>>268316095
mangaka got lazier because anime budgets went up, they know they can just chickenscratch on a page and the anime adaptation will just shove non-keyframed garbage and kids will go WHOA ANIMATION IS SO COOL SO MANY FRAMES I CAN'T EVEN SEE WHAT'S GOING ON
i outright refuse to read hxh despite liking the series somewhat because the art is some of the worst I've ever seen
used to be the opposite, the db anime sucked fucking ass compared to the manga, same with naruto, and bleach

>>268316095
Animation of fights, I couldn't get into JJK by watching the anime as it felt boring 10 episodes in, I tried reading the manga but my god it's so bad and horrendous especially when you read manga with actual decent art

>>268316252
>WHOA ANIMATION IS SO COOL SO MANY FRAMES I CAN'T EVEN SEE WHAT'S GOING ON
This is my biggest complaint too, especially Toei slop, just cubes, aura and you can't even see wtf is happening, it's not good animation it's just zoomer slop, watching something like Lucci vs Luffy from 2003 is so kino because it's good animation and you can actually see what is happening in each frame

>>268316262
jjk is legit unreadable

>>268316361
It's art is on par with modern One Piece

>>268316346
And yet jjk season 2 exploded in popularity after the sukuna fights, even though both were animated horribly, even in the blu-ray version.
Is it low standards?

>>268316095
it was never smart but the execution is getting worse
>And yet I see the current generation praise JJK especially (when in my mind it's the worst culprit of all these things)
i imagine that for most mainstream jjk fans it's the first big shonen series they've had a chance to follow while it's running

I don’t like popular thing, give me (you)s!

Why are you, presumably an adult, obsessing over action series for middle schoolers?

>>268316095
Ah yes, Goku from Dragon ball, the character known for his many dimensions and incredible depth

>>268316095
No, I don't think it's a you thing. I've been able to go back and reread plenty of shonen manga I loved growing up and still get as much enjoyment out of them as I did when I was younger. That's not to say that I haven't had some shonen manga I've enjoyed that have been coming out these days, but they still can't beat the old ones for me.
I like that you pointed out the settings in series like Dragon Ball, Naruto, and One Piece. I miss when shonen manga created their own worlds and explored/developed them as the stories went on. I love urban fantasy, don't get me wrong, but when that seems to be the majority of shonen manga these days, it really starts to feel like a case of, "been there, done that". Sure, urban fantasy's awesome, but let's see some new worlds!
I did like JJK when I first started it, but by this point, I'm just reading it to finish it up. It's not even close to the level of something like One Piece, Dragon Ball, or Naruto.

>>268316095
jjk fans on tiktok are very edgy

>>268316095
Shounen is literally FOR kids. Retard. Shounen is Japanese for young boy.

>>268316475
>Is it low standards?
Low standards+normie consumption, you have to understand the average normie has an IQ around 80-90

>>268316095
no, you are right. Gege is a hack when it comes to writing characters. He jumped straight into a war arc and now I am just in sunk cost mode because I taught he was going to improve past sad backstories. Well at least some fights have decent choreography and fun power system tactics

>>268316581
urban fantasy is great
the problem is they don't explore the settings at all
we know fuck all about anything in JJK or demon slayer.

>>268316095
csm isnt a shonen its just dogshit. dont call everything u dont like a shonen. wan piss naruto and bleach are all just as dumb as jjk and demon slayer. u are just hating on new thing.

>>268316742
>fun power system tactics
JJK's power system is literally just Gege making random shit up as he goes along
there's no basis or system for any of it

>>268316821
i'd give you bleach because bleach is shit and everyone knows that if it didn't have massive tits every other page, no one would ever know it exists
but OP and Naruto have a lot of redeeming qualities and interesting things about them, even if the core, imo, is very bland and repetitive.

>>268316798
Oh, don't get me wrong, I love urban fantasy myself. It's like you said though, they don't explore the settings. My Hero Academia I guess could count as an urban fantasy (urban sci-fi? I don't know) and it does more with its setting than either JJK or Demon Slayer did, though its world still ended up being pretty unexplored as well outside of the more metropolitan areas. These series in general could just really do with more worldbuilding. The worlds in Dragon Ball, Naruto, and One Piece actually feel lived in and real in their own ways because the creators actually developed them. New mangaka just seem to pour so little into developing their worlds, if not outright ignore any potential worldbuilding and it's pretty disappointing.

you're just getting older
shonen has always been dumb

>>268316095
Is that Kakashi and Sasuke/Naruto/Sakura?

They did expies twenty years ago, but now they don't even hide it.

Maybe lack of new ideas is the problem. Demon Slayer is just Taisho-era!Inuyasha.

People are publishing fanfics.

>>268316095
Sorry but shonen has always been dumb. There is no hidden secret, you love Naruto and Bleach and Dragon Ball because you were a dumbass impressionable kid when you watched them.

>>268317301
>>268318354
SnK and Death Note were smart shounen and unlike the repetitive crap mentioned above

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>>268316475
People just like Sukuna. Good animation can't save shit characters just like how bad animation can't ruin a good character.

>>268316095
>The story of JJK is literally just 'kill Sukuna'
>The story of One Piece is literally just 'find the titular MacGuffin'
>The story of Dragonball is literally just 'find the titular MacGuffin x7' and 'kill and/or befriend arc's big bad'
Here's your (You)

>>268319171
It's hilarious how these threads always mention dumb mainstream filler-ridden garbage like Naruto or Bleach instead of actual decent shonen like World Trigger or Soul Eater or FMAB or Shaman King.

>>268316445
One Piece is readable even foor little kids. Improve your skill.

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>>268316095
Nu-shounen appeals to the 3 most influential parts of the audience's body: the brain, the heart, and the dick. And more importantly, it appeals to them in the ideal way for the internet generation.

JJK appeals to the brain. Zoomers have brains as wide as oceans and deep as puddles, and get a dopamine rush from understanding references.
JJK is incredibly good at pretending to be smart. Gege will use physics concepts (that even he doesn't understand) to overexplain powers that are honestly simple enough to explain in a few sentences. This makes the midwit reader feel smart for understanding these powers.

KnY appeals to the heart. Zoomers are simultaneously extremely sensitive, but also have no understanding of actual human emotion.
KnY nakedly presents unrealistic caricatures and hamfisted tragic backstories. Characters will behave in the most idiotic and histrionic way possible in order to create the most tragedy. The story is barebones and the fights follow pro-wrestling logic because all that's actually needed for the audience is to hit emotional beats.

And finally, CSM appeals to the dick. If you've read CSM but have never been exposed to the fanbase (somehow), this might sound like an insane statement. How the hell could Fujimoto's dogshit chickenscratch possibly appeal to anyone's dick? And I'll tell you: mommy issues. Zoomers almost all have mommy issues.
Fujimoto's femdom fetish leaks into every aspect of CSM and has managed to hit the niche that no other shounen has managed.
Also, it's "safe horny". The women are sexually appealing via their role as dominant figures, not via their appearance (I cannot stress enough that it's not by their appearance). So sex repulsed zoomers won't be scared away.
Notice how the blame is always placed on the CSM fanbase for being horny and not Fujimoto for appealing to a fetish.

>>268316095
Anime overall got dumber. Look at the most common type being released now. It's all Isekai where the character didn't do shit other than getting stronger via some bullshit cheats or something dumb then that character gets all the the bitches and makes all the men jealous and the end.

This is unironically the worst era of anime. We get good ones like Vinland saga once or twice in like 5 years, but the rest are the bottom tier slope that just copy the current trend

>>268320525
>We get good ones like Vinland saga

>>268316095
A little, yes. It's because everyone want to stand out and be original, but everything relatively sane has already be sane... you to stand out you gotta get a bit insane. Sometimes is works, sometimes it doesn't.

