Antispiral was unironically in the right. Simon had no plan to prevent the spiral nemesis from eventually happening, his entire "plan" was just saying "lol we'll figure it out when we get there." All the antispiral wanted was to prevent the destruction of the universe, which now seems inevitable thanks to Simon's actions.
>>274507854He wanted to prevent the destruction of the universe but his method made the universe a place not worth living in. Pretty straightforward.
Simon's plan was his own personal commitment, which was strong enough that he let his waifu stay dead instead of doing anything entropy defying to bring her back.
>>274507854>hurr durr i interpret a fantastical narrative literally and i see how it all works and le bad dude is le ackshually le right and based and the protagonist is le dumb haha i'm so intelligent looking at fiction and symbolism as all literal factual events *brap* Let me guess Kyuubey was right about entropy too and the god from the old testament is a big meanie, right?
which super robot taisen game allows simon and lord genome to survive?
>>274508093You seem upset.
Whats the point of keeping the universe alive if everyone is going to live in shit and misery?
>>274508248Answer then. I'm right aren't I?Subhuman IQ unable to understand narrative structures and symbolism are rotten garbage in dire need of removal
>when you realize that antispiral is a spiteful mutantThe will of humanity will always dominate the will of weak pathetic jealous turds
>>274507854Why couldn't the Antispiral just install satellites that drained their spiral energy? That way humans could live normal lives on their planet without fear of them expanding into space. It would also mean they'd never be able to contact other spiral races.
>>274508331Kyubey wasn't in the right because Madoka showed there was another way that actually worked, and the Old Testament God's morality made sense for a jealous ethnic war deity. Simon still remains dumb for not having a serious plan to prevent spiral energy from destroying the universe.
>>274508093OT God was actually pretty generous as long as you had his approval. He spared an entire city just so Lot and his two daughters would have a place to live, after he told them to live in the mountains instead. Even though Lot and his daughters immediately afterward decided to go to the mountain anyway, the city was still spared and Lot was not punished.
>>274508297Still better than not existing at all.
>>274507854Imagine being so stupid that you watch a cartoon about the human spirit overcoming all odds and still think some dumbass equation some retards cooked up is gonna stop humanity.
>>274508445>Kyubey wasn't in the right because Madoka showed there was another way that actually workedSure but how was Kyubey supposed to know you could literally wish away the problem?
The worst part is that Simon was a cuck
>>274509261>any man that isnt some fuck you got mine sigma male is a cuckFaggot.
>>274508093>>274508331Why are you so ass blasted? Imagine being this angry on Christmas lmao.
>>274509067>dude, I enjoy autofellative fiction, that makes me fell that all my problems will go away if I keep enduring and lashing out instead of thinking about how to actually solve the problemHuman spirit is escapists for schmucks who want to feel special for existing. No amount of gigachad memes will change that.Now post some pseudo-ironic shit, like the dog that you are.
does anybody have a rip of the parallel works? i remember it was on youtube once upon a time, but now it's bare.
>>274509656>Love & Rock Love & Rock, Peace!!
>>274507854Kamina was right. In the same way Eren Yeager was right. The world is your birthright. So far as you're willing to reach out and fight for it.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BHvWvqPeOSUIt's been fun, Simone.
>>274507854yeah but the lesson of GL is to just not think about stuff like that or to use logic, just BELIEVE HARDER otherwise you're a bad guy
>>274507854Eventual destruction is better than eternal stagnation. By the patterns we see in this universe, it could be surmised that something new would be born from the ashes
>>274509341TTGL is the story of Simon maturing into a sigma male. When the anti-spiral told him spiral life was going to ultimately destroy the universe his response was just "nah". No thought, no reasoning, no justification. The anti-spirals were a problem in his way and he fixed that.
>>274508093>Let me guess Kyuubey was right about entropy too and the god from the old testament is a big meanie, right?NTA, but yes.
