Old East Slavic edition>What language(s) are you learning?>Share language learning experiences!>Ask questions about your target language!>Help people who want to learn a new language!>Participate in translation challenges or make your own!>Make frens!Read the wiki:https://4chanint.miraheze.org/wiki/The_Official_/int/_How_to_Learn_A_Foreign_Language_Guide_WikiUseful links:>Free language-learning book archive:https://mega.nz/folder/INlRkAQC#CthKI9-_kmDNyrOx12Ojbw>Books on linguistics and language courses:https://mega.nz/#F!Ad8DkLoI!jj_mdUDX_ay-8D9l3-DbnQ>Assorted language resources and some nice visual guides:https://pastebin.com/ACEmVqua>Torrents with more resources than you'll ever need for 30 plus languages:https://archive(dot)ph/x0dFH>List of trackers for most language-learning packs:https://files.catbox.moe/nmrn8x.txt>Ukrainianon's list of commercial courses from rutracker.org:https://archive(dot)is/R2feT>Russianon’s list of comprehensible input resources:https://docs.google.com/document/d/1wXd0V32TjCFsr1-F_en_lA4MI-i7JtyYf26cWLtPRec>Massive collection of textbooks on various languages, sorted by familyhttps://theswissbay.ch/pdf/Books/Linguistics/>/lang/ inpoot torrentshttps://rentry.org/inpootOld bread:>>201962798Old challenge:>>201963072Uncorrected challenges:>French >>202000759>German >>201966994 >>201967184>Korean >>201965342>Portuguese >>201965963
Polish is still a meme language. I'm sorry but it's just how it is haha
What is the point of the picrel? Slavic stems from Old Church Slavonic, which later develops into Old Russian in the East
>>202019595poleaf psyop please ignore
>>202019595>Polish is le dialect of Russ-- NOOOOOO!!! DON'T LOOK IT UP!!!!!!
>>202019595OSL is just a literary edition of the Solun dialect of Proto-Slavic, which was later used as liturgical language for Orthodox Slavs. Old Russian is based on a very different set of dialects with their own changes from Proto-Slavic, which is why in modern Russian there's a shitton of words with two forms, a native russian one, and an OSL loanword: нёбo and нeбo, oдёжa and oдeждa, cтoлб and cтoлп, etc.
>>202019577Sasha post some pictures of your feet or bussy pls
>>202019883Kill yourself!
Aaaaaaaaaaah I can’t even understand this simple children’s book after 40 hours of studying French. I’m a fucking pathetic piece of utter crap.
>>202020064Post yourself!
>>202020304The pathetic part isn't that you can't understand it after only 40 hours, but that you think you should be able to understand it after only 40 hours
>>202019577Define a meme language.
>>20202054040 hours is roughly the amount of time required to read War and Peace entirely. In other words, I’ve been studying French for the same amount of time the average person would read a 1400-pages long book and I still can’t even read children’s literature. This is pathetic no matter how you spin it.
>>202018429good I hope so, gman>>202018631>Many can read, few can write. Some of the younger generation even find it hard to read.writing I understand; they can be quite complicated, and it's probably not that useful (but vghful) to be able to write them from memory.if they can read they at least know which simplified character a given traditional character corresponds to. even if they can't produce the traditional version from memory, they know it when they see it. that's the most important thing I suppose.I guess one could just use some tool to auto-convert a traditional text to simplified or convert one's simplified writing to traditional, but that's cheating. I wonder if you won't forget the tones (for less common words than this example) if you only use standard Pinyin input, like entering "xiexie" and picking "1 謝謝" (xie4xie / xièxie) from the list, without entering or seeing any tones? maybe not as a native speaker? I installed a keyboard that lets me enter "xie4xie -> xièxie" so I can write Pinyin with diacritics for the tones. but it doesn't let me pick characters afterwards, so I can only use it to write down pronunciation.IPA tones with little numbers are also useful for learners. they can account for sandhi and other syllable combination effects, which the Pinyin doesn't show you (but native speakers probably do automatically):>/ɕi̯ɛ51 ɕi̯ɛ1/ - pitch goes from 5 (all the way up) to 1 (all the way down), then toneless syllable assimilates to 1 where the pitch is after the previous syllable
>>202021524tl;dr would be cool to have a keyboard where I can enter "xie4xie" and get a list of only words with the correct tones, not all "xie?xie?" words.I know there are alternative writing systems for Mandarin, maybe I should try them
>>202021172The people reading War and Peace already know the language and can probably read at a high school or college level thoughbeit. That's like 10 years older than the expected age for one of these children's book, so you need to multiply the hours by 10 to account for that.Come back to this one after you've been studying for 400 hours and you'll be amazed.
