...Identity Spoofed...Encryption Keys Generated...Connected to Onion Routers>>>Login: *********>>>Enter Passcode: *********...Biometric Scan ConfirmedConnected to EmeraldGrid...>Welcome back to /srg/, chummer>Last Viewed Files: >>94245162>The_Dead_Are_Rising.nwsft>Remembering_Years_Past.infosoft>"First Run? I've got a sweet deal on threads and arms".ad>Golden_Oldies_and_Other_Classics.sndsftPersonal Alerts* Your Current Rep Score: 2351 (32% Positive)* You have 1 new private message, titled "Heard you're back in town. Come see me, we'll celebrate."* Your Chummer > Tools > Options books list has been unchecked https://github.com/chummer5a/chummer5a/releases* Cloud File Storage: https://pastebin.com/SsWTY7qr* Running Refresh.BTL...>Watch your back>Shoot straight>Conserve ammo>Do not buy CGL books>Never, ever cut a deal with a dragon
>>94404551How close would you say Demon Lord 2099 is to Shadowrun?
Big Boy Greg was staring on hologram with disbelief. Letter? Who's sending a letter in 2070? And him – a wizard? He was a decker, not a some fucking technomancer… Or was he?
>>94404551>didn't change the OP at allLazy, lazy anon. Bad enough that the previous OP didn't care, but you don't either.
>>94405820sorry, but it didn't look like anybody else was going to make a new thread and i had only a few minutes to do it before going to work
>>94406268I was waiting for the thread to archive.
>>94406299i like it when there's a link to the new thread in the old one
>>94406331That's not how /srg/ worked. Rushing threads is how we get lazy OPs like yours and the last one, emptily copying and pasting without any new material.
>>94404934>Demon Lord 2099That series was such dogshit I abandoned it ten pages in. I can see how it didn't break 20 chapters across two attempts at a manga adaptation. Consume something half-decent like Shadowrun's own manga, Silent Mobius, or Wicked City instead.>>94406331Why would you have wanted any of the retarded negroids from last thread to find this one?
>>94404551Where's the RWBY, anon?
>>94406604Nowhere, thankfully. I prefer anime but I'd sooner good old Shadowrun art than that slop.
Has anyone tried Armor Astir for a SR hack?>A and B plotlines for van deckers and social infiltration >downtime to spend getting personal interactions outside of a run>metasystem rules about fighting an oppressive social system>risks and perils are interesting damage tracksThe big issue I have is with magic. I don't know how to structure it so it's not just another weapon
>>94407212>shadowrun art >not slop
>>94406363ok? do you want to talk about shadowrun?
How exactly does Noise work? In this context, lets say I'm out in the middle of a noiseless area, totally empty flat white plain. Some guy wants to hack me. I have a Jammer. Do I need to put the jammer near me or near him to have it matter? DOES it matter, as long as it's where part of the test is occuring?
>>94410884>How exactly does Noise work?When you're taking an action against something in the matrix, you judge the distance between your persona-capable device and the target to get base noise, add anything else that could be affecting your traffic getting to them (yes, a jammer on you or them applies) and sum total applies to the attacker. Defender does not take noise penalties.
I started reading Crossroads and I'm going it. What's y'alls favorite SR novels? Also question about the meta plot, is there a list of what adventures to run in chronological order? Like if I wanted to run my group of players through the meta plot over one long ass mega campaign?
>>94415279I really enjoyed House of the Sun, more than 2XS. Something about the tropical setting, I like seeing things that aren't "grey American corporate slum."And I doubt there is a cohesive order for the adventures. They are set across 4 decades and multiple continents, and the end of many of them would make others impossible.
>>94415279>Also question about the meta plot, is there a list of what adventures to run in chronological order?You'll definitely want to swap out runner teams sometimes. Rule of thumb is to use the publishing date, though that can get funky. Here's the order for FASArun.https://gurth.home.xs4all.nl/shadowrun/adventure%20dates.html>>94415437On the other hand 2XS had a bittersweet ending, while House of the Sun being so tropical was a dreadful flag it would end far worse. Everyone lies, chummer. Nigel Findley dying before he could follow up on Dirk's story makes it even sadder.
Is archery really viable at all, whether it's bows or crossbows? How do you make it good?
