Remember how everyone was laughing at Russian mobiks trying to shoot down drones with rifles and shotguns, and how the US military had the quadcopter drone threat sorted out with EW and jammers?: https://youtu.be/Vml5UIrUy2U
The difference is this is redundancy, while Russia do it as their primary countermeasure. I mean its self apparent that we have the EW capability, because we were dealing with ISIS quadrotors nearly 10 years ago and never lost a guy.
>>61971836https://www.twz.com/7155/isis-drone-dropping-bomblet-on-abrams-tank-is-a-sign-of-whats-to-come
Do these help you aim at drones, or does it need an upgrade?
>>61971824i dont think i have ever seen anyone laugh at russians using shotguns to shoot down drones? isnt that the most logical thing to do?hitting a drone with a ak is probably real hard though.
>>61971856The Marines in that video also used M4s requiring several bursts to take one drone down and which was almost entirely stationary
>>61971824idk the one i remember laughing at was this, but that's because it's a saiga being a piece of shit because you need to put in a little more work than 'make ak fire shotgun shell' to make the ak actually fire shotgun shells reliably. i do remember getting called a fudd for saying having a shotgun somewhere would be a 'nice to have' thing in this sort of war, even if sport clays is the closest thing to a 'training' you'll get for the situation, and a lot harder than people give it credit for.
>>61971873Saigas are decent though. They not as nice as veprs, but they work. Is this just sour grapes because theyve been banned for a decade? Its doesnt need to be, theyre still cheap on gunbroker.
>>61971873also worth noting i even went further in my fuddlore for the shotgun thing by speculating that turkey shot might be one of the better ones, but that #4 buck is probably the right size to keep lethality against humans but enough pellets for drones. i'm pretty sure i saw a mixed bird/buck shell that seems like it'd be perfect for the task a while back but i don't know what the mix on it was.>>61971881i've got a VEPR, i love it, but boy was it a pain to get fully configured. oh boy the fucking magazines. sit there, file down the catch a bit, check it- doesn't fit without a smack, take it out, file it down again. real pain in my ass.
Check the catalog.>>61969507>>61971824https://desuarchive.org/k/thread/61481776
>>61971824good morning, sardoo not redeembloody benchod
>>61971824You can still see it's not very useful against observation quads- it takes 5+ guys shooting with rifles like 20 seconds to take out a single one. Observation quads can stay very far away if they want. I do think it's going to be decent against drone drop quads and better still at FPVs. Laden FPVs especially are not very fast when it comes down to it, and by nature they have to fly directly at you.
Remember when all the "experts" on here INSISTED that shotguns could never possibly used to shoot down drones? Where are those people now?
>>61971979No I don’t remember, can you post the archive links?
>>61972013Not him but it was a pretty common tack when the primary threat was still drone drops (you can easily fly beyond shotgun range), but with the ubiquity of FPV drones they started getting personal and into shotgun range
>>61971979>>61971824APOLOGIZE /k/!
>>61971824>stationary recon dronesWait until they slap a warhead into one of thesehttps://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PEwD7wppkJw
>>61971979>static observation droneYeah, that's lovely. Now try shooting down a suicide FPV drone maneuvering and coming at you with full speed. Then repeat it a dozen times.
>>61972049also coming from any direction
>>61972069with complete surprise. the best you'll get is someone shouting "FPV."
>>61971824I'm honestly surprised the military isn't using these more often.https://www.droneshield.com/c-uas-products/dronegun-tacticalThere's versions of this that can make a drone return to where it has been launched from which would be a payday for anyone with a rifle scope watching where some shit tier drone lands back at. Some law enforcement agencies has been using these very same kinds of guns for a few years now ever since they got spooked at the prospect of people just mounting a fucking pistol onto a drone.
Based
>>61971824been a while since I've seen M4 being used in action/training on video by marines.
the problem of /k/ike is that they forget ukraine troops are suffering the same fate as russia right now
>>61972041SHOTGUNCHADS! I KNEEL!
>>61971824Truth is the US atmy has no idea how to deal with quads.Shooting them down with shotguns is not realistic as can be seen in Ukraine.
>>61971824>Remember how everyone was laughing at Russian mobiks trying to shoot down drones with rifles and shotgunsNo
>>61971979if it's so effective how come thousands of mobiks get vaporized by drones on a weekly basis?
>>61971824When the Russians do it it’s gay as hell, when we do it’s badass. Also like the other anon pointed out, it’s a last line of defending yourself (like combatives) from FPVs
ITT: Coping shotgunfag samefaggingShotguns are obsolete in the military, and fucking suck against quads
>>61972049>>61972069/k/ope:>>61972041
>>61972449if it's so effective how come thousands of mobiks get vaporized by drones on a weekly basis?
