>>41133125
>Learn Chinese
you will fail
>graduate college
easy
>Go to China and find a Daoist Priest
easy
>Become a disciple
see #1

>>41133125
Well I skimmed your post and just please note Crowley was a Taoist and he made a whole Western Hermetic magickal system, including the Thesis that Illuminati knowledge should be disseminated to the public, just like I am doing. It is actually the fruit of Napoleon's Conquest. Start with the Book of Thoth

>>41133125
>white magic, grey magic, learning offensive magic, and protective magic (countering spells)
Sounds like you want to play D&D rather than follow any mystical path.

>>41133155
I believe Magic is a science that can be understood by knowing all of its uses. Offensive should obviously be used with extreme discretion, given its karmic implications, but knowing how to do it and how it works is an important insight to have in the art of becoming a priest.

>>41133172
Everything is science which has repeatable outcomes or effects or can be analysed with scientific approach. And can be studied part by part...

>>41133125
Magic is wholly scientific and banishing evil entities can be done in multiple logical ways. Western and Eastern magic are the same, just the West lies to anyone not initiated and they don't know it's all groundwork for daoist-like stuff.

>>41133125
Book of Clouds by alawiteanon has some very powerful rituals

>>41133125
I wish it was as easy as asking on 4chan too, but you and I both know you won't get an answer here. At best you'll get some hints in random threads you browse that interest you and you ask for some sources, and from there it's just an endless task of trial and error until you find something that works, add it to the puzzle box as a single piece, and hope that as you collect more pieces over time you can eventually complete the puzzle.

Actually it's worse than just getting nothing, you need to understand that places like this have misinformation and misdirection purposefully spread to derail you from your path, make you waste time, demotivate you, etc.

As much as I always wanted this to be a "group project" and I would find a group of like minded people with knowledge that could help me and we could help eachother. This whole "pursuit of occult knowledge and power" thing is 100% without a doubt a loner's path, you aren't going to get any real help, any real groups that exist will see you as useless and never invite you to begin with, and most of the people you encounter and get your hopes up around will be lacking in knowledge like you, or worse, a larp (who is having fun "playing along" with you and getting off on the fact that you are serious) or mentally ill person (you can't even help the fact that they can't contribute).

The more time you spend on this path, the more depressing it becomes, and the only thing that will keep you going is the tiny tiny bit of progress you make over time, hoping that there's a light at the end of the tunnel where you get the abilities that allow you to "make up for lost time".

All you really need is just one, one useful "minor" ability that gives you some undeniable advantage in society, and it would all be worth it, and you could make up for lost time. And I'm not talking about delusional law of attraction nonsense.

But it will take years (even decades) before you reach that point (if you ever get there).

>>41133125
Just close your fucking mind FFS

daozang com /downloads /daozang htm

There u go u massive faggot. use chatgpt screenshots to translate the pdfs.


let me tell you this fren

theres no magic in dao

the whole point of dao is facing reality as plainly as it is

stop being a filter through which reality breaks

you have to let life live through you

thoughtless

and turns out thats just the beginning

you will NEVER be an invisble sage on a mountain that lives a 1000 years

there are talismans though. good luck.

>>41133125
You learn serious magic by going into the spirit world and learning it there.

>>41136600
I'm not OP, and I don't agree with your statement that "there's no magic in dao", but I will admit that your post may have been the most useful one so far (never even heard of this website or ever seen it posted).

>>41133125
Are you here OP?

How about you try out Carlos Castaneda's Olmec sorcery first?

The r/castaneda community has former students practitioners, but they argue that ALL Eastern religions and philosophies (and all religions in general) are scams and frauds.

>>41136667
At this point I'm thinking OP is at work right now, and his work starts early, because he hasn't posted all day.

I'll just bump if I see the thread getting too low on the catalog, especially after that daozang site post, maybe something interest will happen if this thread lasts a week or so.

Do you know of anything from Castaneda that can be tested in a "timely fashion" (like 2 to 3 weeks of attempts/training to get an undeniable result), because at face value, his stuff doesn't really look legit (that magical passes stuff just look so gimmicky), I could easily be wrong, but it just looks kinda fake.

>>41136749
>Do you know of anything from Castaneda that can be tested in a "timely fashion" (like 2 to 3 weeks of attempts/training to get an undeniable result)

From what I've gathered, this here may be a legit entry point into the practice
>r/castaneda/comments/aki0db/how_to_see_energy_in_3_weeks/
But in the post, it says though that it's recommended for you to have practiced some recapitulation and "dreaming" (whatever they mean by this) prior to the 3 week experiment, in order to have already "shut off your internal dialogue".
You'll also need to buy aluminum foil and painters blue tape to cover LED electronics and literally window edges (?), so that your entire room is pitch dark. All this you can read in that post.

>because at face value, his stuff doesn't really look legit (that magical passes stuff just look so gimmicky), I could easily be wrong, but it just looks kinda fake.
I get you, anon, I also think the same! This Castaneda cult with their gay tensegrity dancings seems to be fishy to me too. And that boomer Daniel Lawton who attacks Eastern religions, especially Buddhism, and calls literally any other existing sorcery and religion fake, because they were all invented after the age of agriculture and are apparently just for making money;
Castanedoids seem to have the most irrational worldview, they themselves say that there's nothing deep or profound in their magic, that there's no higher theology in it, that it's literally a form of technology.