>>274508093I somewhat need to agree. "Villain was right" narratives are getting kinda old at this point, and usually comes down to a writer either not being clear enough or overlooking something. Originally it was either just shitposting, finding a villain cool, or the writer actually making the villain turn out to be right. Nowadays it has turned into this strange thing where people suddenly look at villains literally and examine every single thing like they're something to analyze. If a villain makes some general observations about society people will hoot and holler about how they were actually in the right, even though rest of the story is about them burning kittens alive.
this song sends shivers to my spine.https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lYAgQSk2WMg
>>274510350Good fiction doesn't have "villains".
>>274507854You were filtered. The point was "we can use the power responsibly and not nuke ourselves". It was proven by: using the power responsibly and accepting his wife's death.
>>274510661It does, you're stupid. Villains are just as necessary as morally gray situations.
>>274507854>"lol we'll figure it out when we get there."However, that's exactly how they defeated Lordgenome, liberated humanity and got them into the position to fight the anti-spiral in the first place.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2ejPTQxQGz4
>>274507854The hero who protects the universe and the selfish villain who will destroy it
>>274510661you are 14 years old
>>274510350One could just as easily say you're ignoring any valid points the villains might bring up because they were also shown doing bad things. If a hero does some good deeds people will hoot and holler about how they were completely right, even though rest of the story is about them failing to address the issues raised by villain.
>>274510140and then he lost his wife and became a bum while Rossiu became the leader of the world
>>274507854>"lol we'll figure it out when we get there."don't forget that he immediately gave up after that and spent the rest of his life as bum lmao
>>274507854The core tragedy of spiral energy was that each person eventually becomes their own personal universe, a god of their own galaxy. Their powers continue to expand and reach absurd levels until the universe inevitably collapses into itself.This problem is averted by not using spiral energy to "solve death", hence why Nia was allowed to vanish. Why Simon refuses to use his spiral energy to avoid the inevitable.It's a very heavy, multi-layered theme that ends up with a compromise. Simon decides not to give into the Spiral Nemesis or the Anti-spiral and ends on proactive advancement within the boundaries of sensible lifespans.This is further compounded by the final scene where simon tells the boy drilling the coconut to "drill slowly".
>>274510350>The narrative is bad because I personally misunderstand it.You need to put some effort into it yourself.A writer can tell you something, but if you refuse to understand it, no amount of logic will ever convince you. You NEED to be open and receptive.
>>274514451>the problem is averteduntil some time in the future when someone who doesn't share Simon's restraint ends up destroying existence
>>274514636That's what law enforcement is like. You can bet your ass someone will decide to put a limit on the use of spiral energy to avoid death.
>>274514669>someone will decide to put a limit on the use of spiral energyand then that guy will get punched in the face like everyone else who gets in the way of a spiral
>>274514570What if a person understands the writer's intended message but disagrees with it?
>>2745147561 spiral man vs several galaxies of unified spirals who collectively agreed not to end the universe>>274514818Then you gotta actually provide a counter-argument but it's best to start off with an opener that demonstrates your understanding and isn't just a criticism that's already been addressed in the work itself.
>>274508093I just got a weird question: Did they actually solve the problem in the end?
>>274513238>the heroA dictator that protects the universe by enslaving literally everyone in it>selfish villainA rebel that wants to free his people.There's also the matter of perspective- antispiral thinks that protecting the universe is all that matters, regardless of what life is in that universe. Not everyone has to share that view, so doesn't that make him "selfish" too? He imposes his view onto literally everyone else.
>>274507929FPBP
>>274507929This is really all that needed to be said.
>>274509141By being less up his own ass and considering the possibility he's not right about everything. Lmao
>>274507854>Antispiral was unironically in the rightHe wanted to "protect" the universe by making everyone a lifeless unchanging drone. Many would argue even destruction is preferable. See >>274507929>Simon had no plan to prevent the spiral nemesis from eventually happeningAnd immediately after winning he let his wife die, showing self restraint, then left the governing to a guy that already lived his whole life in a place that had to have self control when it comes to reproducing(Rossiu). So no fucktard, he had a plan and the ending showed it.
>>274514980Who? Jews, Madokas, Gurren Laganns?