>>61971824This is fucking stupid.
>>61972458If it's so ineffective why is the US Marine Corps wasting time training Marines to use shotguns and practice skeet shooting?
>>61972542Our military is trash?
>>61971856>>61972347>>61972013See:>>61972049>>61972386>>61972425
>>61971824This doesn't counter drones though, and that's clear from the video.
>>61971824Nah that wasn't happening SeeWe can go over the archives But for 2 yearsMost of k from the western countries and not thirdie countries Responded Use shotguns AndIndians and thirdies kept getting more complex wunderwaffen vapor way insane stupid shit ideas And we just said noJust use shotguns like Ukrainians that's why we have them hundreds of combat shotguns at the start of the war This is just proofThirdies are fucking stupid with huge egosWho eventually have to do what we say to survive Like use shotguns! Yay
>>61972449It's a fucking clay pigeon. It's coming always from the exact same location, has about the same trajectory. It has nothing to do with with actual drones.
>>61972574We been practicing and actually shooting drones out of the sky with shotguns over 15 years. The Russians are just this fucking stupid. They spent billions on cope cages that were useless. When all they needed with a dude with a shot gun. Never underestimate how dishonest and stupid the rest of the world is outside of the west. Putin knows less about drone warfare than a 7 year old American girl
>>61971824I'm guessing the M4 shotgun has a fixed choke? What is it? Cylinder?
>>61972588Static observation drones still aren't the same thing as FPV drones maneuvering around and moving at full speed.
>>61972588Yeah, 15 years of experience to use shotguns and training soldiers with skeet shooting
Cool story about thisThe story goesSo nasa needed a way to write and they spent millions on pens costing hundreds thousands a piece The Russians used wax pencildExcept Russians literally made that up You can't use graphite in space it gets in machines You can't use wax or grease pens because it will melt or freeze at times especially in any sun up there A man named fisher created the pen and sold it to Nasa for 6 dollars And the Russians use his pen and have tried renaming it several times claiming they invented itWhile circulating the pen vs grease pencil story This is the same thing
>>61972606I got look it up I want to think the first insurgent drone blown up using a shotgun was 2009.
this post convinced me that Russia is not pathetic but actually very strong and that the total lack of drone videos blowing up US troops is totally a coincidence.
>>61972613Sounds funny. You got a source?
>>61971824It's good when we do it and bad when they do it, because we're the good guys and they're the bad guys.
>>61971873This is why magazine fed shotguns will never replace traditional tube fed.
>>61971848Ukraine doesn't have redundancy, either. It's the poorest country in Europe. You might find it less than ideal to try and swarm the US with k-maet drones when they can literally put a guided missile up your asshole.
>>61972340Russians don't shoot clays, just krokodil. Get the 51st Fudd Division out there with their 30" barrel over unders and it'll be a different story. Mount them to the top of the tank instead of cope cages.
>>61972574Do sporting clays then. Different speeds and approaches.
>>61972041Warcrime
>>61972618No mention of a shotgun. They used EW. A quick Google search shows an article from the Indian Defence Review. Pic related which cites an article from CNNhttps://www.cnn.com/2009/US/12/17/drone.video.hacked/index.html
>>61971824I'm sure the Chinese will keep their drones stationary so that pvt. Gomez can easily hit it.
>>61971836This; the guys in the OP pic are practicing just in case our primary, secondary, and tertiary defense systems go down
>>61972778Is the tertiary defense mechanism a full-frequency broadcast of Army DEI training videos intended to drive the drone to suicide?
>>61971979I think they were mostly talking about the ones dropping ordinance from hundreds of yards up. Even the heaviest goose/crane loads for 12 gauge struggle a bit before 100 yards. Maybe a bit easier if you’re just trying to take out a cheap plastic drone, not too sure how they respond to being peppered.
>>61971824>Remember how everyone was laughing at Russian mobiks trying to shoot down drones No I don't you shadowboxing nigger faggot People here were suggesting shotguns left and right you stupid nigger
>>61972824Actual /k/ posters were until the Russians started doing it and then burger brain kicked in.
>>61972108>There's versions of this that can make a drone return to where it has been launched fromThat would be hilarious if it actually worked on one of those FPVs with the nig-rigged 2 wire contact detonators...
>>61972041Based!