Yeah, I myself don't know if I should believe them, and this man Dan Lawton. He seems to be serious with his takes, but it still sounds all ridiculous to me. They do put in lots of effort in their work and make good videos though.

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>>41133138
Yah I call b.s. because why didn't Napoleon raid the Vatican archives

>>41136667
OP asks for
>true, 'serious' magic
And you suggest a known fiction writer?
Lmao.
And you want to trust a Reddit community dedicated to this novel writer telling you other stuff are lies?
Oh god. My sides, they are in orbit,
>>41136749
It is 100% fake, don’t bother,

>>41136667
>argue that ALL Eastern religions and philosophies (and all religions in general) are scams and frauds

This I just do not believe. Eastern philosophy has explained many things that western science has not explained thoroughly. For example, in Traditional Chinese Medicine it goes over Qi, Blood (hue), jing(essence).

Furthermore, essence manifests itself in the hair, libido, the brain, and the bone marrow. Essence is also stored in the kidneys and slowly is used up throughout your lifetime until death occurs.

On the page it states that sorcery is:
>the mastery of intent

This isn't what sorcery really is.Sorcery is usually invoking a higher level being(deity) to cause a change in some way. In daoist magic, this is usually done using talismans.

From my readings in Daoist Magic, it seems that most magical exorcisms occur with the use of some sort of talisman; that is to say, to perform an exorcism it requires the use of 'heavenly magic.' This also implies that 'self-exorcisms' are not possible, and from my experience, you cannot simply 'command' some spirits to leave.

If you are a magician/priest, threatening the spirit becomes a possibility, as you have the power to invoke a being to banish the spirit entity.

I have also read that there exists types of warrior spirits that carry swords, that literally slash at demons if invoked for the right reason. The incantations to invoke these spirits are hidden and only known by I assume higher level priests in some type of lineage.

Also, there's the magical skill of trapping evil entities in bottles: This I haven't found any deep documentation on as of now.

But I still appreciate your insight. I have read some of Castenda's writings in high school.

>>41137074
>It is 100% fake, don’t bother,
I've been looking at it for a while and every time I think to try it I read a bit through the books, and I'm really not seeing anything "actionable" that can be tested and observed in an undeniable way. It somewhat reminds me of the "law of attraction" stuff which is set up in a way which it's "unfalsifiable" and you can just keep gaslighting yourself with "maybe I didn't do it right", and I avoid all things like that because they will likely just end up being time wasters.

Now if you would recommend some things that are the exact opposite of that, what would they be?

>>41137000
>I get you, anon, I also think the same! This Castaneda cult with their gay tensegrity dancings seems to be fishy to me too.
Never trusted it, but I always see it getting recommended, and everytime I take a second look to convince myself, I just go "nope, still looks like nonsense" lol.

>>41135266
True. From all my time online, forums, etc. I haven't found deep scientific documentation regarding matters such as talismans, the art of exorcism, the science of curses: producing them and countering them, types of spiritual entities, and etc.

For example, most 'western magic' is now filled with new age like ideas, law of attraction, which are void of things like sorcery, and banishing evil spirits effectively.

On the other side of the aisle is mainstream religion, which is too traditional which limits its information on truly esoteric topics.

Catholicism has 'exorcism' but only in a loose understanding. They reject the notion of Qi, magical talismans, etc. Catholic mass is just a repetition over and over again ad infinitum.

>>41137169
The closest I've come to a practice that looks legit that I want to stick to, is Initiation Into Hermetics by Franz Bardon. But I hit a wall at the beginning and pretty much every other thing I'm researching and practicing right now is about getting over that wall. Basically there is an exercise in Step 1 of the training and you can't move on until you've mastered it, and it is annoyingly difficult and I'm not really seeing any progress. The exercise is basically "Dharana" training. You have to concentrate on a single thought/concept for 10 minutes without any mental interruptions (no random sounds or inner monologue, no random visualizations popping in your mind, etc.). I can barely make it to 1 minute on some days and I can't seem to get past the 1 minute mark, I am not even seeing incremental progress, I've gotten so paranoid I've started to believe there's some kind of "block" (psychological or otherwise) that is preventing my progress (or somebody cursed me or some shit, hopefully not).

Initiation Into Hermetics (IIH) is the best occult training I have ever come across, because every single thing you train can be tested in an objective way, the author treats magic as if it is a science. I have searched for years to find an alternative and I haven't found anything that comes close.

So I'm always looking for other practical things to train. If there is anything else you would recommend that also takes an objective approach like IIH (or something that might help resolve blocks, or something that might help training Dharana) please mention them.

>most 'western magic' is now filled with new age like ideas, law of attraction, which are void of things like sorcery, and banishing evil spirits effectively.
Yeah, this was and has always been my frustration with Western magic, it's like some psyop was started to dumb it down and misdirect people. I would like to find an effective qi gong/nei gong method to practice, something Eastern.