>>268320543
>Good animation: Check
>Good story: Check
>Well written characters: Check
>Decent character development (even though the author went too hard on the peace and love aspect): Check
>Memorable dialogue: Check

Yeah that's a good show, sorry about your shit taste

>>268316095
Slops like JJK and KnY becoming these big worldwide sensations are the reason why Jump will forever be a shitty magazine. The real reason that art suffers and stories are badly written in Jump is because it pushes quantity over quality with little chance of true creative freedom. They don't care for how sloppy or half-done the art is, they don't actually care about the quality of the story itself, just as long as it gets out there and the tankoubon meets whatever arbitrary sales criteria and this filters down to the creators who know they don't have to put effort into their content. Just shit out 18 half-assed pages where only about 6 pages worth of stuff is actually worth a dime and move on to the next chapter.

This is also why Jumpshit manga are filled with shitty endings as a result of one of two things: either the manga was cut short so the author couldn't pull off the ending they wanted OR the author never had an ending planned in the first place because their series was one of the 10 other manuscripts they submitted to Jump editorial that year, so it's not the lovingly crafted passion project people think they are.

Those who actually tries in Jump, wanting to tell a well-written story, finds themselves at a disadvantage because effort isn't what the magazine nor its lowest, common denominator audience want.

I'm going to write a story and I'd make what is the second coming of Avatar the Last Airbender (it mogs all nu-male shounenshit like JJK and KnY), clown every single one of these talentless creatively bankrupt Japanese motherfuckers out the window and give the editorial staff at Jump the middle finger, as I will NEVER set foot on that shitty magazine even if they held me at a gunpoint.

The good stuff always goes unnoticed unfortunately.

>>268316095
Its style of substance now. KnY is the perfect example of it.

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chainsaw man is fucking fantastic and i'm kinda mad it took me so long to start it. it's one of the few shounen i love (along with hxh, opm, and mob psycho).

but yes, jjk and shit is mid as fuck. old shounen had EPIC (bite me) worldbuilding and slower pacing that made time for characterization and character interactions. new shounen just spams meaningless fights at you. jjk nosedived after shibuya.

>>268316262
>>268316361
JJK is in the highest tier of action clarity in manga. Any manga veteran can immediately tell.
Approach > impact > reaction and response. It's all easy to see.

>>268316095
Bait used to be believable, you know

>>268321452
Nah, he's right. Nu-shounen sucks donkey balls and for the ones that don't suck donkey balls they always go unnoticed by the public/normalfags/NPCs which sucks too because you're stuck with mediocre rubbish like KnY and JJK that gets praised to high heavens by them

Movies and music also sucks right now because of that

>>268316518
>obsessing over action series for middle schoolers
JJK fanbase is all ages. That's why it's so popular. Middle aged women are the biggest consumers they buy all the merch and went to see the movie multiple times.

Do people honestly think the movie grossed 200 million because a bunch of 12 year old boys went to see it? Shounen is the Marvel shit of Japan.

I don't know if the answers here are ironic but holy fucking shit, there is literally nothing on the planet dumber than fucking Dragon Ball Z (nobody who talks about DB talks about early DB which was the only good DB because it was comedy)
>AAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAA HE'S USING THE IMPROVED KAIOH-KEN SSJ3 KAMEHAMEHA LVL5 SUPER DUPER WITH A BACKFLIP THIS TIME AND HIS HAIR GOT GAYER!!! I-IMPOSSIBLE!!!!
I legitimately fucking hate Dragon Ball Z it was a legitimate tragedy that something so fucking gay disgraced Japan. I have tried going at the DBZ anime again a few years ago for the sake of nostalgia and it's legitimately fucking mind-numbingly stupid and bad. I have no idea what kind of negative IQ subhuman you have to be to enjoy DBZ or later. All the anime I grew up with is animated like shit, tons of recycled animation, discount Hollywood tier dumb, it's god damn awful. If I take off the nostalgia tinted glasses it's legitimate slop and badly made slop.
>>268316095
>I cannot find myself giving a single fuck about new shonen like JJK or Demon Slayer or Chainsaw Man
you are getting older
>They all seem so basic in every regard.
I don't really know what "basic" means here. You mean they're not well-rounded? How is Denji from CSM a less well-rounded character than fucking Goku who has about the same depth as Super Mario?
>The art for all of them is completely atrocious
I think artists are way more skilled today but they're brought down by production constraints. The art in a lot of new manga looks to me like the work of someone who's astonishingly good but had to work with 1/10 of the time
>characters are all extremely one dimensional and have zero growth or trials, they're just used for shock deaths.
This is 100% of side characters in anime since forever except anime just got more violent. you had higher peaks of ultraviolence in the past but now it's unusually gory on average and this means cheap deaths instead of quietly fading in the background
It's 100% nostalgia

>>268321809
>KnY and JJK
People praise the anime because the animation is just that good. No one has ever said that their writing is the best, better than HxH.
I think you just want to hate them for the sake of it.

I am enjoying the animation on new anime so much

JJK actually has excellent animation unlike the other 2, but it has the worst characters and writing.

>>268316095
Naruto was always pretty fucking generic, and both Dragon Ball and One Piece has massive pacing issues. JJK is overrated as hell but honestly all mainline shounen series are.

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No offense, but Naruto, One Piece, Bleach etc were also retarded. It comes with the genre. If it's not retarded, you call it "seinen" instead.

>>268322810
I'm old and not autistic and there are two really things that bother me about JJK. One is that Yuji is by far the most boring character in a fight. He just hits shit in a universe where everyone has cool powers. Gojo is annoying but he really sells that he's got the best power. The second is Nobara fucking died and she didn't come back with a cool eyepatch and a pirate ship themed domain.

>>268316095
Nah shonen has always been dumb garbage. You love Naruto because you were a middle schooler when you watched it.

>>268320445
This is all true.

>>268320445
>The women are sexually appealing via their role as dominant figures, not via their appearance (I cannot stress enough that it's not by their appearance)
nah, their appearance is hot as fuck.

>>268316890
>OP and Naruto have a lot of redeeming qualities
LMAAOOOOOOOOOOOO

>>268322891
FLCL and Naruto are both soft seinen nice job getting filtered

>>268323433
flcl sure

>soft seinen
>safe horny
>forced animation
jesus christ shut the fuck up

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>>268316095
>I mean, look at any of the big shonen from the last generation, Naruto, One Piece, Dragonball
>Dragonball
>Last generation
Yet another instance of zoomers trying to lump Dragonball in with the big three and push Bleach out. Dragonball isn't in the same generation of manga that Naruto and One Piece are, Bleach is.

>>268316095
"old good new bad" is such a boring talking point desu. every time i see a thread like this i imagine a balding 40-year old made it.

>>268320445
I have no idea why people say the art in CSM is bad
the artist draws some really hot chicks, it isn't even because of whatever gay shit you're projecting on it
it's ironic that you made this post while saying JJK is good at pretending it's smart
as for "safe horny", god fucking damn I hate when faggots regurgitate these gay internet words, kill yourself you fucking mouthbreathing zoomer nigger, artist just draws attractive chicks, people like to see attractive chicks, you don't call that "safe horny" it's called drawing well, it's something you wanna do by default
so for fuck's sake please fucking shotgun yourself out of existence you fucking dumb tranny

>>268320445
>safe horny
Isn't that a /v/ word?

>>268323566
I think it's tranny speak as if you were not supposed to choose to attractive human beings most of the time

>>268316095
>(I know CSM is barely a shonen but still).
Stopped reading, worthless thread

>>268316890
Nardo is the bottom of the barrel. It's the worst written shonen ever. Wtf are you talking about? JJK is trash but it's not as trash as nardo. You legit have to be a woman to like what nardo isn't complete crap at.

>>268317261
Nardo is worse shit and DB was never about world building.

>>268323433
You're the kishimoto cock sucker. No series with narutard with the protagonist can ever be seinen. It's bland as shit shonen down to its very core.

>>268320445
>. How the hell could Fujimoto's dogshit chickenscratch possibly appeal to anyone's dick? And I'll tell you: mommy issues. Zoomers almost all have mommy issues.
The real reason is because of off model fanart

>>268323490
in his defense, dragon ball is a constantly ongoing metastasis and increasingly braindead spics keep giving new blood to the fandom
every generation needs a representative of the absolute nadir of gayest, dumbest shit taste possible so dragon ball is eternal

>>268324309
Dragon ball is still infinitely better than that narutard garbage, so no it is not the nadir.