>>61972786Brain rot
>>61972621This, but unironically
>>61972041Some of those are moving pretty quick. The close distance though creates competing contributions to the relative difficulty of the shot. First of all, it does require more instantaneous angular velocity and acceleration of the muzzle to track the drone accurately and make a shot, but it also requires less lead time/distance because the time of flight of the shot to the target is reduced. I'm super curious how much more effective shotguns could be against drones if some sort of flechette ammunition was used. Don't get me wrong, I'm still advocating for 12 gauge based platforms, so entire new firearms don't need to be designed, but what about different types of loads? On the otherhand, perhaps heavy doveshot is already pretty optimized for anti-drone application.
>>61972407Exactly, when the zigs do it it's because of total failure of the command to deal with the threat in any kind of meaningful way.When the Marines do it, there's gonna be dedicated SHORAD nearby, jammer, a guy in your squad carrying a microwave anti-drone "gun", not to mention air support to wipe out whoever launched those drones.All the shotgun guy might have to do is finish off any strugglers
>>61971824>Remember how everyone >>61971979>Remember when allNo, I do not. How about you refresh my memory, preferably with archive likes as proof, to show that, in fact, you are not a lying faggot?
Shotguns being issued per squad will be common for about 2 years. By then I suspect someone will have made a squad portable crew carried CIWSlike system that will likely just be a servo for aiming and barrels with belt fed shells. It will be powered by swappable batteries and use combo IR/Cam/2.4&5GHz sensors to target FPVs. These will be carried by grunts and quickly assembled before ops (at rear and front positions). They will also likely become the new M2 in that we'll bolt them on everything
>>61971824>get called a retard at start of war for saying "why not simply use shotguns">completely validated all these years later
>>61973463flechettes are smaller than most shot diameter wise, and don't allow you to pack in as much shot. a heavy birdshot/light buckshot combination is probably the best one overall, to both ensure saturation of the airspace, and sufficient 'wounding' of the target. i'd probably want something like picrel, maybe seeing if i can stuff some #4 buckshot into it as well just to retain some better wounding against infantry. drones are fragile, but they're tougher than a fleshy bird, so having more energy is important. you don't know what is going to hit what, and while the smaller birdshot is fine if you hit the propellers, you'll want the larger ones for the frame/warhead.i will say if you see a sporting clay course near you, try it sometime. they can be pretty tough, but pretty fun too. also gives you a chance to hoof it through the woods and see how you'd want to set up a shotgun for that sort of situation.
>>61971824no one laughed at ziggers for using shotguns against drones, its like the one smart idea theybe had. Especially semi auto saigas and such
>>61971824its hard to jam spread spectrum radios used in FPV quads. and depending on the firmware it might not crash if the connection is lost it might just maintain altitude (i know my quad has a barometer chip which means the quad has all it needs for altitude hold without relying on GNSS)all this means that after you jam a quad you need to take it down somehow or run the risk of the enemy regaining control
>>61972041Couldn't we just make a mini phalanx that shoots shotgun shells? I've prepared for this by playing bloon tower defense.
>>61971836Reminder China is the drone factory of the whole world. Both Russia and Ukraine are forced to source their drones and/or drone parts from China. There is no other secondary producer>90% of quadcopters are from China. DJI alone domniates 70% of the US drone market. If we go to war with China tomorrow, we will have endless drone buffet for breakfast, lunch, and dinner. The average US serviceman will see 10x the drone your Russian mobnik sees in Ukraine.Perfect jammers or not, some will get through with such volume. Small drones went from lowest priority to highest priority in Pentagon's eyes over the past 12 months. The recent ban on DJI is to jump start US drone manufacturing, not some stupid security excuse.
>Everyone talking about relying on EW to disable drones.So what will be the future method that overcomes EW jammers (as opposed to presently just swamping it, given that drone videos from Ukraine are from that 5-10% success rate)?>If you think there won't be one or that R&D somewhere isn't planning for exactly that, you're an idiot.
>>61974485I've shot clays before, long ago. Super fun really, more like a video game than anything. I think one time I ran a 19/25 or something? idk. My current range has manual loaded throwers. I would fuck around if I could find one of those places that has the sheds with the autofeeders in them. Magnum Blend, lol. Interesting. Yeah I definitely agree that birdshot is probably too light. Good point about drones being relatively "tougher" than birds. I hadn't thought of things in those terms, but that is a good consideration.
>>61972613Fake story
>>61971866The idea is accuracy through volume. In theory it would work. But it would be better with real machine guns. Get 2 saws on it, and it might work.
>>61971856early in the war they were dismissed as ineffective, and at the time that was correct when most drones were dropping grenades and submunitions from beyond shotgun range. now that suicide drones have proliferated shotguns are relevant again since they get up close with their targets so shotguns are useful.
>>61971824Aimbot scopes like Smart Shooter could make small arms effective against FPVshttps://www.youtube.com/watch?v=91sf7B6WpbI