>>41137106
Dan Lawton lives with a real-life witch (Cholita) who terrorizes him every day.

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>>41133125
Spell casting is often done completely wrong and this gives people the idea that magic doesn't work.
Even the simplest things can screw up a spell.
>example; light a candle to get X to happen
What is the candle made from? Why does it matter? How was it gathered? Who gathered it? When?
What is the wick of the candle made from? Why does it matter? How was it gathered. Who gathered it? When?
How did you light the candle? Why does it matter?
>
Screw up any one of these and it doesn't work.
>
Once you figure out these things, you will be on the correct path.

>>41137057
Napoleon took scholars to Egypt with him. This is when the Rosetta Stone was found. The logic disseminated from the Ancient Egyptians and the Theosophists broke off from the Catholic Church. The Golden Dawn picked up on Napoleon's hint and Crowley believed in transmitting initiatory knowledge to the Mass. Meanwhile the USSS gatekeeps esoteric knowledge and all you hear about is astral projection and semen retention. Part of the project of the Nobody is to end this gatekeeping of Egyptian mystical wisdom. I only know about it because I accidentally aggrod the Secret Service. I also learned something about the Veil of Isis from the CIA, which allows me to look at porn virtuously.

>>41133125
>From what I have seen, most Daoist magic falls under sorcery i.e the use of spiritual powers offered by deities.
if you are still using categories like this you learned on the internet you're not gonna make it
keep researching kid

>>41138056
No point in responding like this and not stating and specific clear knowledge or path, just comes off as larping or trolling.

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>>41133125
>want to learn real magic?
nope, only faggots do magic.

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>>41133125
You may be able to learn magic from the higher self (I know for a fact there absolutely is a higher self)

First things first, one needs the proper mindset to get into magic
Getting into the proper mindset can be called initiation.
-Don't give your power away, everything in your reality is actually a projection of yourself. Yes there are others but you're creating your versions of them in your reality and they are subject to your configuration (beliefs are important here)
-Cultivate the proper beliefs, magic is possible and you can do it, yes even shooting fireballs and other magic in stories/movies/games
-Due to being a part of the physical Earth and being in this time frame, you have been conditioned and have formed a sort of a contract to experience magic being hidden and or difficult to achieve, this can change and if you're able to read this then you're on the line toward manifestation of the magic you are interested in
-The higher self knows magic and you are interested in magic because it is in your interest which is in line with what the higher self has conceived, it wishes you to be interested in magic

All of that said, learn to open up to the higher self, do sessions and ask it things you wish to know
I have done this and gotten quite compelling answers, but you must find your own answers for best results

What do you wish to accomplish by doing magic?

>>41133125
daoist?
why don't you just get enlightened then
but if you get enlightened
you'll throw all of the silly magick away

bump

>>41133138
crowley was a narcissistic homosexual drug addict who inherited his fortune from his parents and worked for british intelligence. he only delved into the occult because it was hip at the time. he squandered his fortune and died broke and in agony

>>41139007
>What do you wish to accomplish by doing magic?
This is important, some anons want to achieve things that don't require magic.
What happens is that the present doesn't exist, we live in the past of some future moment, when it happens, it'll have created a past on the fly that justifies what is experienced at that point, when you achieve something, that past that is created to justify it will be the one with the least resistance, and that one may not involve magic, just a bunch of unlikely coincidences that led to it (from our perspective, in reality, the other "likely things" couldn't have happened because they didn't lead to the future being experienced.)
Magic will only work if it's required to justify that future (if the resistance is so high the only way to get there is with magic), but the point is we can get to that future, with or without magic, and it's easier without magic, unless it's an outstanding future that can't happen by itself with a series of coincidences.
That's why people say we're not real, we're just justifying some future that isn't real either because it's just justifying some other future.

>>41139868
john dee also died in poverty after being important in queen elizabeths court

>>41133125
So Chūnibyō general, then?

>>41133125
OP what is your ethnicity?

what happens if i make a spell where i want a beautiful young women with a huge ass and big tits to sit on my face and headscissor me whenever i wish, what would be the drawback

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>>41133125
>Where to learn 'serious' magic?
You don't. Not now, not in this place. Any other questions? =)

>>41140060
>what would be the drawback
the need for oxygen and the general requirement of having a frictionless existence.

>>41139868
forgot to add he was a charlatan

>>41139935
Bruh, that's often this whole board and site

>>41133125
>just find a teacher and learn nagpo bro.

>>41133125
Learn true western magick here: Templeofzeus.org.