>>202019595OCS is just another name for Old Bulgarian. Other Slavic languages developed from different dialects
>>202020304What's your vocab size
>>202022388I’ve only read one graded readers so far (Short Stories in French for Beginners).
>gman + glowie = glowmanalways good to see that other people have used your made-up word already
>>202021172the average person would not read such a book at allbut ok they have read the book, and now? how much have they actually learned? if you had read a 1400-pages book on the French language you'd have learned quite a lot, but it is much harder and more active than just passively consuming a book for pleasure. so this is an unfair comparison. 40 hours aren't a lot in language learning; don't be so hard on yourself.
>>202023118>the average person would not read such a book at allMost people don't actually read as many books as they claim to. Especially when it comes to the ridiculously long ones, they skim through them then brag about it. lol
>>202019443Please rate my Spanish accent. This is me reading a lesson from the Assimil textbook.https://voca.ro/1jwAHkQdGTLmI'm going for the peninsular dialect.
>>2020237638/10
>>202021172No way you can be this retarded. Please be trolling.
Conocí a un políglota ayer. Hablamos en francés, español, inglés y francés. Una singular experiencia.
>>202024056>francésQuiero decir alemán
>>202024103By an ugly bitch*
>>202024103I want one that will teach me my TL
Why are Japanese learners such snobs? Nigga, you’re learning a language that’s only spoken in a minuscule island to the extreme east full of people that would hate your existence if you decided to live there. Sit down, be humble, you’re not special just because you watch unsubbed anime.
>>202025187>because you watch unsubbed animemost of them can't even do that kek
>>202019595>Slavic stems from Old Church Slavonichow mentally ill from brain-fucking do you have to be, to just accept that some guys writing down Nitra Slavic is the origin of languages that split earlier?
>>202025187>minuscule japan is the 11th most populated country after mexico and has the third/fourth largest economy
Update:I'm still learning German, now French in addition. Strangely enough, German pronunciation seems more difficult, maybe because there are many similar sounds but strangely placed. In French, sentences are hard because sometimes you don't say the end of a word, other times you do (and I have the impression that ending jumps to the beginning of the next word, but maybe it's just a matter of stress on another syllable, I have a similar thing with Russian). I hate Peppa the Pig.
>>202026915Didn't you have german since middle school(gimnazjum), I think most people have german as a second foreign language in Poland.I had it, but then like a silly billy I switched to another language in high school.
>>202025398end of the day it stems from PIE. But 'slavic' was just some odd dialect of bulgarian they spoke and wrote down, which the rest later copied
>>202027263That's not true, Bulgarian was the first to use the cyrillic script, which was never used by west Slavic languages btw. It doesn't mean that Bulgarian was the original or whatever. Every Slavic language developed independently from common Slavic.
>>202027255Not him but I've had three years of it in elementary and my German never progressed past "hande hoch" and "nicht schiessen".Ditto for French, had two years in liceum, can't speak for shit.Learning languages in a public school is a joke, I don't think any of my classmates had actually learned anything.
>>202026915> (and I have the impression that ending jumps to the beginning of the next wordhttps://www.lawlessfrench.com/pronunciation/enchainement/i feel like this also happens in english sometimes
>>202028057Yeah, if you don't put any work then you won't learn, but if you have a good teacher, he can help you with certain things and you'll progress faster, but most people don't care, especially at that age, you're right.