>>268324369
I never watched Naruto so I don't know. I wasn't in the demographic. I doubt it can be worse than DBZ.

>>268323566
it's a keyboard warrior word for complaining about stuff that's horny in a way that offends their political views, i.e, women that fuck but aren't drawn like barbie doll figures in battle bikinis, or just anything that doesn't have enough shallow fanservice despite sex being a part of the story

>>268324410
It is. Imagine dbz but with a dozen different pretenses of being deep and tragic.

>>268324476
That still sounds better than DBZ honestly

>>268324460
I think zoomers just regurgitate shit mindlessly
maybe that poster is a bot

>>268316095
Bleachbros...we're forgotten.

>>268316518
You retards say this dumb shit thinking you're smart huh? Shonen is consumed by everyone. The average shonen fan isn't even a kid but people in their 20s

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>>268323878
Bleachtroon seething as usual lmaoooo

Never forget that Bleach got cancelled for being shit

The whole world knows Bleach is ass.

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>>268323878
Naruto has a higher percentage of male fans than JJK lol. By far. Kill yourself faggot.

>>268319755
>FMA
Is literal dogshit for redditors. No idea about the rest.

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>>268324019
Yet people have always considered Naruto far better than Bleach globally.

There's a reason why Bleach got cancelled and is below fucking Boruto lmao


Everybody knows Bleach is trash.

>>268325403
It doesn't matter who reads it, it's still garbage for middle schoolers. It's not surprising that a lot of people have shit taste.

>>268325548
It's clearly not if the average reader are young adults in their 20s, genius.

>>268325548
Tell me about all the mature anime and manga mature adults like you enjoy.

>>268316252
>I outright refuse to read hxh despite liking the series somewhat because the art is some of the worst I've ever seen
Unironically based

>>268316095
have you considered looking outside of Shonen Jump? Like are you reading Iruma-kun right now?

Shounen went to hell ever since mha made people celebrate unoriginality

Sukuna vs Jogo >>>>>> Sukuna vs Mahoraga

At least I could comprehend what was going on in the first fight.

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modern shonen is so bad Raiku had to come back

>>268325429
>>268325462
>>268325530
>Bleach out of nowhere
>retarded fantasies
You're so easy, you narutard kishimoto cock sucker lol. For an irrelevant series, it sure is living in your head rent free.

Nardo is still the shittiest shonen out there, irrespective of how bad you think Bleach is. That's a goddamn fact.

>>268325745
KEK

You're too transparent, Bleachtroon. Your shit series got cancelled unlike Naruto.

The whole world around knows your trash is nothing. Boruto is better than Bleach, this is a fact. See>>268325530

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Bleachsisters...looks like nobody likes our trash series here either...

>>268316095
The real reason is that they're just "things happen" with zero plot or thought put into it or arc structure or worldbuilding or charm
JJK has literally no plot, yuji eats sukuna does 1 adventure then they villain of the week until the current dogshit sukuna meatgrinder

Reminder to filter any variation of 'xtroon' or 'xsisters'

I see a HxH thread, a Naruto thread, a Dragon Ball thread, a OP thread

but I don't see a Bleach thread.

For all the supposed love of Bleach on this shithole, seems like nobody truly likes that garbage pile of a manga beyond the memes LMAO

>>268325772
>>268325852
Kys narutard. Bleach might sell less but it will never be as much of a pile of utter garbage as nardo is. Only drooling retards like nardo lol.

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>>268325954
Then why did Bleach get cancelled unlike Naruto?

Even on 4chan there are no Bleach threads lmao

The narutard is out of his container again. Imagine being so mad 24/7 about a seemingly irrelevant series that you reply to every post with 3 replies that you copy paste over and over. He truly is a spic

>>268326024
Even the Japanese don't like Clorox, that's why that shit manga got cancelled unlike Naruto lmao

>>268325985
>Then why did Bleach get cancelled unlike Naruto?
Because there are disproportionate amounts of drooling retards in the world and on nu-4chan. When we were based we knew better to tolerate garbage like nardo on the board (which would still be in effect were the site not dying). There is a reason it was considered the shittiest of the big 3 through the 2000s. No amount of zoomer revisionism will change that fact.

>>268326043
You're a spic. The manga was never cancelled but it might be too difficult for your spic intelligence to understand.

>>268326102
>DB thread there
>OP thread there
>HxH thread there
>Naruto thread there

Hmm I see all these thread but no Clorox. Looks like even your 4chan buttbudies don't like Clorox lmao

Everybody in the world, both in Japan and outside knew Bleach was trash. That's why Bleach got cancelled unlike Naruto

Stop replying to the bot

>>268326133
>>268326102
If it was the shittiest, why did Bleach get cancelled instead of Naruto? Looks like actual readers thought otherwise lmao

What's there to not understand? Bleach is a bad series, which is why it got cancelled.>>268325429
is proof enough.

Naruto? Didn't get cancelled.

Naruto>>>>>>>>>>>Clorox.

>>268326150
>redditspacing
>zero reading comprehension
>repeats the same shit like a broken record
>probably a sething manlet irl
The guy above really is correct. This is typical spic behaviour.

>>268326150
zip it spic

>>268326224
Repetition is the best way to get to retards so that's why I'm doing it lol

Clorox: got axed

Naruto: didn't get axed

Thus: Naruto>>>>>>Clorox, and the world knows it.

>>268326176
Bleach manga was never cancelled, you goddamn retarded spic. Get your ass back to your containment board, cuz I am going to ruin another nardo thread lol. Wait for the raikage...

>>268326262
Of course Clorox was cancelled lol the sales, the sudden ending, the placement everything proves it.

Even the anime was replaced. Bleach is a garbage series after all>>268325429

>>268326251
Repetition of literal made up bullshit is typical low IQ behaviour, which is consistent with your racial makeup.

You can keep yelling that the sun is green but that won't make it true. Just like your delusions about Bleach manga getting cancelled would never be true.

>>268326327
>Bleachtroonys mad over Bleach getting cancelled
KEK

It's a fact, troony. Look at the numbers. That shit series got CANCELLED

>>268326371
>waaaah waaaah waaaah
Never cancelled + I don't give a shit

Nardo is still the most garbage shonen ever written. It's barely above fairy tail.

>>268326424
That's why Clorox got cancelled unlike Naruto
>>268325429


Boruto is better than Bleach lmao forget Naruto the world likes Boruto more than Bleach
>>268325530

>>268316095
your brain has been fried from indulging in too much isekai

>>268326451
>spic is like a broken record
Typical.

All of your points have already been refuted + sales have no bearing on quality. Find a busy intersection.

>>268326493
>no Bleach thread
>Bleach gets cancelled
>people like Boruto more than Bleach
LMAO

it's so over. This means the entire world sees Bleach as garbage. Forget competing with Naruto, Bleach can't even compete with Boruto.

>>268316095
>No boku no hero mention
SHITREMYbros...

>>268326530
Nardo is still the worst ever

>>268316095
Don't worry, OP. Togashi will save shonen once again when the chapters he's posting on xitter get released.

>>268316095
>I just don't get how kids can get invested in that shit.
That's the answer. They don't know any better. It also doesn't help that shonen slowly turned into the substitute for capeshit after the MCU started bleeding out.

>>268316843
>JJK's power system is literally just Gege making random shit up as he goes along
Its literally just "character has random superpower + domains" and thats it

>>268316252
FPWP
DB anime was always great, you're an absolute retard.

>>268316095
It's just all about good-looking boys and girls with tragic pasts killing each other, and who dies and who survives, and that sort of thing.

>>268319755
That's because FMA is dogshit too.

>>268316095
What is a "smart" shonen?
Give us an example.

I'd wager you just got older

>>268316095
>I mean, look at any of the big shonen from the last generation, Naruto, One Piece, Dragonball, they all have well-explored settings and characters. The art is much more polished (minus One Piece, but that's still going) and even though the series still revolve around fights, the framing of those fights is given just as much importance if not more.

A case of rose-tinted glasses if I ever saw one. You are dellusional

>>268316581
OP, Dragonballz and Naruto are shit (and hteir fans are double shit).
You are putting them on the pedistal.

