the missions with time limits tough.
>>1801862>for being beefyHonestly, beef doesn't matter since after a few levels, feats and items all heroes take more punishment than your units, meaning the enemy won't bother attacking them; even if your wizard is in the first line
>>1801999If the enemy has melee troops, and your only first line unit is your 60 armor level 10 pegasus knight, they'll still gonna target him, admittedly without dealing much damage.
>>1801993>All campaign missions have level caps.I guess I've remembered wrong. Or perhaps this was changed in Gallean's Return / Gold / whatever it is called now.>It's hard to reach the level cap in the missions with time limits tough.You can always catch up in the following quest.
>>1802008>they'll still gonna target him, admittedly without dealing much damageWhich is a good thing.
>>1801999>meaning the enemy won't bother attacking them; even if your wizard is in the first linewell, akshuelly
>>1761048>Used to be 10% as a baseline and higher for some exceptional units, most notably Infernal Knight who had 50%. Only has 20% now.Is base regen rate for each unit in D2 documented somewhere? It's not mentioned in the wiki.
>>1803209The only ones I remember offhand are infernal knight and the neutral trollVery likely some campaign bosses too
>>1803209Red, White, Blue, Black, Green Dragon creatures and leaders 40Troll creature and leader 50Myzrael, Vithar, Ashkael, Ashgan (leader versions do not exist) 50Infernal Knight creature (leader does not exist) 20Demon Uther creature and leader 50Elf Queen creature and leader 50From Gold v2.02.But it's possible to alter most attributes of both leaders and creatures in quest and regeneration is one of them.
>>1803589Or rather creature versions of defenders (Myzrael, Vithar, Ashkael, Ashgan) do not exist. Bad copy&paste.
>>1803589>>1803575thanks
Is it generally agreed upon that Legions have the worst units in total?
>>1804269>>1804269>Is it generally agreed upon that Legions have the worst units in total?
>>1804269Clan has the worst units but the easiest campaign (no time-limit missions).
>>1801842>That in mind, any general tips going forward in the game? This the kind of game where you want a lot of armies and varying commander types or is it best to stack all the XP on one guy?The XP required to level up a unit increases dramatically almost exponentially with levels. It depends heavily only the type of enemies are facing as you clear the map but it is well worth to rotate your basic units and try to level them up. For example amount raw stats you get for XP when leveling two units from level one to 2 is usually greater than leveling a level 2 unit up to level 3 is usually greater. You also might not have the necessary upgrade building yet and if the unit is level Capped then the XP is wasted. Do not worry if you feel those units cannot help you in the final boss of the map they will be needed to garrison cities from the AI constantly sending low level troops and summon to take cities back. Use low level heroes as mules to hold and rotate your troops back to towns for regen, while you main does the battling.Level 1 units cost extremely little gold you should have no problems sacrificing them and just replacing them or rezzing them, rezzing them costs the same.There is "Unit locking" a situational but useful feature. Meaning you use the function where you lock a unit type and when leveling up will not change into a "higher tier" unit instead it remains the same unit permanently and continues to level up as it is. This means they will level at the same rate so a locked tier1 will always need the same XP to level up even if they are level 10. However in exchange their stat gain usually very weak in comparison and needs a lot of levels to catch up to the power of higher tier units. The other upside is that locked units still cost the same gold to rez regardless if it is level 1 or level 99 the unit tier determines the rez cost.
>>1804481>DoppelgangerPeople use them?>Gargoyles Could be good if they didn't use space ubit slots.Agree on the rest.
>>1804813NTA.>People use them?I used them to clone Uther. Very funny. Unfortunately enemy party composition is directly affecting doppelganger power. So it's a wild card of the unit. >Could be good The first stage that suck. But earth damage + mind ward means they can bully backline without any problems. Also Fiend + Onyx garg is much cheaper and easier to lvl compare to support line. It's kinda shame that Abyssal devil is almost always superior to Overlord/Tiamat. But that's another 3 strong units Legions have.
>>1804820>I used them to clone UtherHighly specific >earth damageOnly since rise of the elves, which brought a lot of necessary buffs/nerfs with it, I guess.>It's kinda shame that Abyssal devil is almost always superior to Overlord/Tiamat.One of my biggest beefs with Legions how shit the one thing ,the Leggions suppose to excel in, are.Overlord was pre elves inferior I everything compared to son of yimir despite the latter being on rank below and post rise they're the same strength, yet one is still far easier to level up.
>>1804813>People use them?Yes, they can mimic both friend and foe. They can have great utility, at worst case they can double up as another generic unit you have in your party.