>>202026915it's great if you can get all the pronunciation right from the beginning, but if some sounds don't work yet I wouldn't obsess over it and just learn words and grammar for now.as you learn more words with the sound (listen on Forvo) and hear them used in different contexts (find in video on Youglish), it should hopefully work itself out. shadow (i.e. repeat after) them or try to pronounce using the IPA. most mispronunciations are not random but always the same sound, so people will still understand when if you talk to them. dialects are basically like those mispronunciations from a Standard German perspective, and those people we also have to understand. Swiss "German" is more different than any foreigner could manage to mispronounce Standard German.>>202028057>Hände hoch! - Hands up!>Nicht schießen! - Don't shoot!kek, I hope you won't need this German vocab anymore
anyone else watch isaac arthur on yt and feel he talks and writes like an esl? he's american-born so maybe i'm crazy but his accent sounds off to me and sometimes the dialogue in his videos is weird or has blatant errors
>>202027255OP hier. Same as >>202028057 but with French and one year in gimnazjum with hot teacher and it was the only period when I actually studied it and I was even her pupil. In HS I had the worst teacher ever, ugly and mental old hag, and I barely passed. I hated the language, only after years I got over it. The French embassy should exert some pressure and influence who they employ in schools. One teacher regularly trash talked about France as if she deliberately wanted to discourage us from learning. I haven't learned any of these languages >>202028071Oh, so I was right. But in English I'm pretty sure it's mostly stressing or these weird "squeezed" fragments like gonna or gocha or sup >>202028340I want to learn to speak sentences at a normal pace right away because words always sound a little different than when spoken separately. I shouldn't worry, but German is quite phonetic and I hear everything well, only the tongue refuses to obey me and I get irritatedThanks anons
Good morning Monday morning
>>202029934Goooooooooood morning Vietnam
>page 9quints challenge>>202022222
reroll>>202011111
>>202031263Że co? Co to ma wspólnego z pornem??
>>202031381z porno*
>>202031381Technically, "porno" is one of the rare words that does not inflect in Polish. But I guess some terminally online people could actually write it like that.
>Poles are so sweet and innocent that they haven't even naturalized the word porn
>>202031562>I guess some terminally online people could actually write it like that.I don't think so
>>202031644/polska/ writes it like that
>>202031721mhh
>>202031789sami polacy kurwa
>>202031721pornol i pornos można odmieniać, ale to takie bardzo potoczne słowa pornem i próby odmiany porno brzmią źle
>>202031721We used to have a habit or a rule of not declining some foreign words, especially brand names, surnames and foreign words ended with -o, but we do it anyway after some time or when we "polonize a word". e.g. like / lajk (in social media context) or radio. With "porno" it hasn't changed because we have a second word "pornol" in the common use.Kto, co? Radio, porno, pornolO kim, o czym? O radiu (used to be "o radio"), o porno, o pornolachKogo, czego? Radia (used to be radio), porno, pornoliZ kim, z czym? Z radiem (z radio), z porno, z pornolamiEtc.Fun fact: a polonized word may cease to be a legally protected name. Land rover -> rower (bicycle), Gillette -> żyletka (razor blade), Adidas -> adidasy (sneakers)
I don't feel like doing any inpooting today and will just grind Anki and "learn" 500 new wordsMost of them are cognates anyway
>400 cards dueFUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUCK
>ὁ Φάρος (The Pharos): A Thematic Guide to Ancient Greek Vocabulary and Set Phrasesmy book will come tomorrow <3
>be me in a store >Spanish Guy stops asks me for something in Spanish>"er.. no trab-a-hoe eye"I think that's right, or should I have used "ackee" instead of "eye"?
>>202035216>Ahm I don't work there, should I have used here instead of there?
>>202035216>Spanish Guyhe was a beaner
>>202035216do you look latinx or why did he randomly ask you something in spanish
.
>>202035535Not him but it happens a lot here nowadays. I'm not even learning Spanish currently but I have to often use my limited Spanish at certain stores where the staff don't speak English.I'm actually hoping this shift continues, because it might motivate more people to get into learning languages, particularly Spanish.
>>202035535It's a Home Depot, like 90% of the customers are Hispanic so they just expect you to know it. I was sitting around waiting to chat with some old coworkers, must've looked like I still worked there.
>>202035846>Not him but it happens a lot here nowadays.do you live in a border state?