>>268330102
Wanpiss and nardo are shit. Dragon ball never had any pretentions of being more than a dumb fightfag series so it was good for what it was.

OP is a retarded narutard who just made this thread to pretend that Naruto is in any way better in quality compared to JJK, KnY or CSM. In truth, Naruto has and will always be One Piece's Jannetty, and a Dragonball wannabe.

>>268320445
100% correct

>>268325668
>Superman = Dragon Ball
>Batman = Death Note
>Fantastic Four = One Piece
>X-MEN = Naruto, My Hero Academia
>Constantine = Yu Yu Hakusho, Jujutsu Kaisen
>Blade = Bleach, Demon Slayer
>Hellboy = Chainsaw Man
It's from a long time ago

>>268322810
Are you a cat?

>>268330322
You just like asian characters, just like people who like K-POP.

>>268330297
Hellboy the comic is so fucking boring. The atmosphere is "spooky but rule of cool" yet for half the pages of each "plot arc" nothing is happening other than the titular character looking grumpy and some vague exposition dumps leading up to some short "fight" encounter that either means jack shit or is the essential pivotal fight of that "arc' and then the overarching story shit the bed.

>>268324369
It really isn't, dbz is so over rated basically every battle shonen is better, naruto, bleach, one piece, jujutsu keisen, shamen king, gash bell, hitman reborn, I could keep going but you get the point

>>268316095
>the last generation, Naruto, One Piece, Dragonball,
? Dragonball is from the 80's, dude
The Juan Piss, Naruto, Bleach etc generation is when it really started to go to shit

>>268326424
Naruto and Fairy Tail are leagues ahead of Bleach. Also neither of those two got cancelled like Bleach.

>>268316095
>I just don't get how kids can get invested in that shit. What do they see?
It's always babies first anime. Notice how the things they praise the shows they like for have been done in past shounen, yet because those were published ages before they were born, they don't know shit about them.

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>>268316095
Shonen and all picture books are stupid. Anything with words on the page is a waste of time. I've been liking Slave, but even it goes too far at point. The medium is only good for tits and fights. Anything else gets in the way and should be abolished.

>>268330775
Lol

>>268325815
You can say that the plot is shit, but saying that there is none is just factually incorrect, the entirety of the story is about one of the big villains putting his plan into motion bit by bit (plus a flashback arc to explain some backstories and introduce setting elements which become relevant later).

>>268330397
Western comics are utterly fucking dead and I'm not even talking about capeshit which has been on life support for the sake of IP upkeep for like, 20 years. It's not even worth it to call capeshit unreadable because it's something that isn't even meant to be read. Even if you look at French comics they're fucking garbage, the only reason why you braindead American niggers still talk about them is they have titties and sex because they're le epic French, oh wow is that an UNCENSORED PUSSY baaaaaaased lol I'mma touch my peepee now XDXDXDXD
I'm fully cognizant that manga is lowbrow as shit but at least it attempts to be entertaining.

>>268316095
>am I just old and jaded
It's this. Shonen was always retarded. Why do you even need to ask?
>Naruto, One Piece, Dragonball, they all have well-explored settings and characters.
Is this trolling?

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>>268316252
>i outright refuse to read hxh despite liking the series somewhat because the art is some of the worst I've ever seen
You only saw some memes and some shitty scans. You don't know the actual art from the manga.
Even Dragon Ball looked like total dog shit based on the shitty scans available ten years ago.
>>268325629
No it's not. It's an ignorant take.

>>268322006
>dragonball is about goku's new bigger kamehameha
you've never read it, have you?
original DB in particular had tons of worldbuilding and the fighting had 0 powerscaling. It was all tactics.

>>268322810
It has great animation outside of combat.
The fight scenes were almost all painfully bad.

>>268323490
Bleach was always the shit cousin of the big three.
Picking dragonball, the most influential one out of the big three to say it doesn't belong on the big three, just shows how acutely retarded the average Bleach fan is.

>>268323878
Naruto has more worldbuilding in it's opening chapter than JJK has in it's entire run thus far.

>>268329345
Yes, which is why it's not a power system and wholly uninteresting

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>>268332543
Are you really going to sit here and pretend like HxH looks like your picture?
I just opened a random chapter and page.

>>268332846
How do they not? We literally see Goku's entire childhood to adulthood.
Naruto's main conflicts are all character backstory related.
One Piece is literally full of characters that we explored the backstory of. They may not evolve much, but everything we're introduced in the series is generally explored thoroughly.

I don't see how you can deny any of this unless you haven't read any of them.

>>268316095
Early Wan Piss had better art than all shonen jump manga that debuted from 2015 onwards

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>>268332810
First of all you didn't pick a "random page", you cherrypicked the worst looking one.
Secondly, that scan is not very good quality.
Thirdly, Greed Island/ early CA was when the art was at its worst because Togashi was still trying to keep a week schedule despite his back problems. This is not representative of the entire manga.
Fourthly, HxH at its worst is still decent and looks like just any weekly shonen from that time (Shaman King, Gash Bell, pre-Shippuden Naruto, etc).
Lastly, "good art" in manga means far beyond photo-realism. Paneling, composition, readability, choreography, facial expressions etc are all far more important, and HxH excels at all of those.
There's a reason every other mangaka idolizes Togashi, not for his skills as a writer, but as a mangaka.

>>268316095
tl;dr and I dunno, but my dick is getting harder when I see nobara

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>>268332960

>daily OLD GOOD NEW BAD thread
this place is becoming a nursing home for joyless geriatrics lmao

>>268316095
>Is shonen getting dumber
Yes. You are slow.

>>268332960
>accuses me of cherrypicking
>literally picks the half a dozen or so panels in an entire arc that don't look like doodles
>even those looks extremely low quality
>starts coping about composition, flow, readability, as if HxH isn't shit at all those too

I have literally never heard another mangaka praise Togashi's art. Ever. You live in fantasy land.

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>>268316095
I think the sad truth is the genre doesn't hold up as well when you're well into your adult years and you're well aware of all the archetypes and formulaic arc structure and whatnot
A lot of the young people watching these new modern shonen are watching them through the lense of never having seen stuff like DragonBall or the big 3 so it all still seems new to them
It's all built for kids/teens, not 30+ year olds who never moved on

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>>268332810
HxH art has pretty good highs and sort of low-lows
It averages out pretty well but the general art style kind of varies arc to arc

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>>268333021
>literally picks the half a dozen or so panels in an entire arc that don't look like doodles
Pick any page from the Palace Invasion (volume 25-30). They all look good.
>starts coping about composition, flow, readability, as if HxH isn't shit at all those too
Other mangaka know better than you and say the opposite.
>I have literally never heard another mangaka praise Togashi's art. Ever. You live in fantasy land.
You're in for a rude awakening. Murata literally used Togashi's art in his book "How to Draw Manga" as examples of good art.

>>268333030
nah
JJK is rushed as fuck
MHA is a hot meandering mess
Demon Slayer is mid carried by fancy animation

>>268316095
>wan piss
>well explored setting and characters
Stopped reading.

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>>268333021
>I have literally never heard another mangaka praise Togashi's art. Ever.

>>268316095
>I mean, look at any of the big shonen from the last generation, Naruto, One Piece, Dragonball
>Dragon Ball
You mean Bleach you retard?

>>268333094
Demon Slayer is objectively nice

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>>268333113
>I have literally never heard another mangaka praise Togashi's art. Ever. You live in fantasy land.

>>268333121
>big shonen
>Bleach
Pick one.

>>268332982
>female character in a comic filled with buff dudes is called "no bara"
>author kills her
not like this...

>>268333113
>It's not wise to focus on your raw drawing ability
lmfao
even Kishimoto knows Togashi can't draw

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>>268333148
BRAAAAAP

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>>268333021
>I have literally never heard another mangaka praise Togashi's art. Ever. You live in fantasy land.
OH NO NO NO

>>268332657
Just kill yourself, narutard spic.

>>268333155
Gege is literally gay, have you not noticed all the females are all fodder in his manga
I hope you don't like Maki because it's only a matter of time

The only reason Mei-Mei survived is because she's selfish/evil and Gege has a hard-on for villains.