>>41137128
Go with the classics then,
Ignore the castenada larping and go with some of the golden dawn stuff.
Now it may also be a larp. But they were at least trying to be serious. Try the lesser banishing and invoking rituals of the pentagram for a while and if it doesn’t work then move on.

you’re wrong about catholicism bro. if you go to rome and meet high ranking nuns and priests, you’ll easily be able to find mystics and all kinds of types involved with the occult. many of them study Kabbalah and hermeticism or know professional magicians personally that they could connect you with. I do agree that the way it’s taught in the west isn’t great, but I think this has to do with the history of practitioners having to hide their practices due to persecution, to the point where even today the more serious occultic groups aren’t public

>>41133125
What you're asking is how you, a 1 dimensional being in a 1 dimensional world can possible gain extra dimensions. You can't and you never will, because you're failing to understand that you were never a 1D being in a 1D world in the first place. Taoist shit falls into the same trap, because they think they have X form and exist in X place and need to ascend, and when they do it's just X+1 in X+1 place and they're in the same fucking trap all over again.

>>41137074
Well, r/castaneda is run by former students, and they do explain why Carlos wasn't a liar all the time

>>41137227
Yeah jews and Catholics have used each other as controlled opposition to control what "magic" the plebs are allowed to learn this is very much a reason people are warned against the older western schools like freemasons you'll lose a lot more than your soul long before they even start giving you stuff let alone the good shit.

As for the new age assuming glowies stayed out of it would be foolishly naive but much of it is just the low hanging fruit of the spiritual path its mostly poorly understood eastern stuff as like you said most of the wests shits simply just crap at this point.

For meditation Buddhist techniques are the best curriculum out there "stopping and seeing" is the recommended intro text into Buddhist meditation and "the fire kasina" is a western written book by a guy with great success with those techniques so should be able to parse out what your looking for between them if you can read between the lines.

As one of the few guys on here who is actually critically examining this stuff and doing the work let me drop the vauge posting and give you something

Pick up grounding it fills in a lot of the underlying theory the Chinese let rot out of taoism specifically what gunk in the channels all the cultivation stuff is telling you to get rid of

>>41139905
Please don't compare John Dee to Aleister Crowley, one was a genius who could do practically everything and that's why the Queen valued him, the other wasted whatever talents he actually had.

>Pick up grounding it fills in a lot of the underlying theory the Chinese let rot out of taoism specifically what gunk in the channels all the cultivation stuff is telling you to get rid of
I'll look into it.

You know there's another interesting thread going on right now on the forum, you should check it out if you haven't already - >>41101884

Another thing that seems possibly worth testing (just on the aspect of clearing blocks, though this might more be psychological blocks via a psychosomatic process).

These past few days there have actually been some good threads on /x/

>>41141818
Forgot to link you here: >>41141935

bumping

>>41138077
because the definition used in the op smacks of someone who learned their magical classifications from a geocities website back in the day. it reflects a mindset that lacks discernment such that they wouldnt recognize real knowledge if it slapped them in the face

For example, I could say "get some books by Damo Mitchell" or "Jerry Alan Johnson" since the OP posted a pic related to Daoism

But then people will whine "that's not magic, that's Qigong" or "that's not magic, that's Chinese medicine" and they won't actually do the practice to get to a point where it's real for them.

the op also talks about "science" so will no doubt ask or "proof" that qi and spirits are "real" so they can show others and the conversation will circle the drain as it has many times before

>>41141818
>Pick up grounding it fills in a lot of the underlying theory the Chinese let rot out of taoism specifically what gunk in the channels all the cultivation stuff is telling you to get rid of
And more specifically get "Opening the Energy Gates of Your Body" by B.K. Frantzis which teaches a downward dissolving process to sink and dissolve stagnant energy and balance out any upward currents you are dealing with.

>>41143385
>the op also talks about "science" so will no doubt ask or "proof" that qi and spirits are "real"
No, they'll ask for a method that can be objectively tested and observed, that allows them to prove it to themselves. I don't see that as a "crazy ask", that's what I also ask for when it comes to these things. Anybody peddling a "blind faith" method of "do this thing for 6 months and MAYBE something will happen" is someone I don't want to listen to and I will call BS and assume they don't actually know anything (probably a larp or some delusional/mentally ill person that has confused mental hallucinations they've experienced as proof). If the method cannot be objectively tested and observed it is utterly useless.

>>41143385
>But then people will whine "that's not magic, that's Qigong" or "that's not magic, that's Chinese medicine" and they won't actually do the practice to get to a point where it's real for them.
Honestly one of the best posts in this thread (as I've already said) was the guy who linked to the Daozang here: >>41136600 (with the note to use AI to translate it).

If I would spend time attempting a "more subjective" method, it would only be something very old and close to the source, and those texts fit that definition. But sorry, I am not going to spend months doing a practice from modern authors like Damo Mitchell or Jerry Alan Johnson on the hopes that "maybe something will happen". There are much simpler and immediately effective things one can test and experience themselves that increase your understanding and awareness of things.

People are not looking for a large encompassing practice to dedicate their entire belief and will to without any introductory method to test that proves it's worth. People are looking for a quick initial/introductory method that they can test in a manner of weeks and experience it working, and THEN they'll be willing to invest the time and effort.

>>41133125
as you have been able to tell, the quickest way to obtain such powers is to compromise yourself and borrow from the power of those who came before you
but that power isnt yours
one thing people always forget,
the mage with no internal power is impotent
if you dont cultivate your own, you are borrowing
everything in the universe is an energy exchange
that will have to balance out in some way, when you have borrowed
so you're faced with a choice
a long slow road of cultivating your own power, which will be too weak to do much for quite a while
or you serve another and owe for what you borrow
which will you choose?