>>202037391Yes, Canadian border lol
>>202037626Bullshit. I have never heard Spanish spoken outside of Spanish class in school.
>>202037659I guess you never visited Seattle
>>202029934GuMo>>202030013GuMo
If I learn General American Accent, and graduate from the course, how do I maintain and keep the accent from deteriorating since I don't live in an English speaking country?Is booking regular monthly revision lessons with an English accent coach on some site like iTalki the only way?
Why are all the various sources so bad at transcribing dutch sounds into IPA? When I listen to actual examples from various regions it doesnt match any of them
>>202038252Why do you care about the accent so much? Waste of time imo. You'll never sound like a native and it doesn't matter as long as people can understand you.
>>202038633I realized I am obsessed with languages but not learning new ones. I want to get so good at English so much that I can teach it or some shit.It's a hobby
I miss when German had a non-fossilized dative -eHe's so cute cute cute sex sex sex
Is there anything like “NHK World”for Korea, where they show Korean programs in English?
>>202017425It's usually just that it's "new" material for you and you end up translating it because of that. Listen to an audiobook while playing some brainless game like minecraft and after enough hours you just stop translating.If you're only doing an hour or two of practice a day you're likely going to keep translating in your head for a long time. If you just let yourself relax and listen to an entire audiobook at once at some point you just can't put the energy towards it.
>>202041132Arirang TV
>>202038388Many dialects and accents of a small nation, so probably not so good mapped. It's my guess
>>202020543I don’t think Polish is a meme language, but just to define it… a meme language is when the vast majority in a country already speak a language, and then they try to force some unused language in some vain attempt at petty nationalism. Petty nationalism is a false nationalism that demonizes closely related people in favor of extremely foreign people. So Irish is a meme language, Catalan is a meme language, and Ukrainian is a meme language are the best examples
Watch this video when you start thinking you aren’t capable of doing something, you have an easy life.https://youtu.be/2TAzy9bxA1k?si=tai05vAT6j5QCYCx
>>202042883Interesting definition. What do you mean here: "demonizes closely related people in favor of extremely foreign people.", what foreign people? I guess you mean America/NATO in Ukraine? But with Ireland, I have no idea. I think Ireland has a reason to demonize the British because of what the British did to them throughout history, and the Ukrainians were invited by the Russians, so I can't blame them for demonizing the Russians either.
I want to do two things:>Learn and maintain an American accent.>Learn and maintain correct Fusha Arabic grammar.How can I do the maintenance part after I finish the courses that teach them?
So HelloTalk is de facto just another dating app, right?
last thread saged before I could get an answer. I asked if the hardest parts about Chinese were learning the written characters and tones. it seems those two are the biggest obstacles. can anyone confirm or tell me I'm retarded on that assumption?
Quero fazer duas coisas:>Aprender e manter um sotaque americano>Aprender e manter a gramática correcta de Arabe FushaComo é que posso fazer a parte de manter depois de terminar as aulas que os ensinam?
>>202043613the hardest part for me is unironically just making anki cards and doing my anki sessions which has become extremely tedious besides that i don't really have any major problem remembering tones or writing/recognizing characters nor with grammar
>>202043972>hasboth of which have
>>202043500drill Anki it is the only way forwardfor American just consume the full monty of yankslop and you will turn whitebut make sure you're either team East Coast or team West Coast. only consume stuff from the coast you picked. you must choose otherwise you will be shunned by both.>>202043728 new Jordi challenge just dropped
Idk why I can find recordings of hanzi on forvo instead of just the pinyinWho the hell is sitting there deciding to record themselves say 習 instead of xí
>>202043972how are you having an easy time with characters? those are hard.
Voglio fare due cose:>Imparare e mantenere un accento americano>tfw jordie challenge is too hard
习以为常习俗Looking at these words it seems that memorising Chinese words could actually be relatively easy once you know the constituent charactersI'm not sure if I could ever guess what the combination of characters mean but once you've been introduced to the word it seems they give you a lot to grasp onto 习气LolBad habit/practice = to practice + gas, air, smell
>>202044501what do you find hard about them >>202044794rainstorm = 暴 sudden/violent风 wind雨 rain
no one does the quints challenges
>>202044794I remember learning 미행 "following, trailing" not too long ago and when I thought about it the day after, I realised it was composed of the characters 尾 "tail" and 行 "go". It's pretty rare but fun when things click like that.>>202045138I'd have done it, but I have no idea how to phrase "what does this have to do with x" in Korean
>>202046010are you learning hanja?