>>94416993Edition? Called Shot for pin & blast out of hands are good in 5e. If you can work with your GM to get microgrenades on arrows that'd be something, but I don't think that's an option RAW.
>>94416993>viableDepends on what you mean by that.>bowsMost likely no.>crossbowsMaybe.
Did CGL errata Hard Targets' explosive clip from a flat reduction to a percentage reduction?
>>94418877>Did CGL errata [5e book]Guess.
>>94419320Right. Then I don't understand how someone fucked it up in Chummer5 to turn a -2 into -2% and it was never picked up. Or why they split Stolen Gear off into its own little pocket of funding. Or why In Debt doesn't spend the negative karma gained on the nuyen it gives. Etc.
>>94416993>5e adviceAn archer is fun to play as a joke, but is disheartening when every ganger with something bigger than a machine pistol can outshoot you. Did one as a backup character and it was enjoyable for what it was.DO>get 10 AGI, 10 STR. This is a gimmick, commit. More STR lets you use the trollbow, but that's a huge investment because...>get a lot of cash. Archery burns money faster than a Panther, especially if the GM is a hardass about recovering arrows.>get the pistol crossbow with SnS heads and static shafts. Super expensive per shot, but it's the only.concealable weapon you have so make it count. Also learn a martial art, because you're swole as hell.>Hammerheads with seeker shafts for accurate stun damage on your main weapon, explosives and incendiaries with regular shafts for physical. You can make incendiary arrows explode mid-air to carpet bomb dudes in cover three blocks away, it's great.>get easy breakdown on your main bow, and a quickdraw quiver>roll as many dice as possible. Smartlink, aiming, sucking cock under the table for another d6, you will need ~20 to do it right.DON'T>buy regular, monotip or barbed arrows. Cost/damage is way off.>leave arrows behind if you can help it. Shit's expensive>try and compete for damage. You lose to an AK-97. Focus on called shots.>put seeker shafts on anything that explodes.>plan for a long life, plan for a fun one
>>94419832>Or why they split Stolen Gear off into its own little pocket of funding.That's how it works.
>>94420803>Archer is a gimmick buildfug
>>94420803Also get a gun.
>>94420803>Super expensive per shot, but it's the only.concealable weapon you haveWouldn't be so sure about that.>A traditional style bow can be designed to be collapsible, requiring a Complex Action to assemble. Cost for this modiication is an additional 50 nuyen per point of Rating.Whatever that means. Hard Targets also splits the option to take a smartlink into compound bows, not traditional bows.>>94421110No, it doesn't. It adds to your funds during character generation. What it doesn't do is convert into nuyen you can keep after character generation.
>>94422237>No, it doesn't. It adds to your funds during character generation.It adds a 200k budget you can't exceed.
>>94422408It's the same wording as In Debt.
>>94421990You are a coward and your mother will forget the sound of your voice.>>94422237Sure, getting a bow to break down is handy for moving anywhere you don't want to be immediately obvious as a Hawkeye cosplayer. The Sliver is for when you need to do some quickdraw shit to take out a guard, or conceal something in civilian clothes where carrying a rattling gym bag would be suspicious.
>>94422493>or conceal something in civilian clothes where carrying a rattling gym bag would be suspicious.If you need something entirely inconspicuous, take a slingshot, capsule rounds, and pepper punch. Aside from the capsule rounds (which you might be able to make yourself if you're good) it has no availability rating (so you don't need to black market your way into owning one - any local corner stores have them), no license requirement, is cheap as fuck, and runs off archery. There's nothing else in the game that matches up - provided you're doing an archery build and are able to figure out between you and the GM how you can stealthily take someone down with toxins.
(5E) I like the aesthetic of being a troll immensely, but mechanically I don't like how pigeonholed they are. The lower mental caps and agility penalty are punishing, and the strength and body you get aren't enough to make up for it, especially because if you want to go melee the agility is arguably more important than the strength. Heavy weapons requiring some strength aren't better than normal automatics, you don't need too much strength to bring the best heavy armor, soak tanking is your only real advantage and it's not even better than dodge tanking. It takes a smaller investment to make an elf dangerous in melee than a troll because of thegood flat-damage weapons, you have to go all in to be a serious melee threat with muscle power. Priority A is a joke.