>>41143819
>a long slow road of cultivating your own power, which will be too weak to do much for quite a while
What is/are the method(s) for that?

>>41143858
lots of sitting, lots of standing
achieve stillness+ very long breaths
horse stance and other standing practices
you'll need to open the laogung and arm channels to express it decently

>>41144085
That wasn't really a method but It's my fault for not being specific enough, what I meant was the actual "path of study" (the outline of the specific methods).

The name of the practice and the lineage it's from, the books/authors/masters associated with it, etc.

Now if you learned all of this as an official student at a martial arts school then at best all you can do is give the name and the lineage as you wouldn't really need to learn from books.

>>41143567
yeah i think i know who you are.

anyway, since this thread isnt explicitly related to taoism, I will also recommend books by Franz Bardon. Initiation Into Hermetics (first book) is explicitly centered around self initiation. It's light on theory compared to other books, but heavy on practice and he has a multi layered, multi step process.

Bardon feels somewhat underrated whenever these topics come up and I've never been quite sure why

>>41144429
>since this thread isnt explicitly related to taoism
I mean, from reading the OP it kinda is, it's literally what OP is looking for.

But let's just wait for OP to ask, maybe he'll get a different answer based on what he asks for.

>>41144621
>I mean, from reading the OP it kinda is, it's literally what OP is looking for.
I mean, from reading the OP it kinda literally said
>Where to learn 'serious' magic
the taoist stuff only came up because of his massive assumption of western magic and general lack of knowledge
People up thread are talking Castaneda who is definitely not taoist lmao

bump

>>41144210
the emergence of siddhis will somewhat depend on the practices undertaken
there's many paths
I gave you a core sample of foundational methods that accomplish the goal
the thing is, its often said that the master will appear when the student is ready
so cultivate the fundamentals until such time
its going to take a while and you can expect it to be a life's work
these fundamentals really are are simple as I mentioned, and diligent application of them is what gives results

bump

BUMP

>>41133125
start with a book called Cyclomancy by frank r Young all magic is mental

>>41148029
Do you know of any other book like this (other than Initiation Into Hermetics). Step by Step methodical training you can test and experience in real time?

Bump

>>41149637
the problem with wanting everything so explicitly laid out is that progress is entirely dependent upon the practitioner, making timeframes so loose so as to be either meaningless or a complete letdown
I know of a guy who stuck really hard to the 3 months, etc,...9 years of facing the wall and treated them as hard and fast times that could be relied upon
he got to the end of his 9 years facing the wall, and...nothing...couldnt figure out what he did wrong, felt like he wasted his time
but that's a caveat of going it alone

>>41150179
>the problem with wanting everything so explicitly laid out is that progress is entirely dependent upon the practitioner
That's not a problem, averages still exist, and having an estimated timeline let's you know what you have talent for and what you don't, so it's not a problem, it's actually a great help, it's actually a solution to a problem, that problem being "wasted time and effort"

>I know of a guy who stuck really hard to the 3 months, etc,...9 years of facing the wall
He should have already moved onto other practices by month 2, would have likely found something that was better suited to his abilities. You can't force a square peg into a round hole.

>felt like he wasted his time
He did. One thing I always talk about when it comes to people trying to attain supernatural abilities is that many people get caught up in the "sunk cost fallacy" and they end up joining the "sunk cost club" (SCC).

Sunk-Cost Fallacy - "The phenomenon whereby a person is reluctant to abandon a strategy or course of action because they have invested heavily in it, even when it is clear that abandonment would be more beneficial."

This is why when someone gives nothing but vague cliche responses that mean nothing and/or everything at the same time (extremely open to interpretation and multiple paths), like a politician, I know that their advice isn't worth anything, because there's a very high chance it will just send me on a wild goose chase that leads to me becoming a member of the SCC, and I refuse to do that.

If something can't be objectively tested don't practice it
If your progress can't be objectively measured don't practice it
If everything about the practice is subjective and open to interpretation don't practice it

Doing otherwise is how you end up spending years on a practice with no progress, but desperately patting yourself on the back for your efforts.

Reality doesn't reward effort, it rewards talent and capability.

You are comically bad at research, "ether" is not nor has it ever been the only energetic system in the west. Large segments of modern western occultism was either historically taught at the old catholic proto-universities or like the grimoire tradition was written by and for an audience of ordained clergy. That's without even touching on your naive belief that legitimate chinese systems aren't wrapped in secrecy and ethnonationalism of their own.

>>41133125
Western magic works well if you actually give it time and patience

>>41139868
He lived his last years in a pretty nice retirement home actually, one that encouraged intellectual chat, though I think he developed dementia or something like that in his last years (I mean he got off really well for someone who was a hard heroin addict). He was well taken care off by people who cared for him, and he was visited by thelemites from around the world. In his last days he pretty much practiced Daoism.