>>1804829>They can have great utility, at worst case they can double up as another generic unit you have in your party.But they don't copy the level of the unit, so late game they will always be inferior
>>1804826Doppelganger is higly specific unit. Yes. I don't think there is something more insane compare to just shapeshifting in enemy high tier unit or Empire healer/Clans druidess. >Only since rise of the elvesYes. But there is only few earth wards and I think only two units in entire game outright immune to it. And both of them are summons. Even in just D2, 65 armour unit means that gargoyle takes less punishment and cheaper to heal. This is before you start buffing it with potion and banners. I think 2 leadership slots is fully justified here.>One of my biggest beefs with Legions how shit the one thing ,the Leggions suppose to excel inBig units? Maybe. I think Legions strength is speed and versatility. They don't have just strong X, but they have a lot of options in terms of playstyle and ways to cripple the enemy.
>>1804833>I think Legions strength is speed and versatility. They don't have just strong X, but they have a lot of options in terms of playstyle and ways to cripple the enemy.Really? I say they are the least versatile faction.They have so many two unit slots, that you are very limited selection of combis compared to other factions.
>>1804881>Really?The only downside is obviously archer taking up two slots and weak warrior branch. But you can always mix-match even if there is 0 reasons to do that. Depending on your opponent too. Well undead might be better at that actually. But mostly because Hordes so much better in general compare to every other faction. >you are very limited selection of combis compared to other factions I experimented a bit with some non-optimal party composition. I would say 6 leadership means everyone just play roughly the same. You just have harder time in early game. Since your archer is 2 slots.
>>1746910Played Disciples 1 a year ago for the first time, it's fucking nice. Don't believe the zoomer retards that tell you not to play it, "cuz old n shit".
>>1780290What are you playing games for, nigger retard? Good boy points? "Objective" journacuck review "criticism"? Or maybe, just fucking maybe, enjoyment?Fuck off with this "hurr durr i say 2 is better than 1, so don't play 1" bullshit, nigger zoomer retard.
>>1804904AI never retreats in D1 which already makes it better than D2.
>>1804481Fiends are nothing special because you can get a Gargoyle that has reach for the same amount of space. Poison is not great not terrible because it doesn't stack.
>>1804595They are weak when you don't have enough mana and/or gold and/or items for healing more often than other factions need to, usually.
>>1804805>You also might not have the necessary upgrade building yet and if the unit is level Capped then the XP is wasted.This was also added in a patch, by the way. Used to be once a creature reaches a current maximum (which had a minor bug for everything, like an Apprentice actually needed 74 XPs, not 75) that creature was not counted for the divisor so, for example, in a full party with 2 creatures at a cap the total value of enemy creatures was divided by 4, not 6.
>>1804813>Could be good if they didn't use space ubit slots.High initiative means a lot, and both Legions and Hordes have exactly zero spells boosting it.
>>1804830>But they don't copy the level of the unit,They don't copy extra levels you mean. A Doppleganger can turn into an Incubus, for example.
>>1804833Technically four are immune to Earth: two Clans summons and Drullia'an, creature and leader versions.
>>1804936>two clans summons Only one. Stone Ancestor. Golem is Empire summon. >Drullia'an My bad. I honestly straight up forgot and had to google the name.
>>1804935That's what I meant, which makes their own level completely irrelevant and they will be outclassed very soon. There is no reason to not invest into an Incubus or go for Madeus instead.
>>1804959Again, it is a utility unit. Please think of the early game too and to potentially clear the map faster. The game is not JUST about min-maxing one party for the final fight. Sure that is unavoidable but feeding just one party can make every map last forever.You can copy the support units of other factions like Empire healers which then allows you to stall a little an heal up the party before ending the fight for the next fight saving you time to regen. Or if one of your melee units die then your Doppel can switch to be a frontliner and copy one of your front liners or one of the enemies more beefy front-lines. Or copy a ghost and paralyze, copy an undead unit and become immune to death elemental attacks.It is just tier 3 unit that can achieve so much in the early mid game more before one gets to an incubus or the endgame's modeus. It also has an initiative of 80 so it can transform into something useful while a normal caster can be sniped before it can act. At worst it can help in rotation because it can switch its role from melee to caster and back. Granted that makes it a useless xp sponge so it kind of defeats the purpose of rotation but can help to take for wounded unit and heal vial leveling them up while the doppel can also level up and stay in the fighting.
>>1804930>Fiends are nothing specialSounds like you never used one. A level 30 Fiend (which is easily reached in the expansion campaigns thanks to the short exp bar) has a fucking 300 damage poison attack. Poison ignores armor this means it's possible to kill capitol guardians in two combat rounds.
>>1805002>Please think of the early game too and to potentially clear the map fasterThe problem is it locks your wizard tree at something that still will cripple you late game.Doppelganger highly depends on what you are fighting against potentially can be useless in fights if it ends up not having the exact role to fill.I still see it just as a gimmick unit and not as something that makes Legions excel over other factions.