>>94426232I get what you're saying. There are many small factors that contribute to the troll being left behind in chargen but I guess one of the bigger is that metatypes are really just statblocks. Without actual "racial traits" or race-locked content we're just comparing stats, and trolls come up short because we already have two metatypes that are STR/BOD focused with less investment. Sure, going from priority C Ork->priority B Troll means that you increase the base/max of BOD by 1 and STR by 2. But you're effectively losing 4 Attribute Points from not investing in the Attribute priority. Or 4 entire special attribute points if you had gone with priority B Ork. You're paying out of your ass because of the increased maximums. Which would have been fine if STR/BOD weren't the shittiest of the attributes. Imagine how busted it would be if "trolls" gave 10 AGI and 10 INT. And you aren't really getting those increased maximums for free. When you sum up the total attribute increases and penalties, you'll see that Elf, Ork, and Troll all three get exactly a 3 point increase. So you are at net 0 when you jump from Ork->Troll. Honestly, a complete overhaul of the metatypes isn't a bad idea. >All metatypes starts at 1/6 down the line>Different metatypes have different racial traits>Troll>You possess incredible bulk in a society not adapted for you physically nor socially. >All your melee attacks based on STR gets a +4 DV bonus>Whenever you take damage, lower the amount by 2 (minimum 1)>You possess an inherent Recoil Compensation of 3>You possess an inherent +1 Reach>The first rank of any social skill costs two extra karma. During CharGen, instead of karma the first rank costs two points>You may not begin with Academic knowledge skills above rating 2and so on.
>>94426232>especially because if you want to go melee the agility is arguably more important than the strength.Only if you have a monowhip.
>>94426232>>94426883Play karmagen, and apply metatype minimum characteristic increases after purchasing characteristic advances up from 1. Chummer5 has the option.>The lower mental caps and agility penalty are punishingTwo dice less won't mean anything unless you don't actually try to make up for it in other ways. Especially social skills. But if you want to throw around 9 max charisma as a baseline troll (more as a giant), 5e is the edition to do it.Agility? Get narco, oxygenated fluorocarbons, and muscle toner or replacement 2. Throw in a reflex recorder for whatever combat skill.
>>94426897Well, that's also a good reason to not have friends in melee. DESU, you should probably be able to negate the "enemy has friends in melee" disadvantage, too. At that point, it becomes not a four on one, but a target-rich environment where you're guaranteed to slice through someone's something.
>>94428205Whoa. Word filters in 2024?
>>94428205>>94428213dumb zoomer
>>94428242>Shocked wordfilters are still around>Must be a zoomerLooks like it's time for some weeaboo.
>>94429048Looks like someone's a zoomer newfag who doesn't understand the one that said weeaboo first is the one that gets a paddling.Kill yourself.
Congrats, you now get to go paddle anon's ass like you always wanted.Be done, faggots.
>>94426232>soak tanking is your only real advantage and it's not even better than dodge tankinglol?Yeah man, rolling 1-2 more dice on your dodge (which can be reduced to basically not being able to dodge at all by a hundred different things) than they have on their attack and getting dropped or dying if it connects is totally just as good as rolling an absolute minimum of 27+ (realistically 33+, scaling indefinitely) dice against a maximum of like 12 (stun) DV is totally just as good.Troll adepts run 5e to such an extent that it's laughable, what the fuck are you talking about?
>>94431242>1-2 dice>He isn't vampmaxxing with 23 dodge dice out of the gate on the extreme low nd
>>94431397>playable vamps
>>94431242>12 (stun) DVYour GM isn't throwing Ares Alpha Ex-Ex goons firing simple full-auto at you? They will when you turn up with 35 soak dice. >Yeah man, rolling 1-2 more dice on your dodgeSoak is def good but dodge also lowers dmg by 1 for every 3 hits. If I had the option to turn 8 armor into 8 dodge I'd take that option every time. 8 for 6? Yeah still taking it. 8 for 4? Maybe.The best defense is a split between dodge and soak. And if I'm not going full in on soak tanking then Ork or Dwarf are both better options than Troll.