>>202046365Not really. I used to back in the day, but I'm not actively pursuing it. I'd say I learned maybe 300 before I stopped
>>202020304The vocabulary is definitely not easy, there are like 10 words I don't know and I'll research now. Also get some better books this story fucking sucks.
any advice to learn advanced English? I'm done with making dumb little grammar mistakes that I can't notice when I write or speak, I want to be near perfect, where can I start, I'm high C1
>>202044918distinguishing them from each other. too many strokes and fine details to my eyes.
>>202021524>if they can read they at least know which simplified character a given traditional character corresponds to. Not necessarily. When taken from the context of sentences to individual characters or words, then they may not be able to recognize. This is because some simplified characters have a more mechanical pattern and look similar to its original counterpart (e.g. 訁->讠), while some look completely different (e.g. 竈 -> 灶) and has to be relied on context to recognize.>I wonder if you won't forget the tones (for less common words than this example) if you only use standard Pinyin input, like entering "xiexie" and picking "1 謝謝" (xie4xie / xièxie) from the list, without entering or seeing any tones? maybe not as a native speaker?No. First, spoken language and written text (including typing) are different matters. As children we learn to speak first, then to write, then to type. Using the pinyin input method is a way of converting the sounds in my mind into written text, and when I speak them I always know the tones.And even from the perspective of written text, when we learn the characters, the tone is part of the information of them. If I remember that 谢 is the 4th tone (departing tone), then I have remembered it.>>202021920You can try Rime. It's pre-installed with terra-pinyin which supports that function.https://rime.imhttps://github.com/rime/rime-terra-pinyin
Can any Korean tell me if these voices are AI or not?https://youtu.be/rpsMPAOllzY
Is there a name for these kinds of sentences/ words?>x causes y to [do something]>x forces y to [do something]>x allows y to [do something]>x wants y to [do something]
>>202047786>As children we learn to speak first, then to write, then to type.what do you call the individual pinyin letters (like what's the chinese equivalent of bee, cee dee)
I've learnt to recognise some hanzi公, 問, 習, 孔 and 子I'm trying to memorise the meaning and the pinyin for each card and I find memorising the pinyin is very hard
>>202047962That's definitely made by Al, but the voice and accent are quite decent. I can spot the AI by the discretely divided sound of the voices. It's like slight mosaics on a picture.I don't think these are natural voices. You can't hear the average person's speech after practicing. It might help with language learning, but it might also be circumventing the process.
>>202048565are you pronouncing the pinyin as you read it
>>202048831No I'm trying to recognise the character and what it means and then I try to think about how it's pronounced I have audio recordings on each cardI've decided to try to do pic related so that I can read and pronounce them at the same time
Is there a way to copy characters in and get a decent text to speech?
>>202049082https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pFITfqYCbfsActually this seems ok but idk if there's a website which lets you listen to each section individually
>>202048478Formally they are pronounced as bo, po, mo, fo etc.>>202048565Are you also learning modern Mandarin, or only reading the pre-Qin classics? If it's the latter, you don't really need to know any pinyin.
>>202049401all with an o sound?
>>202048917how are you building your anki deck? one card per character? or are you also adding words? (since you're reading a classical chinese text idk how many compound words if any there may be)
>>202049529bo po mo fode te ne lege ke heji qi xizhi chi shi rizi ci sia o e i u ü>>202049401Alright, you may need to look up the pinyin pronunciation of people's names and locations when you come across them to match the English translation, but you don't have to learn how to pronounce them as how you do in learning Mandarin. For example, you don't have to worry about the tones, which didn't even exist in Old Chinese.
>>202049611在中国情况如何?