>>274514841>1 spiral man vs several galaxies of unified spirals who collectively agreed not to end the universeoh you're right that's impossible, no future spiral man could ever challenge insurmountable odds and win, reasonable consensus has won the war forever
>>274515427yeah you're right there's a miniscule chance that some retarded ape could win against multiple galaxies of stronger, more intelligent and righteous people.Better consign ourselves to caves and live in fear and anxiety forever, that's far more sensible.
>>274515526>miniscule chanceciting probability is very unspiral of you>multiple galaxies of stronger, more intelligent and righteous people.people change their minds, new generations adopt new outlooks, the idea these people will remain the same forever is completely at odds with the nature of the spiral >Better consign ourselves to caves and live in fear and anxiety forever, that's far more sensible.it depends on how much risk you feel is acceptable for all of existence, maybe it's a gamble you're willing to take, but don't pretend it isn't a gamble just because there's a consensus currently
>>274515742>it depends on how much risk you feel is acceptable for all of existence,Oh NOW you're coming around to Simon's philosophy when you're cornered. Fuck off retard.
>>274515427>>274515526>>274515742>>274515808I kinda feel like both of you are actually on the same side, you just phrase your posts in a way that makes it seem like you aren't.
too long to write out here, screencapped instead. what gurren lagann means to me
>>274507854It's pretty silly because they could provide comfy worlds in which there are few wants and simply put mechanisms in place to cull high-spiral individuals at birth, but they instead keep everyone in poverty planets because their universal management sucks. Their problem is that they themselves despaired, so they think despair is the only possible motivator. They set up a system in which people will always want, always strive, ultimately setting the stage to be overcome. It's like Thanos where there is a problem and the solution kind of works but not really.
>>274515211I know Nia dying is supposed to be important to "themes" or some other bullshit but realistically speaking, no one would actually pick that option if they had the chance to keep their loved ones. Even bringing back Kamina would have zero consequences. They say "they'd get in the way" but not really, the casualties of the spiral war weren't that many and the vast majority were not gone for very long.The most confusing aspect of the ending is the part about the "next generation" which never had any build up of any kind throughout the entire franchise outside that one singular moment, which is irrelevant anyway because Simon himself *is* the new generation, being a mere 20 years old at the time of that part.
>>274514242Blessed NEETdom or a lifetime of work and political bullshit, I know which one I'm picking.
>>274514980That's not the point. The point is that you shouldn't stop living just because of what ifs. Simon begins the series too scared to do anything, Kamina is his courage. There are plenty of times Simon wants to run away and return back to his stagnant life in the village just because it's not scary.But living a life of stagnation because you're too scared of things that MAY happen is the same as waiting to die. It's not living at all. Better to live 80 years free than forever a slave.
>>274516914>I know Nia dying is supposed to be important to "themes" or some other bullshit but realistically speaking, no one would actually pick that option if they had the chance to keep their loved ones.You'd be fucking surprised what people actually did and still do in various parts of the world.Anyway, the argument was "simon had no plan going forward" and the counter was "he did have a plan, and here's proof of what he's doing".
>>274514451I assumed the spiral nemesis was the universe becoming India/China with uncontrollable birth rates?
>>274515211There are two problems with this:The first is that non-spiral life exists, and does not pose a threat to the universe. Most animal life is not spiral based. The beastmen are not spiral based. The Antispirals shed their spiral bodies, etc. The universe can still have thriving civilizations as long as they are not SPIRAL in nature, so such to be you if you evolved spiral power but the entire rest of the universe needs you to fuck off so they can live. The second is that Simon's promise is beyond his grasp. He didn't make a promise to prevent the spiral nemesis from happening today, or tomorrow. He made that promise, on behalf of all future spiral lifeforms that will ever be born, forever. What happens when one of the other spiral races out there in the galaxy decides it doesn't want to play nice and thinks that a spiral war is based, actually? If you don't use spiral power to fight back, you die and they cause the spiral nemesis. If you use your spiral power to combat theirs, congrats you have a spiral arms race and you are rushing headlong towards the spiral nemesis together. Its lose-lose, and it only takes one bad actor to fuck the universe over for everyone.
>>274517532Pretty much. And a white(ish) guy was trying to say that people actually have self control (shame he didn't specify which people, as clearly not all have self control).