>>9443142612 DV (stun) is monowhip damage.>Your GM isn't throwing Ares Alpha Ex-Ex goons firing simple full-auto at you?Are you having a schizophrenic episode? This zeroes your dodge pool, not your soak pool. The elf dies instantly here, the troll moves on to the soak phase (oh no 11 DV (stun) + to-hit successes vs 35+ soak dice).Elves don't even have a higher defend pool, it's the exact same as orc/human at 1 point higher than dwarf/troll (except troll gets +1 to hit/defend in melee anyway lol).>They will when you turn up with 35 soak dice. Up to 46(maybe more?) with a core starting character.>Soak is def good but dodge also lowers dmg by 1 for every 3 hits. If I had the option to turn 8 armor into 8 dodge I'd take that option every time.Sure, but you don't have that option. It's not a fantastic option to go all in on anyway because you'll just die as soon as there's an explosion.>The best defense is a split between dodge and soak.Sure, but you can't raise dodge. What are you going to do? Human, exceptional attribute R, adeptboost R/I? You could do that with a troll and you'd have 1 point less defend vs. guns-and-only-guns and 5 points more soak and higher health, and the ability to actually scale past character creation.
>>94431547Trolls suck desu, the tradeoff for being able to get a high soak pool is that you have dogshit skills and waste a massive amount of points to do it. I can get extremely close to what a Troll can get defensively with a Human, except I'll actually have room leftover to have skills, more money, magic, or attributes.
>>94431426Whoa, this guy has a ton of armor, he's gonna be really hard to de->Attack the floor underneath him to knock him onto a different level of the facility or just cripple his movement>Freeze Foam/Barrier Foam/Trackstop to prevent them from moving>Called shots to remove dicepool or initiative>Called shots for Bullseye Burst to just 100% remove their armor value>Direct Magic>Critter powers>If they don't have a Chemseal, gas grenades with any contact toxin>Hit them with a car>Chunky Salsa grenades/rockets(This is not an optional rule this is straight up core I know you retards will cry and shit)>Suppressive Fire to make them useless>Brick their equipment via matrix damage/hacking>Sonic Screech Rifle>High-end indirect combat spells to just blow them out with sheer damage/AP
>>94431668Trolls get exactly the same magic. Everyone does. The only choices anyone has ever made on magic are A, E or B (adept only).You end up with more attributes in total because trolls get +8 (defacto +11 because of reach and 1 armor).Skillcap at character creation means that you get pretty much everything that matters at the same level.Starting with more than the 6k is practically throwing your character away and refusing to play the game.You basically just swap your attribute and race buy and receive a more specialized character who's better at what you wanted him to do and marginally worse with attributes you didn't really intend to use, who doesn't fall off completely after the first job.
>>94431691So>things that work (better) on elvesWow, crazy
>>94431547>Are you having a schizophrenic episode? This zeroes your dodge pool, not your soak pool. The elf dies instantly here, the troll moves on to the soak phase (oh no 11 DV (stun) + to-hit successes vs 35+ soak dice).You're misunderstanding me. The goons in this case are at base 13 DV + net hits but are still at goon appropriate DP. The -5 DP from simple FA brings your soak-tanking Dodge pool into "broad side of a barn" territory while someone with Dodge 23 to 18 isn't as worried. Especially not if you're penalizing the goon DP with smoke/spells/strobes so that they end up with -6 DP or more. When you go full in on soak, you end up getting hit by a lot of shit that wouldn't be an issue normally. >Sure, but you can't raise dodge. What are you going to do? Human, exceptional attribute R, adeptboost R/I? You could do that with a troll and you'd have 1 point less defend vs. guns-and-only-guns and 5 points more soak and higher healthConsider a C Dwarf vs B Troll situation. If I want to reach the zenith of soaking then Troll is the pick but Dwarf is only slightly behind. And the lower priority can be invested directly in dodge or even soak (+Attr, +Resources).>and the ability to actually scale past character creation.In what way do you scale better than the Dwarf? Your soak will end up slightly better but their mental attributes will eclipse yours.
>>94431691>Brick their equipment via matrix damage/hacking>on a character who isn't the tech guy and therefore probably has gremlins 5 and zero networked pieces of gear:^
>>94431715And then the run requires literally anything other than hitting a guy or shooting a guy and you realize that you have zero ability to contribute to the situation because you're a Troll and you have neither the stats nor the skills to do anything meaningful. Playing a Troll and calling it the best is like saying that Fighter is the most overpowered class in D&D 3.5, it's just patently retarded and wrong in every way.As a Troll, you get to have high Body and high Str, and that's... it. The only notable things you have going for you are being able to equip more armor than most other characters, and you'll have more soak than most of them, which is great if you're constantly getting into life or death gunfights that you are making your entire point of existence to jump in front of bullets, and completely useless outside of it.