>>202049611interesting
>>202049401I'm trying to dabble in classical Chinese without Mandarin, and don't want to restrict myself to pre-Qin texts I want to know pinyin to search words up in a dictionary and also because I think it's better to attach sounds to the words you're learning to read and I might as well learn the pronunciation that most people learn >>202049551All my cards look like this, definitely not ideal I don't know if there are compoundsThe textbook gives some combinations of characters like 文章 (external manifestations of a cultivated character), 可以 (can, may), 四海 (the Four Seas; n., the inhabited world), etc but I don't know if these are compounds or count as something else
>>202049695抑也。
Btw how do you get the font of the hanzi to be larger?Do I just copy and paste hanzi images?
>>202050100>https://www.globaltimes.cn/page/202303/1288231.shtml中国人最幸福, so it can't be that bad?
Do you have media and email accounts on the TLnet? I will set up an email on interia.pl with my TL name. This will be the one I use for professional purposes in TC.
>>202048217>x causes y to [do something]causative>x forces y to [do something]Not sure. Might also be causative>x allows y to [do something]permissive>x wants y to [do something]optative
>A month ago I stopped studying Japanese after years of studying>Told myself I would start learning a new language>Still haven't been able to pick out a language after a monthI've got it narrowed down to German, Russian, and Finnish, but I just can't seem to pull the trigger on any. I really want to go for Finnish because the majority of the music I listen to is Finnish and I really like how the language sounds, but it feels like such a meme language. Russian seems like it'd be fun to learn but I'm not super interesting in the culture and I feel like I won't be motivated to learn. German is a middle ground where it's more interesting than Russian but I feel like I'm just forcing myself to learn it because it's still more useful than Finnish.I just find it so hard to start learning Finnish knowing it's such a difficult language and not useful or practical in the slightest.
>>202050506Why not start studying Japanese again and call what you did a break?
>>202050186In Anki? It should let you change the size of the entire card, but If you want just a particular character to be bigger, you may have to do some in-line HTML.
>>202050214那你想跟我换吗?
>>202050522I started studying Japanese to pursue a job in Japan. Last month I returned from said job. My Japanese is at a strong enough level that if I ever go back I can get by just fine, but I don't really plan on going back any time soon. Also, after certain point I really started getting diminishing returns. I'd rather be conversation in two languages than spend another 3-4 years continuing to polish my already conversational Japanese, especially when I don't really intend to use it any time soon.
>>202050506>because the majority of the music I listen to is Finnishwhy
>>202050506>>202050696It sounds like you want to learn Finnish.
>>202050729They have some bangers, I must admit. On ETS2, I would scroll through the radio stations and the Finnish station that plays only Finnish music is one of the best ever on that game. Radio Helsinki I believe
>>202027876Slavic was invented by Byzantines.
>>202050729I primarily listen to melodic death metal. Finland produced large amounts of metal bands. While a fair portion of them make music in English, there are some who have lyrics exclusively in Finnish, and many who include Finnish verses in English songs.
>>202027876I'm so mad about Polabian going extinct. People be whinging about the "Holocaust" but did you know that the Germans caused an entire extinction of a language and ethnic group? Where's the sympathy for Polabians?
>>202050847>Children of Bodom fan
While practicing pronunciation, I realized it's much like adjusting football ball touches.Just as a professional football player in their 20s might struggle in games if they didn't master basic ball control as a youth, it's bloody hard to fully master the tongue movements of a different language in your 20s.I've had native English speakers or /lang/ posters listen to the pronunciation of various Korean English teachers, including those who lived in English-speaking countries from a young age. Yeah without any exceptions, they point out subtle awkwardness in pronunciation. They often say, "The overall pronunciation is good, but this particular aspect sounds unnatural, so they don't come across as someone born in an English-speaking country." Yeah, they can distinguish this in everyone... from those teaching pronunciation in Korea to those who studied abroad from a very young age.If someone in their 20s, especially from East Asia , truly master their English intonation, pronunciation, and accent to be 'pass as a local level' from a native speaker, it's an extraordinary talent in itself.I suppose other language skills like writing, reading, listening, and grammar are relatively easier to conquer compared to 'mastering the accent'
>>202050643>那你想跟我换吗?我不认为中国想要我 :(