>>274515211I still find it questionable Rossiu even got elected given he ditched most of Earth when the Anti Spirals showed up.
>>274517575>The beastmen are not spiral based.And they don't reproduce last I checked.>The universe can still have thriving civilizations as long as they are not SPIRAL in natureAs demonstrated by the Antispirals? Nah man, what they showed wasn't a thriving civilisation, but a prison planet of stagnation.So you're wrong, the only 2 examples of non-spirals either don't reproduce or have no civilisation to speak of.
>>274508966Why?
>>274517575>Most animal life is not spiral based. >they are though, any animal that reproduces has spiral energy and will eventually evolve into a form that's better at harnessing it>The beastmen are not spiral based.that's because the're all clones iirc
The movie gave Viral his own mech because he's evolving. Even cloned creatures like Beastmen will eventually evolve if exposed to enough spiral energy. That was the whole significance in giving him that mech to begin with.
Just giga drill breaker the excess spiral energy
>>274517869The manga gave Viral a loli version of Adiane as his daughter.
>>274508093Yes
>i will shatter reality itself to achieve my goals. I will break the universe to do this. nothing can stop me.>TOUCH THE UNTOUCHABLE >BREAK THE UNBREAKABLE>ROW ROW>FIGHT DA POWAH>oh noooooo my wife id dying>it cant be helped
>>274519092>>it cant be helpedit SHOULDN'T be helped*If he saves his wife he sets a precedent that you should use spiral power to solve all your problems, prevent everyone from dying. Then the spiral nemesis happened.
>>274519173>b-b-b-b-but spiral nemesis!!They would find a way to overcome it.
>>274519092>Simon spends the entire final battle telling the Anti Spiral that he's full of shit and that he can do better>Immediately get tested with Nia's death>Simon stays true to his word and doesnt bring her backIts not that fucking complicated.
>>274507929Truth
>>274515742It's not a gamble. Humanity isn't that stupid.
>>274516914Simon would, he understood the spiral nemesis. Reviving one person just leads to reviving more people. Why not keep reviving people? What makes one person worth reviving over someone else? When would it stop? The decision to stop using spiral power to go against nature was a self sacrifice, and one that Simon took because of his pledge to stop the spiral nemesis. He wouldn't just immediately go back on his word and abuse spiral power.
>>274507929Thank you and goodnight
>>274507854>Do the impossible >No we can't revive the dead that's not responsible
>>274519092Yeah it should be.Do the thing to beat the power structure but within reason because using that same power is wrong because suffering
>>274509620Simon not using Spiral Power to bring Nia back, living simply, and having Rossiu run an Earth government that reaches out to other Spiral races seem like pretty reasonable steps towards avoiding Spiral Nemesis.If you're going to post like someone who just discovered nihilism and/or rationalism as a worldview, try not to post like a 14-year-old ESL on top of it
>>274524054Him letting Nia go also puts him in contrast with Lordgenome on several levels: staying strong instead of succumbing to despair like Spiral Warrior Lordgenome in the Parallel Works, cherishing Nia instead of running through mindless daughterwives like bored tyrant Lordgenome, and letting others make their own decisions instead of exerting his will as Lordgenome did.
>>274509620There is a place for both. TTGL is a nice story about an insecure, neurotic kid growing into a strong, responsible and capable man. The series, and even himself, acknowledge that all the members of Team Dai-Gurren are a bunch of retards who know nothing but fight and they would be utterly incapable of making the hard logical choices that Rossiu made, which is why even Simon refuses to see Rossiu as a villain and why they entrust the government to him.>>274514636>>274507854>>274517575The anti-spiral weren't all-powerful or invincible. We already saw that countless other civilizations already tried to fight them and it was precisely because countless others tried to fight them why humans found a way to destroy their spiral sea.The anti-spiral "plan" was to rule the universe with an iron grip and hope that nobody ever becomes stronger than them. As we already saw, it was only a matter of time before an spiral race strong enough to kill them appeared. Then what? The humans of Team Dai-Gurren were kind and wanted to leave peacefully; but what if it was a bloodthirsty race instead or the leader was evil? Then spiral nemesis would've occurred as soon as the anti-spiral died.Their plan was just plain retarded. They were making the exact same mistakes Lordgenome was making on Earth.