>>94431777>And then the run requires literally anything other than hitting a guy or shooting a guy and you realize that you have zero ability to contribute to the situation because you're a Troll and you have neither the stats nor the skills to do anything meaningful.So exactly the same situation as your C dwarf/orc who is still taking D skills in your forced example? Trolls have so many free attributes that that isn't even the comparison; you'd actually have a D attribute troll with C skills massively outskilling your B attribute orc/dwarf while still having higher relevant attributes.>>94431731>while someone with Dodge 23 to 18 isn't as worriedYou don't have Dodge 23 to 18. You have one (1) point more Defend than I do.>but Dwarf is only slightly behindNo, he has>3 points less soak, 2 less body for any other kind of resistance>2 points less str>-1 defend roll due to reach>-1 to-hit roll due to reach>lower attribute caps so there is no way whatsoever to make up for some of these, especially at character creationHe is still behind after considering the higher attributes.>their mental attributes will eclipse yours.Their R+I will be exactly the same. At some theoretical distant future you could max stuff out if you were making a MA with a casting focus, sure, but if you're going hard into mage and only care about mental attributes you're not picking troll. If you don't want to play a troll, then you shouldn't pick troll? Is this a revelation?This conversation started from >>94426232, which is someone wanting to play a troll stereotype and complaining that they're bad at it, even though they're objectively the best at it by a country mile. I appreciate that you're not trying to compare them to dwarves at the dwarf speciality when dwarves are objectively also really good.
>>94431790>Taking Skills DSorry anon I'm white
>>94431881You're the one who said attributes B, not me
>>94431790>He is still behind after considering the higher attributes.You're forgetting the opportunity cost for going priority B instead of C. Let us say you make the soak 46 Troll you talked about earlier. The dwarf would sit at soak 43, -1 Reach, and two less Strength. Funnel the priority difference into Attributes.Dwarf gets:>+1 Edge in the Dwarf's favor>+1 total Attributes in Dwarf's favor (-2 STR, -2 BOD, +1 WIL, +4 ATTR)>+1 WIL in Dwarf's favorAnd the Troll's higher attribute caps means the Dwarf has an easier time maxing their BOD/STR before the Troll can. (Like if you start with Troll BOD or STR 8)In most situations I'd actually prefer the Dwarf's advantages over the Troll (coming from Chargen). And when you have invested that much into soak, a +3 difference just isn't very important. I'd much rather have ~16 Dodge and ~26 Soak than 46 Soak. And if I do, Troll isn't needed while Dwarf can be better customized to reach that goal.>which is someone wanting to play a troll stereotypeI think they were after the aesthetics, not the stereotype. You can enjoy the aesthetics of a troll and decide to make a Troll technomancer.
>vampmaxxing>a character who isn't the tech guy and therefore probably has gremlins 5 and zero networked pieces of gear>etcNo wonder you all have such shit takes.
>>94432004>And when you have invested that much into soak, a +3 difference just isn't very important.Lolwut? It's the exact opposite. The closer you creep towards <2 points average damage from something dangerous the more turns each point of soak buys you. Being able to start to buy hits on weaker attacks completely changes the dynamics of how you interact with a range of situations as well. Breaking 40 is a revelation. You do realize that 46 at character creation is a meme number from squeezing every drop of juice, and troll or dwarf they're not doing very much else other than combat (which the troll is better at), right? 46 means you can buy hits on 11|-2 guns or 10|-2 guns with APDS so it's actually a pretty fucking significant number despite this. 37/43-minus-shield is a realistic target for trolls and gives immunity to concealable weapons, for example.>I'd much rather have ~16 Dodge and ~26 Soak than 46 Soak.Would you rather than 16 Dodge and 29 soak (wtf do you mean 26 soak lmao, you get 24 soak from gear without even considering magic/implants/BOD)? Because that's the direct comparison.>You're forgetting the opportunity cost for going priority B instead of C.I'm not?You're forgetting that the troll gets reach and intrinsic soak. In combat, even in this forced example of attribute C (which is a bad deal), the troll effectively has a higher attribute total than the dwarf.>You can enjoy the aesthetics of a trollThe aesthetic is the stereotype. If you want to play a human and call them a troll, play a human.