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>>41150346

you want fast results take psychedelics and try to grab hold of the dragon and see if you can control the exact moment the OBE starts and you lift up see if you can travel at will during this moment

I am a member of a satanist coven, I'll teach you one black magic spell because I feel bad for you and wizards gotta help each other.
Goal:
This spell is for making people feel ill or extremely tired, exhausted mentally and physically
Location:
A place where the plants can grow, your garden for example
Time: at night
Ingredients: one basil plant, a big glass or crystal ampoule filled with water (it can be ceremonial or simple doesn't matter), a piece of paper, a pen.
Instructions:
1. After performing a black mass, wait for the night and go to your garden
2.There, write the name of the spell's target on the piece of paper
3. Dig a hole in your garden and put the piece of paper in the hole
4. Plant the basil on the piece of paper and do the remaining gardening procedures
5. Take the ampoule filled with water and open it, recite this sentence: "may your energies be suppressed by the dark forces like the seeds of the other plants are suppressed by the basil's roots"
6. Spit in the ampoule
7. Pour the water+saliva on the basil
8. Make sure the basil plant stays healthy and grows, so that the piece of paper with the name gets more and more suffocated by the roots of the plant

you can do this all alone or invite people to act as deacons to assist you or simply spectate the ceremony, as long as they attend the black mass before.

>>41150275
what is your nickname for people who ask for advice but never actually do any of the practices given because none of them live up to your standards so you wind up doing nothing

>>41150596
>what is your nickname for people who ask for advice but never actually do any of the practices given because none of them live up to your standards so you wind up doing nothing
I don't have a nickname for that, never saw such a poster, one guy I saw speaking like that actually said he did find a few practices and is currently practicing something that works, and his standards is to filter out BS and not waste time.

What's your nickname for people that make strawman arguments and have low standards period, so they just practice whatever, and those low standards lead to self delusion so they convince themselves that almost anything that "happens" is proof it works despite no demonstrable real world application to their believed abilities? (you know, like the Law Of Attraction retards that say they "manifested" their favorite bread at their local grocery and stuff, that level of coping and self delusion from low standards?)

>>41141595
I agree that most magic is done through some type of lineage and or is done through climbing the ranks. But from my finding of catholicism, it mainly rejects the idea of Magic and considers it a sin.

For example, witchcraft is broadly condemned, Qi is thought to be a fabrication; catholic mass seems to be more cultural than not, despite any supernatural occurrences.

>>41144085
>>41144210
Magic is not done by 'sitting' and 'waiting' for hings to happen.

For example, if you wished to perform the ritual of exorcism, this is not done by just 'sitting' or 'waiting' for things to happen.

For example, in Daoism, you first have to be part of an official lineage. When you are ordained, it is a considered a 'spiritual pact with heaven,' which gives you the spiritual authority to perform exorcisms. Likewise, talismans, incantations, magical rituals, tools, etc have dependence upon this initial pact you made with heaven.

So 'sitting', qigong, will NOT give you magical powers alone. I think you will have to be ordained and seek a powerful mentor to make any progress.

>>41148029
All magic is NOT mental. There exists a higher order of beings, angels, demons, different spirits of many kinds(nature spirits, water spirits), spirit guardians, et cetera.

This is a truth that is often not taught in western magic and is masked broadly by 'sigils, LOA, LBRP.'

The LBRP is also very dangerous because it opens a spiritual portal and lets spirits 'cross over.' I have done this ritual before and I felt spiritual portal open and a lower level spirit entity did attach itself to my energy field, but it was lower-level. Some of them left when I started praying daily for some reason.

>>41150275
>He should have already moved onto other practices by month 2
oh jeez, this guy again
neeeeeeeeext

>>41150679
>magic can be done without prerequisite
>or heaps of assistance from outside
all I'm saying is if you're going to do it the proper way, with your own potential, its going to take time to build your own potential
the lazy way is to outsource the potential and hope payback is going to be remotely palatable

>>41150712
>oh jeez, this guy again
>neeeeeeeeext
Lol, you're right, I guess that guy was smart to waste 9 years of his life instead lmao. That guy is Exhibit A of my point, any anyone who wants to follow in his footsteps is free to do so lol.

>>41150728
You have to understand that there's a lot of wisdom that will not be discovered if you try to do everything 'alone.'

Meditation is good, Qigong is good, but magical power is often knowledge that will be handed down from others. I believe if you try to do this alone, you will eventually hit a wall and lack any powers to begin with.

For example, consider the idea of the 'talisman.' This is simply a spiritual invocation to a spiritual being via the method of writing. This is NOT done alone, but with the help of some divine creature. Likewise, from all my attempts at self-exorcism:

>Tried commanding the spirit
>Tried western magic at it(LBRP, Banishing rituals)

The most progress I made to banish spirits that were attached to my energy field was prayer. I noticed that whenever I prayed, I felt a liquid sensation manifest itself in my body; a liquid that had volume, cold to the touch, and activated whenever I prayed or spoke.

I had noticed that in Daoism this liquid is called 'Divine light,' which is a healing agent and improves your Qi. I did notice that prayer gave me more energy, allowed me to sleep better, and sometimes gave me more clairvoyancy.