What even IS spiral nemesis, and why cant it be defeated?
>>274524633Reverse heat death of the universeCosmic cancer
>>274524266>they were making the same mistake as lordgenomeAnd the chief of Simon's village. Woooaaaawaaaa it's almost like Gurren Lagann has a fractal narrative structure from the most local human community to the entire universe wwwoaaawwaaaieeeeCongratz you figured it out
>>274507854Getter chads would have solod both problems easily doughbeit
>>274507854Simon proved there's nothing people can't do if they really want to, and nobody can stop them, not antispiral, or spiral nemesis, and nobody could show him wrong. The end.
>>274516030>be stupid every time>no matter what happened, might happen or will happenexcept when your girlfriend gets sick, then make absolutely sure you aren't stupid and be very afraid of taking action out of fear of what will happen
>>274524972>nothingwell, except that one thing
>>274507854>Simon had no plan to prevent the spiral nemesis from eventually happening, his entire "plan" was just saying "lol we'll figure it out when we get there."He has seen the result of the other path, namely Lordgenome's plan. It didn't work. So he's trying something new, and yeah, it might not work out, but he knows for a fact the prior method wasn't working.
>>274507854Constant transmutation will simply increase until it reaches the singularity and resets the universe.
>>274515028Not everyone has Simon's wisdom to use power correctly. It's fucking idealism to think that giving divine powers to thousands of people, the majority of whom do not have the maturity or wisdom to use them, will not end in chaos and total destruction.
>>274524633it's essentially spiral power getting so out of control that every organism generates a galaxy worth of spiral power, causing everything to just collapse into a black hole that eats the universeif spiral power is left unchecked, this is inevitable because spiral life only seeks to move forwardIt's not a physical "thing" you can defeat, it's just an inherent property of spiral organisms. The two ways to deal with it are the anti spiral way, and the simon way. In the anti spiral method you just put the universe in a stranglehold and prevent all spiral organisms from evolving and progressing, in order to stop them from ever getting to the point where they can trigger it. In the simon way, they go out and visit all the spiral races and they'll tell everyone about it, so they can choose not to go out of control with spiral power of their own will.Simon is the first one to directly go on this path, he stopped using spiral power pretty much completely after he freed the universe. Not only was it a very good symbolic step and allows him to be a role model for everyone else, but also Simon himself was so powerful he was close to spiral nemesis tier power. And using spiral power will empower others around you, so him using the power means he could be inspiring spiral nemesis tier power in other people which would cause a chain reaction. So him not using it is his first step towards preventing the spiral nemesis from occurring
I find it weird that they decided to make it so guys who died in the show didn't in the movies.For this show where they changed their minds about what they were making part way through they changed their minds again after they finished.There are some drawbacks because of it but I think I like the change for the most part.
>>274507854The Anti Spiral is now a Gen Alpha meme
>>274507854>stop antispiral>world didn't blow up??Looks like they were right
>>274507854Simon at the end lead by example. He did not impose his ideals on others in order to ensure the prevention of the spiral nemesis. His actions at the end are a direct contrast to the tyrannical nature of the anti-spirals who tried to dictate the way of life for all life forms throughout the known universe.
>>274524633The show quite literally explains it both verbally and visually
>>274526923Thanks for the explanation, I don't think I even paid attention outside of the fight itself.But the Simon way sounds a little dumb because you're giving everyone in the world a power that just grows to a point that destroys everything and then tell them not to use it.Eventually someone will, and it doesn't really matter how much pushback it gets because Simon himself went from a weak human to destroying the anti spiral, it'll always be possible to overcome a restriction and the very restriction will inflame people to do it.
>>274507854>Simon had no plan to prevent the spiral nemesis from eventually happeningso what? Things aren't meant to last forever. The universe exists for humans to live in, and if that results in the eventual destruction of the universe, so be it. Also, frankly, those anti-spirals are alien subhumans and should be destroyed regardless.
>>274527657At least they're developing some taste.