>>268332657
Bleach is the kind of manga that is amazing at first but shits the bed really hard after a certain point. the manga who survive in the public's memory shit the bed little by little in boiled frog fashion

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>the one bleachtard seething at everyone rightfully calling him a retard and telling him to sit at the back of the boss
Lmfao

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>>268333156
>even Kishimoto knows Togashi can't draw
>>268333186

>>268316095
>is shonen getting dumber?
No and if you think so you haven't actually watched old shonen.

I'm sure you're gonna tell me popular shit like DBZ is very smartly written.

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>>268333021

>>268333211
Bleach's main issue is that Kubo literally cannot write a story.
The entire thing is just 'wow these guys are the strongest'
then they get beat
and then he goes 'a-actually these secret guys I never told you about were the actual strongest all along! Hah!'
And he does this literally like 10 times

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>>268333021
>I have literally never heard another mangaka praise Togashi's art. Ever. You live in fantasy land.
Should I stop or...?

>>268325490
>No idea about the rest
That's because you are a retard who probably only watched Naruto as a kid.

>>268333215
>>268333237
>japanese and their autistic respect/two-faced shit somehow means we can't look at Togashi's shit art and see it for what it is

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>>268333021
>You live in fantasy land.

>>268333277
NTA but do Americans really consider being polite to being the same as autistic/two-faced?

>>268333197
I know he's gay. Strangely, I really love all chicks in JJK for some reason except Yuki. I want Mei-Mei to give me the ara-ara.

>Narutard spic pretending to be multiple people
Pathetic. Too deranged to not be noticeable

>>268333214
>boss
Lol. Kys narutard

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>>268333094
You probably wouldn't have those same critiques if you were 12 years old and instead just think "Wow these cartoons are friggin DEEP and look heckin COOL"

>>268333327
In Japanese culture, it is literally taboo to insult anything made by another person. Especially in terms of peers. It's autism and two-faced, yes.

>>268333239
>The entire thing is just 'wow these guys are the strongest' then they get beat and then he goes 'a-actually these secret guys I never told you about were the actual strongest all along! Hah!'
You're literally making shit up.

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>>268333186>>268333021
Demon Slayer author? Has a crush on Togahsi-sensei

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>>268333021

>>268333327
Not him but it's kind of true. Except for Miyazaki who openly talks shit, there's a whole lot of performative kowtowing going on all the time. I wouldn't even call it brown-nosing because it's way more culturally ingrained than it is a personal decision.

>>268333156
Kishimoto can't draw himself so what the fuck would he know.

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>>268333450
Kishimoto is a very good artist.

>>268333450
Kishimoto absolutely can draw when he wants to and has the time.

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>>268333450
he does alright

>>268333479
>promotional art
Kek. Kishimoto is a shit artist and anybody can crack open a chapter can see that. At least Togashi is original.

>>268333508
traced

>>268333489
So basically never in Naruto?
>>268333508
Ehh.

>>268333533
As if that's a question. Better question is how many assistants did he put to work for that page?

>>268316252
>mangaka got lazier
true
>because anime budgets went up
Not even true and absolutely wouldn't be the reason anyways. Mangaka are lazier because they have acquired the tools to be lazier and in being lazier and using those tools it removes variation and does not promote creating their own art style and way of drawing, but rather to stay within the bounds of those tools and create something that looks just like everything else. Basically people who cannot draw anything interesting on their own have tools available to allow them to meet a minimum standard to get published, and all of the garbage flooding the market is the result of that. The anime industry also has been suffering from this. Technology that makes things easier is great, but not for the consumer that wants a quality work, because this has always lead to mass produced imitations of the original and its clearly no different in this case.

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>>268333516
Naruto looked pretty good for a weekly series
Hard to say exactly how much was him vs. assistants but it was just a good looking weekly manga for years

>>268333479
Shame how much Kishi's art deteriorated in later years. Early Naruto was peak.

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>>268333600
It's actually nutty how crisp and pristine a lot of these new manga from the past decade late, practically flawless with backgrounds and characters. But it's not the same as the olden days where they just pick up a pencil, a ruler, and piece of paper and have it

>>268333621
All of part 2 was trash, especially from an art perspective and part 1 has extremely overrated art. It ironically looked closer to HxH in the more praised Part 1.

>>268333704
No I mean based

>>268316095
shounen was always dumb
you finally grew out of media targeted at adolescent males
omedetou

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>>268333733
The weekly grind for over a decade would have driven me insane, it makes me sick thinking about all that work
I always try to weigh the art quality vs. the production schedule

>>268333479
Picture unrelated

>>268316095
No, it's getting better.

Am i retarded zoomer if i kinda enjoyed jujutsu kaisen and chainsaw man

>>268316095
shounen was always plenty dumb however i feel like now it's dumb in different ways. e.g there's less "i'll just hit him harder" and more random complicated but not actually interesting powers.
>>268316518
why are you on this website?

>>268316095
>The story of JJK is literally just 'kill Sukuna' and it was that from the beginning
You are just a retarded geezer

>I just don't get how kids can get invested in that shit. What do they see?
Not everyone watches fiction for muh character development or muh multidimensional characters. People don’t watch anime or manga to judge it on a scale, they just watch what they enjoy. No one is forcing you to watch things you don’t like, that’s your own problem.

>>268333810
that's fucking rich coming from a fat yankee

>>268333479
I have lost all capacity for being impressed by backgrounds since I realized Dandadan guy did literally every impressive spread of Chainsawman and Fire Punch

>>268333870
no
>>268333877
>Not everyone watches fiction for muh character development or muh multidimensional characters.
finally someone with some sense, you watch shit to be entertained. it's much worse to praise Evangelion because it's le fucking deep
people who like this or that anime for shit like character writing or multi-layered plotlines are indistinguishable from rick & morty fans

>>268333952
from that perspective I can understand liking the anime
but the manga isn't entertaining in the slightest

>>268334012
No, manga are even more like this. They're meant for speed reading while you're taking a shit while the anime forces you to follow its pacing. The whole concept that comics are meant to be savored to any degree is a Western thing, because comics in the West quickly lost their roots as they became unprofitable as mass publishing. It's a "graphic novel" thing. The last real comics in the West were meant to be skimmed quickly, just the same as manga. Even the paneling reflected that, while today Western comics try to look more and more like a series of illustrations or at worst, do that clever experimental shit that is fucking insufferable to look at.
Like manga is absolutely designed so that you can safely skip all the talking and still enjoy the fights just the same. It's the actual reason why manga is so successful

>>268316095
I'm half-convinced the entire thread was made to troll Bleach fans. It was also posted during the Mexican hours. Noggin, joggin, etc.

>>268333508
As far as I'm aware, the buildings were always drawn by Ikemoto.

>>268316095
You are getting older

>>268333877
>>268333952
Anti-intellectualism at its finest.
>I don't need or want to think about the media I consume.
You are proving OP point. Enjoy your jjk slop that will be forgotten as soon as it's over the same way you don't remember what you ate yesterday that today has shown it's true form as shit.

>>268316095
Imagine enjoying literal slop like Naruto or Bleach as a kid and complaining 20 years later when kids do the same for something else lmao. Shonenshitters really never grow up.

>>268335123
No you are just a midwit. I much prefer a well-executed, straightforward circus spectacle than something that half-assedly attempts to appear intellectual through a medium that is not cut for it.
My favorite anime recently have been Spy Family and Kaiju n°8. I disliked JJK at first but it grew on me. I think CSM is a bit of a fringe case, it just gets me in a bad mood, but it's pretty good. There's shit like Frieren that gets this shit all wrong. The premise is excellent with this long lived elf treading back on her past, I was prepared for comfy slice-of-life, but then they hit you over the head with le fucking mEaNiNg, inter-generational bullshit, and then seeing that none of it worked they just turned it into KnY-lite. Awful. It would have been so nice.