I assume spirits dislike whatever this liquid is, explaining why some of them left shortly after I began praying.

My effective attempts were NOT done by just meditation, sitting, or focussing heavily on thoughts. Although some magical skills may be improved through daily practice, you are avoiding the main idea of magic through lineage and/or sorcery(the use of deities to perform rituals).

Let me ask you a question, do you believe the heavenly realm is real? Do you then believe that heavenly magic is possible if it is real?

If it is real, the possibility of heavenly magic exists, which should be considered beyond 'self-done magic.'

>>41150679
>ordained
>spiritual pact with heaven
>spiritual authority
>pact
Just sounds like you are speaking about a type of magic, but it isn't the only type/path.

Also, paths like this always sound more to me like "power by proxy" than you actually attaining power of your own. It's like having a false sense of security and feeling "rich" because you took a loan from a bank. It's not really your money and you have to pay it back with interest.

For example, I'd much rather be able to move 5 grams via telekinesis on my own and that be my lifetime limit, than to be able to move 5000 grams but only if I worship/serve some entity and they can disable that ability whenever they choose if they don't sanction my thoughts or actions.

If the power isn't truly yours to wield, then it's not actually power, you'd just be a glorified servant.

Imagine if you owned a gun that when you touch it, it reads your mind, and the trigger only works if you "have the right thoughts" and it will only accept ammo from the company that produces the gun lol.

Is that really "your" gun and would you really want to own a gun like that?

If I believed that magic only worked in the framework you just described I wouldn't bother. It just sounds like "religion with extra effort", I could skip all the time, effort, trial & error, and just join one of the dominant religions and call it day. If I'm just going to ultimately be some servant to some "higher being" anyways why even put in the extra effort (ego?, pride?, feeling special?, false sense of power?, doesn't seem worth it to me).

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>>41133125
When I was reading up on schools of onmyoudou recursively searching kanji for new terms or authors that came up helped me find primary sources, the same is likely true for daoist schools of magic like fu jyeo when using hanzi

>>41150804
From my findings and dealings with spiritual entities, it seems that some power is not done 'alone' but has to involve the invocation of heaven. Have you tried performing an exorcism with just 'your power?' This will obviously lead you no where. This alone gives some merit to the idea of making a relationship with heaven through some ordination; it seems they(heaven) have some authority and humans have the ability to connect with them.

Likewise, in Daoism, there exists weather magic, which is the ability to influence the patterns of the weather through a ritual. Could you move a cloud alone?

>just join one of the dominant religions

Religion has often been distorted through cultural influences, has been dampened by the lack of knowledge, and seems to be a consistently reoccurring wheel of inaction and ignorance.

>Also, paths like this always sound more to me like "power by proxy" than you actually attaining power of your own

You have to understand that there is spiritual hierarchy, some rituals fall under 'heavenly magic,' some do not require such a relationship. Likewise, there are things that humans cannot just do 'alone.' but require the help of some divine power. There's a reason why I keep mentioning the use of being true to heaven: It is real and it will improve your magical abilities and will allow you to banish spirits via ritual.

Not everything needs the power of some spiritual being, but its an important part to becoming an effective priest.

You have to understand there is a wide spiritual world filled with many types of spirits, think of it like animals and how many different types of animals there are. Including this is the heavenly realm, which should be studied rigorously.

>>41150884
>From my findings and dealings with spiritual entities, it seems that some power is not done 'alone' but has to involve the invocation of heaven.
I'm sure that's true, but there are always exceptions. I hope you don't think I disagreed with this in my comment.

>Could you move a cloud alone?
Possibly, but you wouldn't start with moving a cloud alone now would you, you'd first test lesser feats and attain lesser abilities, and work your way up. I will never limit in my mind what is possible, I'd have to work my way up to even being capable of testing that limit before I would consider it an unbreakable limit.

>You have to understand that there is spiritual hierarchy, some rituals fall under 'heavenly magic,' some do not require such a relationship
My position is that some things are definitely going to be easier if you accept power from other entities and operate within the hierarchy you described. But there are alternative paths (likely more difficult and will take longer) but you will get to the same position and the power and knowledge will be yours to wield completely.

>>41150935
>Could you move a cloud alone?
>Possibly, but you wouldn't start with moving a cloud alone now would you, you'd first test lesser feats and attain lesser abilities, and work your way up. I will never limit in my mind what is possible, I'd have to work my way up to even being capable of testing that limit before I would consider it an unbreakable limit

I understand that most major skills are first cultivated through the cultivation of lesser skills to then finally allow the possibility of the major skill to exist. But this will take a long time, but how 'exactly' will you be able to move a cloud? Which skills lead to the ability to move a cloud and make rain occur at command? Generally, sorcery should obviously avoided when not needed out of respect. But, assuming it doesn't exist and we're just left with ourselves, alone, which methods will allow you to move a cloud? The cultivation of this skill will probably take years of practice to get to a high enough level.

>. But there are alternative paths (likely more difficult and will take longer) but you will get to the same position and the power and knowledge will be yours to wield completely.