>>274508093Taking Kyubey for his word.Scientifically speaking, the Heat Death is one of the possible endings.Logically though, the Heat Death is gonna happen trillions, billions of years into the future meaning it is a non-factor as far as existential threats come. Which really makes you wonder, with what little context we have why the Incubators (an alien race probably existing around the same time as us) would care so much about something that happens billions of years from now. By that point, who knows if humanity would be around to even freeze to death.It'd be like caring about how fucked Europe is gonna be when there is a land bridge between Europe and Africa, with the potential dry up and disappearance of the Med.
who the fuck is kyubey
>>274534317Qiubei represents an hypothetical, fictional ultra-advanced emotionless alien (aka. The Spock). The average mongrel won't think about the situation on the land bridge in Europe. They only think of the short-term. What about this ultra-advanced emotionless civilization? It is the opposite. Because it's emotionless, it cares no more of the future than of the present. Why would it care that a situation is "the present"?Think of an AI. It's like an AI. It doesn't care about anything. It merely sees a threat, runs a calculation and prevents it. There is no human element that says "who the fuck cares about Europe?" It looks at the situation and, no matter how negligible it is, if it's on the database, it cares about it.
>>274507854>>274524633there's a bunch of sci-fi jargon you can pick apart but ultimately the whole spiral thing is just a metaphor for hope/faith and despair in society.that you can look back at mankind's history and see an escalating cycle progression and devastation and think that it's not sustainable (ie Malthusianism and other defeatist theories). but also that we have overcome every obstacle as a species so far and should have faith that future generations will overcome theirs as well.
>>274507854>>274507929Honestly, he was arguably right, but I can't actually blame Simon and the humans in general for fighting back.He basically reveled the truth WAY too late, in the worst possible circumstances. That being said, Simon would have never accepted the Anti-Spiral's way of handling things (for also understandable reasons), but he would have likely acted more diplomatically if the AS acted more carefully.In the end it was a classic battle of a very white good vs grey.
>>274507929FPBPtotal execution death for all zoomers and statists
>>274508445Kyubey is more relative, he's (they're? it's a collective entity with a single personailty and many bodies IIRC) an alien with an inhuman mindset. The path he chose worked, the distress it caused the MS is secondary, Kyubey might not even have considered it a problem in any way.
>>274510350Honestly, the AS and Kyubey aren't bad examples because they're aliens with an alien way of seeing things, and the plans they had fundamentally worked, and it was important for someone to do something.They had alien solutions which were abhorrend to us humans.BUT then you have actualy people villains who get introduced by murdering a bunch of innocent bystanders, kill a child while laughing manically and make this stupid evil fuckface I hate so much and later we are supposed to feel sympathy because they had a hard childhood and the cause they stand for isn't utterly bad. Bonus points if they're a persecuted minority and they're the best example for why the persection is a right thing to do.
>>274524266In the end Lordgenome and the Anti-Spiral could have solved the issue by killing all life on their respective domains, but neither wanted to do that.Lordgenome wanted his species to live, and I personally think the AS also didn't want a dead lifeless universe, and tried to make a compromise.
>>274518347Cute.
What I want to know is how were the Anti-spiral even powerful in the first place? Without Spiral power they were at a huge disadvantage, so how did they manage to subdue every Spiral race in the Universe up until Simon defeated them?
Underestimated point:I love how the victorious humans just integrated the beastmen into their society.It's a nice touch.
>>274535887>I love how the victorious humans just integrated the beastmen into their society.I can't imagine how much restraint it took not to exterminate the furry filth outright. Thankfully they're infertile so it was a wise decision to let them contribute to society a little before they become extinct.
>>274527657I had to look up what they're doing.It's interesting to know that my youtube interests must have near zero overlap with those of power scale fags since I haven't seen this spam at all despite other people saying it's inescapable.
>>274527657What are they even doing here? I don't get it
>>274508297Buy time to find a better solution?
>>274522032
>>274507854Lost like a little bitch, so he wouldn't be able to prevent anything anyway
>>274538159My favorite is the webm where the Antispiral spends half a minute charging the universe sized Giga Drill Break only for Chirico to effortlessly sidestep it.