>>268316095
Maybe you're just getting older

>>268335123
>seething over how other people consume media
Your opinion is not objective, old man. Also, yes, I will keep on watching what I like. Who tf actually cares if a show is remembered or not? I got enjoyment out of it, and that’s all that matters to me. Most animes aren't that deep either, Get over it

>>268335402
>lived elf treading back on her past, I was prepared for comfy slice-of-life, but then they hit you over the head with le fucking mEaNiNg, inter-generational bullshit
But thats literally also CsM? How many times have we seen denji moping around and pondering about le sex or meaning of life before immediately getting humiliated again by his author for the nth time?

>>268335943
And it hasnt had spectacle or good action in ages, the gags also are all unfunny and forced. Theres a worlds difference between part 1 and part 2

>>268335943
Yeah but CSM does it differently. That's why I said it puts me in a bad mood. Unlike Frieren, CSM as a work has its own identity, but it's kind of a sadistic identity. You watch Denji getting fucked over and over, it's very straightforward. Once I realized this I figured out why it was putting me in a bad mood.

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>>268325530
How is Yugioh still a ratings king? I know the series was a hit when it first aired but reruns of Dark Magician vs Blue Eyes are somehow outselling virtually everything else 25 years on? I thought kids today were all hyped for Demon Slayer or something. You're telling me Joey vs Marik rerun is actually the bigger TV event?

>>268336103
>How is Yugioh still a ratings king?
black people are just 12% of the population but that's still a lot of share

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>>268316095
If you just only noted JJK then I would have agreed but Demon Slayers? I am a millennial too but I'm afraid you are maybe just a little bit jaded inside.

>>268335402
>I much prefer a well-executed, straightforward circus spectacle than something that half-assedly attempts to appear intellectual through a medium that is not cut for it.
Anon where did I imply that these were the only two options? Not being able to enjoy something if you can't get anything out of it besides moment-to-moment entertainment is completely fine. Pretending everyone who is this way is on some rick and morty fan behaviour and that entertainment is the only factor that should be considered is what I called out as anti-intellectual.
Also, jjk is the biggest example of a badly-executed, overlyconvoluted circus spectacle with half-assed attempts to appear intellectual I've seen in a long while. Garbage like this being excused and treated as "good" just because it's entertaining. I don't mind eating fast food slop every once in a while, it will taste good, it will take away my hunger, but I will never say it's good food and I understand why someone wouldn't want to eat it.

>>268328057
Didn't Togashi step out of shonen jump after the last batch?
He could be coming back as a seinen.

>>268333327
Americans are the eternal nouveau riche, the only people in the world who consider talking about money while eating and asking people how much they make. They're crass as fuck.

>>268333932
Tatsuya is a great artist, too bad about the sameface issue. But in some panels he reminds me of Otomo for how clean and precise he is.

>>268336290
100%, almost all shonen is, and the few that are not are the narrative equivalent of the food served in a pretty good restaurant.

>>268336256
>Pretending everyone who is this way is on some rick and morty fan behaviour and that entertainment is the only factor that should be considered is what I called out as anti-intellectual.
Certainly but in the case of a medium like comics and/or anime? I am right. Visual mediums are for dumb spectacle. I have been some kind of sophisticated connoisseur for a long time before getting to this truth. Now I willfully watch good slop and enjoy every minute of it. I still fucking hate Western media.

>>268336256
>half-assed attempts to appear intellectual I've seen in a long while.
Actually when does JJK attempt to do this? I think JJK is actually one of the works that does away with this pretense of intellectualism the most. When characters have a change of heart it's very quick and simple. If anything what irks me the most about JJK is characters like Aoi Todo who bring the bar down a notch further.

>>268320672
Something something pot kettle

>>268336077
CSM is just garbage now anon, no amount of sugarcoating and coping will change it

I re-read some of the older shonens.

> Bleach: Far worse than i remember, the only good arc is soul society, and thats no very good either.
> HxH: Fucking good, the writting is so good that made me forget the shit art.
> Zatch Bell: Decent, art gets good in the latter parts.
> Negima: Decent but rushed battle harem, theres something special about the fight this mangaka draw, they're very dynamic.
> To Love Ru: Shit, nothingvever happens, theres no plot but its in my heart, first ecchi i read.
> Naruto: Up until the first naruto x sasuke fight it's fucking good, i didn't remember how good classic naruto was, shippuden was the worst that could happen to the series.
> Yu Gi Oh: The manga is good, there isn't much of a plot but the art is good and there's something special about this card game.
> Full metal Alchemist: The anime is way better than the manga, but overall is good.
> Death Note: My opinion didn't change, really good.
> Kimetsu no Yaiba: Holy this is Bad.
> Black Clover: This is one the worst shit i've ever read.
> Boku no Hero: Decent at the beggining, deku is somehow a worst main character than asta.
> One Piece: Before the timeskip is peak shonen, everything is almost perfect. After it things get really weird, the arcs are longer and such a damn slog, the crew don't interact like they used to until egghead.
> Chainsawman: It feels like a movie, it's not the best of fujimoto works ( which is goodbye eri), but it's really good.
> Toriko: It's shit.
> Medaka box: Starts bad, get good at the middle and ends horrible. It's an alright satire about shonen tropes.
> Kenichi: It's way worse than i remember, i through that the fights were better.
> Uq Holder: Damn good, rushed at the end but way better than negima.
> JJk: It's not good, he tries to do a power system like HxH and fails miserably at it.
> Tenjou Tenge: It's shit.
> Air Gear: It's decent, and the art is good.

>>268336866
I sorta dropped it after the bomb girl and Denji gets to babysit makima's reincarnation
Power's death was a fucking hit, I didn't want her to die

>>268330979
The only true good thing is reality, all other media like books, games, movies, etc, are trash.

>>268319755
The only decent here is FMAB.
World trigger and shaman king are slog fests. And soul eater is shit.

>>268336895
>> Chainsawman: It feels like a movie
Always feel im in bizarro world when I read posts like then look at the absolute state of the manga and how much of the supposedly """"cinematic""" arc was really just the work of his assistants

>>268329762
>jjk
good looking girls anon you gay?

>>268333133
gege is likely king or queen of the shit art mangaka its like asking me about my drawing skills cause i know id never get to the other 3

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>>268335168
Naruto is not slop tho there’s a lot of really good themes and storylines there. I will admit it’s shoddy at times and the ending is pretty bad but there’s good arcs for sure that actually hit on some deeper topics.

>>268338394
Only the first two arcs are not slop.
>deeper themes
I have yet to read a more dishonest manga than Naruto. It has no respect for the deeper themes that it pretends to engage with. It is in fact the worst of the big 3 at this.

>>268338549
>I have yet to read a more dishonest manga than Naruto.
I love KnY but I feel it's one of the most dishonest manga out there. It looks engineered. Very nicely engineered.

>>268316095
All of the new shonen are far better than garbage like FMA, Warm piss, Bleach,

So no, You're just a retarded manchild who's defensive of his child cartoons.

>>268316095
The only one that's better than nu shonen is Naruto.

t.stopped reading shonen for over 10 years now and only glance at nu-shit but mostly keep reading my backlog of niche manga

>>268316095
CSM is one of the smarter shounen ever written actually. JJK is pretty basic though, I'll give you that

>>268325403
>Shonen is consumed by everyone. The average shonen fan isn't even a kid but people in their 20s
Shonen (espeically fucking Jump) is considered for tweens and teens.
Marvel and Disney are consumed by everyone but everyone knows their fucking target audience. I don't know why people who read shonen in their 30's are scared to admit it.

>>268339294
Shame Fujimoto broke down after his assistants left him

>>268339349
Weebs are stuck in that weird position where they obviously love children's media but hate it when actual kids like it.

>>268339294
CSM is fucking depressing

>>268339665
Even the nips know it. I don't know why spics and some manchild westerners refuse to admit it.

>>268333327
NTA but it's obvious even from a Canadian perspective that these authors are all doormats lmao

>>268333264
I also watched and read FMA but thought that was trash.

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>>268333450
>>268333516
>>268333733
>Huntertrannies and their copes
Nigger, Kishimoto is 100x the creator Togashit is and no amount of classic Japanese elder worship will change that.

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>>268335168
Naruto is the opposite of slop, it's a timeless masterpiece. Clorox is forgettable shonenshit.