There is some knowledge that is highly guarded, highly secret, and is often known by senior priests in a magical lineage. So going alone will not lead to the same level of knowledge.

>Same power
This idea of the self-cultivation of power. This is multifaceted issue that is complicated. There IS power to be gained through some practice/skill, but it is only a part of a greater whole.

To be a well rounded priest, it will help to have a good relationship with a higher-power. Most priests spend their time in prayer which, I have noticed, produces a divine energy in the body that has similar properties to a liquid.

>>41150784
>gets entirely the wrong takeaway
right, good luck with that method that will get you all your results in 2 weeks

>>41151050
To add on, gaining knowledge will help improve your skills to, in theory, help you eventually move a cloud through yourself alone. But gaining the most comprehensive knowledge will have to be done via an esoteric spiritual school, which will NOT be done alone. This is not to disregard personal ventures in studying esoteric skills, but I believe there's only so much you can learn on your own, and this will eventually limit you to the amount of skill and knowledge you can have.

>>41133125
You can serve Mammon and kill children like the jews.

>>41150802
>magic is the use of deities to perform rituals
this has to happen when the mage has no power of his own to use
the mage with no internal power is impotent

>>41150884
>Have you tried performing an exorcism with just 'your power?'
the mage with no internal power is impotent
these things are plenty easy when one has cultivated a sufficient amount of his own power
blasting spirits away isnt difficult

>>41151050
>So going alone will not lead to the same level of knowledge.
You don't know that, that's just your belief, and you seem to be missing the point. Who cares if it's the same knowledge or not if you have the same power. It could just be a different kind of knowledge that has the same level of application.

Honestly I think I'll stop here because I don't need to convince you otherwise and I don't think you want to be convinced either because it's like you strongly want to believe in the foundation of the hierarchal framework you talked about, but I just see that as imposing limits on yourself. Saying "there is no other way to attain X" is just lying to yourself, there are always exceptions. Also, who said it had to be 100% completely on your own, at some point you'll be able to talk to entities and gain knowledge, but on your terms, and not from a position of servitude.

>>41151084
>I believe there's only so much you can learn on your own, and this will eventually limit you to the amount of skill and knowledge you can have.
I believe there is an exception to every rule, but even if I accepted this rule, like I already said:
>>41150804
>I'd much rather be able to move 5 grams via telekinesis on my own and that be my lifetime limit, than to be able to move 5000 grams but only if I worship/serve some entity and they can disable that ability whenever they choose if they don't sanction my thoughts or actions.
And this:
>>41150804
>It just sounds like "religion with extra effort", I could skip all the time, effort, trial & error, and just join one of the dominant religions and call it day. If I'm just going to ultimately be some servant to some "higher being" anyways why even put in the extra effort (ego?, pride?, feeling special?, false sense of power?, doesn't seem worth it to me).

>>41151081
>good luck with that method that will get you all your results in 2 weeks
Thank you lol.

>>41150621
>What's your nickname for people that make strawman arguments
>(you)
thread after thread you get the wrong takeaways from people misguided enough to help you
do you just sit on taoism threads or are there other threads you like to peruse?
are you just gathering data to feed into ai?

>>41151368
>thread after thread you get the wrong takeaways
That's ironically your wrong takeaway.

>>41151420
then why dont you state clearly your objective, requirements, and what specific outcome you are trying to receive from a practice and stop dancing around what it is you really want

>>41136600

>and turns out thats just the beginning

There is no beginning nor end. Approach the Tao and there is no beginning; follow it and there is no end. You can't know it, but you can be it.

>>41151499
>then why dont you state clearly your objective, requirements, and what specific outcome you are trying to receive from a practice and stop dancing around what it is you really want
Lmao, who the hell are you?

You are acting a little to arrogant online, I don't owe you all of those details. All I ever state is what I'm specifically looking for in terms of a practice. The people that have what I'm looking for give me those suggestions (which will be few, as I expect, because I'm filtering for the few that strictly fit my criteria). The people who want me to look for other things complain about me being specific and rage about they think I should be looking for lol.

Why is it your problem?, mind your business.

You don't need to know what my goals are, you either have what I'm looking for or you don't, and if you don't, you literally don't need to respond to me or care, it's that simple.

It's honestly you going out of your way (likely out of boredom) to create something out of nothing.

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2.05 MB JPG

Play with us, /x/.

>>41151759
>>then why dont you state clearly your objective, requirements, and what specific outcome you are trying to receive from a practice and stop dancing around what it is you really want
>Lmao, who the hell are you?
>You are acting a little to arrogant online, I don't owe you all of those details. All I ever state is what I'm specifically looking for in terms of a practice. The people that have what I'm looking for give me those suggestions (which will be few, as I expect, because I'm filtering for the few that strictly fit my criteria). The people who want me to look for other things complain about me being specific and rage about they think I should be looking for lol.
>Why is it your problem?, mind your business.
>You don't need to know what my goals are, you either have what I'm looking for or you don't, and if you don't, you literally don't need to respond to me or care, it's that simple.
>It's honestly you going out of your way (likely out of boredom) to create something out of nothing.

yeah thats what i thought

>>41152297
bump