Do you use alchemists over druids in normal games (i.e. outside of the Guardians campaign where units hit the damage cap on their own from leveling up)? Druids just seem to be so much more practical:>act first, so even if it dies, it's guaranteed to boost at least 1 unit>by the same rationale, it gives chance to kill a slow mob (like troll or ogre) before it gets a chance to attack>boost lasts the whole combat even after death >removes negative effects at the same timeSince childhood I've never understood what's the point of alchemist, it's just so much worse. Even if you compare it against druid, not archdruid, it still sucks.
>>1804949Wew, I had a big old brainfart. Yes, Golem is indeed Empire's.
>>1805014If you're going into level 30 territory it doesn't matter what you use. A level 30 Incubus is going to like 91% petrify the defender, 100% with the simplest potion. Before accuracy was capped at whatever it is now it could go all the way to 100% without talents or temporary buffs.
>>1805038Alchemist is nice if you want to apply something twice in the same, usually first turn often. Hermits are decent candidates but their base damage is low enough to make the other sub-branch much more attractive. Alchemists can be great for your main leader.
>>1805038It's not uncommon to reach damage cap through buffs and potions, so double attack will have more value overallArchdruidess buffing until the end of fight however means that you can just retreat with her and guarantee that your stack lives even if you somehow fumble it
>>1805027>The problem is it locks your wizard tree at something that still will cripple you late game.Seriously how would the lack of a slow, squishy and easy to snipe AOE unit literally "CRIPPLE" your late game? Also by basic logic if you did well in the early game your late game should be easier.If you are worried about not having the nuking potential of them odeus you have map spells that serve the exact same purpose of an AOE damage unless you have to assault a dungeon/town. Or get a caster hero? Go for AOE Demon tree? We could even argue about thieves doing the same thing although that is way less reliable.Maybe you are that much of a fan of the Incubus that you always use it? Which is fair it is a strong unit that makes trash fight everything way easier.>I still see it just as a gimmick unit and not as something that makes Legions excel over other factions.This is true it is not the best of the best, legions are about the "big monsters", but that doesn't mean doppel is useless, it is very useful.
>>1805174By the way wasn't there a mod that switched the Golem with the Titan?
>>1805359>legions are about the "big monsters"Which arw completely outclassed by the Mountain clan monsters.At least 2/3 of the support tree
>>1805245And she has Cure as a secondary attack so she removes things like paralysis or poison.>>1805361Haven't seen one but it should not be difficult to make.
>>1805361This game has mods?
>>1805520>>And she has Cure as a secondary attack so she removes things like paralysis or poison.Which is amazing and horribly underrated!
>>1805538https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gOS9mLcapRY
>>1805658>alternative modwill this mod help me get an alternative girlfriend?
>mfw the latest version of the norvezskaya smegma modshit changed so much from the 1.3.3 version, regular units have passives that affect your hero now, shit's crazy
>>1806622High tier mages giving hero ability to use scrolls and talismans is pretty neat idea. Also new targeting completely change how some units play. Although I'm not so sure about anything else the update brought.
>Empire 5Jesus Christ they're coming out of the wallsh e l p
>>1808475if you place an army where the zombie is you will block the only way out and the script will break. The enemies will still spawn but they will just stand there.
>>1808660Well that's a neat trick. I finally beat the stage by going double aoe healer and three knights with my starting Archmage, rushing over to the elves and escorting them back to my capital. That let me take my time with the rest.
>>1808475A slightly worse advice than what >>1808660 said, but you can also neutralize the Undead AI completely by just conquering their Capitol, which is quite doable as long as you got the Soul Crystal artifact from Mission 3 and a sufficient amount of Treebark/Protection Potions.
>>1808809I sadly missed the Soul Crystal. The time limit warning popped up and I saw the big bad walk right by me so I killed him and had to catch up 4 levels on the next mission.
>>1808824I'd warmly recommend you replay M3 just to get the artifact - it is one of the strongest artifacts in the game due to its ability to paralyze any unit (including the Capitol Guardians) for 1 turn. That will allow you to reliably conquer any Capitol from M4 onwards (picrel is Capitol combat that you can do in M4). Sure, this isn't really necessary as you can complete all missions regularly, but why not be OP if the game lets you be?
>>1808475Had to apparently not so quickly reach the quest from the beginning of the saga because I didn't even remember what's the big deal. I used to re-play Legions and Hordes much more.This is the second mission in Empire's saga where you learn in no uncertain terms that Empire's hirelings are trash for garrisoning. Titans are okay but merely just, they do not compare whatsoever to Gargoyles in an L5 town or even to Yetis. Even 2 Wyverns are preferable, and naturally Hordes have much better options anyway.From what I remember, I used to have a secondary hero stationed there after rushing the town to L5. Don't forget that attacking takes half a turn's worth of movement points from a leader so abuse summons and theives. Even freshly hired leaders if gold is abundant.And yes, Elves help a great deal.