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>>268339349
>>268339665
Nobody's afraid of admitting anything, admitting you like stuff like JJK or Naruto or AOT or HxH is very common in the mainstream and very typical as well.

I'm just pointing out that you're being stupid. Even in Japan, shonen manga have a fanbase of mainly adults anyways so they don't give a shit there either

I don't fucking know why Huntertrannies are so insecure about Naruto all the time it's obvious they feel so bad about getting mogged for years.

Naruto has nothing to do with that series, it's just classic elder worship.

On a technical and actual note, Naruto is more inspired by stuff like Blade of the Immortal or Akira and stuff like that.

>>268341309
>literal tiktok screenshot
This is a new low.

I will never understand why shonenshitters are always at each others' throats. It's so embarrassing. Like two Down's Syndrome tards wrestling on the ground or something.

>>268336598
Anon have we been reading the same manga? All that strongest bullshit phrased to sound profound that 14 yo keep regurgitating that not only completely lacks any sort of meaning but also even an ounce of an interesting idea behind it as well. The power system itself is built around superficial poorly understood scientific funfacts that the author has read in wikipedia. Cogshit, I'm youshit, ideas that don't stand even the slightest of evaluations but are still presented as deeply insightful, here is where the pretense can be clearly seen.
If I had to choose it's contemporary CSM is the one that actually does away with this pretense of intellectualism the most. It does have interesting ideas (nothing crazy) but they are within a work that presents itself as trashy and schlocky and never forces down these ideas down the readers throats. There is a vast amount of CSM readers that aren't even aware of it's existance but to those who are willing to engage with it a whole new layer is presented for their enjoyment, again it's nothing crazy, but presents ideas seldom seen in shonen that its target audience can get a lot from, this is the reason why it's treatment as almost seinen confuses me as it never pretends to be anything that it's not.

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>>268316095
>Is shonen getting dumber, or am I just old and jaded?
>I cannot find myself giving a single fuck about new shonen like JJK or Demon Slayer or Chainsaw Man (I know CSM is barely a shonen but still).
It's because you're fucking stupid.
Shounen manga makes up roughly 70% of officially published manga (so, not including self published/doujin works). Your baseline for the "modern" is three, all from one magazine, all while calling one of them "barely a shounen" which just shows how stupid you really are.
>Naruto
>more polished art
Historical revisionism at its finest, people were shitting on Naruto's art for the entire last 200 chapters, or nearly five years of the manga's run.
>>268316252
>mangaka got lazier because anime budgets went up, they know they can just chickenscratch on a page and the anime adaptation will just shove non-keyframed garbage
No that is not what happens you retarded spic, because the manga companies do not make much money from the anime. The anime production companies get the lion's share of money from anime related merch, BD sales, CDs, etc, the magazines want their manga to be good.
You're a ginormous amazing retard who just throws your feces at the wall your brain is currently inhabiting, as you have clearly had a lobotomy to reach these asinine conclusions.

>>268333370
>it is literally taboo to insult anything made by another person. Especially in terms of peers.
Mangaka and people in the industry shittalk each other all the time.
Araki published an entire book where he explicitly calls Naruto bad and Bleach a "Saint Seiya doujinshi".
The former editor in chief of Shounen Jump would call Toriyama to tell him how shit his latest ideas for DB were and said Saint Seiya was a completely mediocre work that only became successful due to its anime.

>>268342072
>Araki published an entire book where he explicitly calls Naruto bad and Bleach a "Saint Seiya doujinshi".
?

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>>268342112

>>268320525
I love Vinland Saga so much that I haven't watched any other anime since S2 ended, except for JJK, which I fucking regret now

But I'm pretty sure that Vinland Saga comes under Seinen category

>>268342153
Where does he say that tho like can you take a screenie?

It's funny how cyclical popular anime discussion is. Take a guess at how old this post is.

><sigh> I'm not one to post to this newsgroup, as I like to generally keep to myself and watch anime by myself. Still, I remember a day when I used to watch this newsgroup avidly, reading everything. Now I come back for a bit of nostalgia and I am disgusted. Exactly what I expected: Sailor Moon, moronic messages (i.e. Black Anime) and messages with HUNDREDS of responses (Ranma's best babe). It's too bad that everything cool gets murdered by the mainstream. I was filling out a Right Stuf order form when this epiphany (Joyce would be proud) came to me. Anime is dead! Pimple-faced, lame teenagers now are talking about the "cool cartoons" with the girls with big eyes, talking about how they loved Street Fighter II and Fatal Fury. The internet used to be real cool, but now we've got a buch of morons coming from all the mass media attention to the internet. Same thing is happening with anime. The mainstream society is out to kill everything that is good, capitalising on all that's great. Fuck. It sucks.
>I don't want to wave around 9000 messages, most about mainstream topics, non-anime, Sailor Moon, etc. Where the fuck did otakuism and anime obssession encorporated with sexual perversions and frustrated computer geeks? Now a bunch of fucking jocks are laughing at Ranma. Motherfuckers. I'm pissed off. Anime is dead. So now, all you fucking lamers, enjoy it.
>But I spit on Sailor Moon. And I HOPE that maybe a little bit of anime can be saved. Fuck the world.

>>268342312
And as a bonus, here's another post you can guess the age of.
>>2011
Naruto is a gateway anime of the worst kind. It's a bad series, a clusterfuck of story and characterization that isn't very well done by any aspect, but which attempts to compensate for its weaknesses by adding in excessive shipping faggotry and DARKNESS. The normal anon can see this as the shit it is, and may enjoy it, hate it or be indifferent to it, but all the while recognizing that the series itself, regardless of their opinion, is plain bad.

>However, these very aspects that try to smear over the shit of its core make it a breeding ground for aspie, unsociable underageb& faggots who engage in every kind of faggotry both online and in the real world. The superpowered characters all trying their hardest to look cool, the jutsus, peculiar, colorful clothes, the whole ninja faggotry and everything about the Naruto world fuels their escapist fantasies, while the pity-party character backgrounds, emphasis on revenge, and overall preachiness of the series make it fit just right with the mary-sueish drives of your average preteen and his sense of unwarranted self-importance towards the world. Exactly the kind of shit that makes little kiddies and underageb& retards eat this shit right the fuck up.

>Naruto is basically THE series to attract the most hated anime fanbase known to /a/, which is why, regardless of individual opinions, it is the responsibility of every anon to troll the fuck out of this show and everyone who likes it, and ensure that no Naruto threads ever encourage the newfriends to show their faces here.

>>268336103
>>268336182
That's not audience ratings, that's tv tokyo's cut of yugioh sales. it should be obvious since pokemon is below it.

>>268342072
>Araki published an entire book where he explicitly calls Naruto bad and Bleach a "Saint Seiya doujinshi".
How can Araki be this based?

>>268341413
Kys narutard spic. Narutard's entire battle system is copypasted from HxH

>>268341695
Now this is interesting because I never perceived JJK as pretending to be intellectual when it babbles about this shit. It certainly does, but it doesn't feel like it's trying to be smart about it. I'm not trying to defend it or anything, personally I think the fights get kind of bullshit-y way too often but it feels like the same bullshit as JoJo. Maybe it's because I see it a lot like JoJo that I don't see it as trying to be smart, my mind just glazes over the bullshit. I keep that suspension of disbelief which means something is being done in that regard.
On the other hand, I dunno, people love to shit on CSM here but it feels to me like one of the most raw and sincere things that came out in a while, it's just horribly depressing and cynical. I never felt like it did away with not trying to be shlock. In a sense it did, but in the way that it does not pretend, but actually gets real when it does. With CSM I always felt the author being kind of bitter and jaded coming through. I dropped it at some point but it made me feel like shit honestly.

>>268339166
Nardo is worse than trash.
>>268339255
>>268341237
>>268341309
>>268341367
>>268341413
Kys spic

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>>268322006
>DB which was the only good DB because it was comedy
This, although the adventure aspect is also a big factor in why I love it to be fair. The pilaf arc is my absolute favorite.
It honestly kinda baffles me how DB's popularity with nips started to decline with the adventure comedy format and went back up when it became purely fighting/powerlevel drivel, yet hxh is an adventure manga and Japan ate that shit up like hot cakes, they loved it.
Maybe /a/ is right, nips do have shit taste

>>268320543
Compared to what's out today? Vinland Saga is one of the best to come out for the past five years, so yeah.

>>268316252
The kimetsu no yaiba schizo seerher keeps going

>>268344822
>WAHH MY SAFE SPACE!!!!!!!
Go back to your containment thread, faggot.

>>268316095
JJK is peak, best shounen since HxH and it looks like it will actually get finished. You're just an insufferable faggot
also
>Dragon Ball
>One Piece
>Naruto
>HxH
>JoJos
>OPM
>Yu Yu Hakusho
>Ruroni Kenshin
all of these shows dogfuck your gay little moe slice of life pedo faggotry, kill yourself
shounen is the best genre of anime and anime would not be popular worldwide without it

>>268322006
It is endlessly funny how people act like they're enlightened for saying the DB anime is better than DBZ when that's the most common attempt at a contrarian opinion one can have here.

>>268332597
>original DB in particular had tons of worldbuilding and the fighting had 0 powerscaling. It was all tactics.
In original DB, I can count every "tactical" fight very easily. Everything not listed was won through raw power.
>Goku vs Jackie Chun
>Tenshinhan vs Jackie Chun
>Goku vs Tenshinhan (22nd)
>Goku vs Ma Junior
That is it.
Goku and Namu? He literally just tanks Namu's best attack and then punches him out of the sky.
Goku and literally every RRA jobber? He beats them up, the sole exception being Blue who Arale beats up. Even Tao, who beats Goku, is then just outpowered by Goku, the only difference is a couple episodes of training.
Goku and Kuririn? Goku trained his tail offscreen and Kuririn's "tactical strategy" completely fails in the face of raw strength. Same is true of Goku vs Tenshinhan in the 23rd Tenkaichi Budokai.
Goku vs King Piccolo, both times, is about raw strength.

>>268316095
>Dragonball, they all have well-explored settings
Dragon Ball is set in the world of Arale which is set in our actual world. THAT'S how little of a shit Dragon Ball gave about the setting.

>>268332597
>original DB in particular had tons of worldbuilding
Original DB is the one that put Penguin Village into the world of DB. Marvelous worldbuilding lmao

>>268346260
>>268346303
God I hate Mexicans

>>268332597
at least turn your brain on when you skim the posts you reply to

Maybe don't read manga written with the intent to pander to 12 year olds retard.

This thread can be summarized as
>"I am no longer part of the Shonen demographic anymore and hate manga that are popular"

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>>268346260
Yeah I'd always get confused about why the maps would kept changing in different parts of the series.
According to pic related NJ must be canon to dragon ball's world

>JJK shills said this was the best power system in anime
>JJK shills said gege wrote the best anime girls in anime

kek

>>268341413
>Naruto has nothing to do with that series
There's literally an interview with Kishimoto talking how he tried to copy Togashi's YYH characters and how much he loves Togashi.
So cringe to read retards thinking they know it better than the fucking writers themselves.

>>268349088
the girls in JJK are objectively more interesting than the boring color coded shit that most manga default to
I love my tsundere waifus very much but after 100000 times you see the same character it gets fucking boring

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>>268323433
>Naruto
>soft seinen
Naruto is a show for toddlers bro, the writing is terrible

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>>268351248
Naruto didn't get cancelled so it obviously is better than Clorox that did.

Even in the age department Naruto fans are older lmao.

Bleachtroons can't catch a break lmao everybody knows their shit manga is garbage

>>268322891
I think they were retarded but had more complex settings.

>>268351303
>Narutofags are nostalgialards
>Bleach continues to get new fans
That's all that chart really says

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>>268351871
lmao except the charts also show that Bleach is seen as even worse than Boruto. Even Boruto is more liked than Clorox

It's over lmao even in 2024, Bleach is below Boruto and Naruto.

>>268317301
Nah. Naruto shits all over JJK it's not even funny.

>>268351944
This doesn't disprove the Naruto fans are all actually nostalgialards statement.

>>268352047
Yeah it does because even in 2024, Bleach is less liked than Boruto and Naruto.

Your garbage series is less liked than BORUTO which is still ongoing kek

Never forget it. The whole world sees Bleach as trash.

>>268336895
>HxH: the writting is so good
Yes, let's have the arc where the main conflict is acquiring money to happen right after the arc that introduces a fighting skycraper where our MC's can easily acquire large amounts of money.

>>268336895
>kenichi
such a weird manga
always felt as if the author had no idea if they wanted to make pure ecchi or just a regular martial arts shonen

>>268336945
That spoiler moment honestly just felt like a gut punch for no real reason. Yes, it makes sense for the villain's plan, but then... The villain loses anyway.
CSM gets put in the same category as JJK, it's misery porn because the mangaka loves the villains more than the protagonist. A lot of people joke that Denji isn't even a protag anymore and fucking Yuji never was.
A lot of these newer mangaka are still on that game of thrones mentality of just trying to shock the reader and passing that off as good writing (except game of thrones, contrary to popular belief, DIDN'T kill characters just for shock value, at least while the show was following the books).

In fact, Nobara's death in JJK is literally exactly the same as Power's death in CSM. Except it's even more pointless, it served absolutely no reason and killed off a character before they ever even had a chance to do anything.

>>268341695
JJK's power system is not that bad desu.
There are 3 core abilities (curse energy, reverse curse energy, simple domain) everyone can learn and those can be modified by using them with a persons innate technique (innate technique, reverse technique, domain expansion).

>>268341413
hxhtards are like bleachtards
all they do is get laughed at so they're massively insecure

>>268332960
I can see why the manga was canceled years ago

>>268342072
>it happens all the time
>mentions one specific mangaka that is known for being weird
yeah, okay buddy

>>268342178
It does, it's why season 2 filtered out all the zoomzooms who started complaining about NOT ENOUGH FITES UGH I HATE FARMING
despite season 2 being much better than 1 in every way

>>268342203
I've read the book and I don't recall him ever mentioning Naruto outside of praising it as a good title so I'm assuming the bleach line is also a lie.

>>268342312
i mean, sailor moon is shit so he wasn't wrong

>>268343977
hxh and db shouldn't ever be in the same sentence when it comes to popularity
db at the height of it's popularity sold more in one volume than the entirety of hunter x hunter
people really forget how fucking insanely popular DB became worldwide, it's probably the only reason the vast majority of the people in this board even know what anime/manga is

>>268345148
>calls others pedo
>defending the one series featuring a normalized pedophile
you can't make this shit up

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>>268352652
>db at the height of it's popularity sold more in one volume than the entirety of hunter x hunter
Hunter x Hunter has sold 85 million copies in Japan alone, retard. That's 2.3 million copies per volume, which is more than double of Bleach's volume sales.
Hunter x Hunter is not some niche series, you fucking retard.

>>268352221
i will never be angrier than the time I get to the chimera ant arc, the PEAK of the series and an ABSOLUTE MASTERPIECE according to literally fucking everyone
And it was so fucking bad it made me completely lose interest in the series.

>>268333257
That's not saying anything about his art.

>>268316095
>is shonen getting dumber?
Yeah because everyone is dumber. Surprised???

>>268352801
85 million copies for a series that's been around as long as Dragonball.

Motherfucker, HXH isn't even on the fucking top 20.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_best-selling_manga

No one's calling it niche, but comparing to any of the top dogs (even Bleach, which sucks balls) is laughable.

>>268352801
>schizo hxhtranny thinks everyone is a bleach fan
bleach is shit and it still sold twice as much as hxh
cope, you mentally ill retard

>>268352993
>>268352945
NTA but HxH has sold more than Bleach per volume lol

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>>268352945
In terms of sales per volume, HxH is one of the best-selling series of all time. And the list is a bit outdated. It's 2.3 million per volume in Japan alone. They don't even give us the international numbers.
>>268352993
Who has to cope with that?

>>268352801
>>268352945
Your own link shows HxH sells more per volume retard. Bleach has more sales simply because it had more volumes on average.
>Hunter x Hunter
2.33 million/per volume.
>Bleach
1.75 million/per volume.

>>268316095
NAME A SMART SHONEN