That time of year editionPrevious thread:>>94546413Check out here for useful links and a catalogue of relevant miniatures retailers:>/GROG/ Pastebin: https://pastebin.com/nnNqqFLn
Some relevant channels to potentially go watch to fill time whilst working on your projects in these dark December hours. Unless you're in the southern hemisphere where they're bright December hours and you should get out and play some games.https://www.youtube.com/@Filmdegminiatures/videosFilmdeg here has been doing some good interviews with the old GW crew about all sorts of things including what they're doing now. The ones where Blanche or Priestly are teamed up with others like Jervis Johnson to talk about things are possibly the best ones as they have good long rambles and bounce off each other.And I swear Priestly is definitely getting more open about being a bit spiteful with regards to what happened with GW corporate the more interviews he does.
https://www.youtube.com/@Miniscape-wh40k/videosJust a fun one where a guy paints up classic 2nd edition 40k stuff to a decent standard, in a style you can follow, has a bit of a ramble about what the thing is, does some conversions.https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LKePLmRZyz0 also relevant
https://www.youtube.com/@edpaintsminis/videosSome painting but the main attraction is their nice decently edited battle reports, sometimes with the guy from >>94626498
https://www.youtube.com/@secondeditionwargaming/videosBunch of mostly 2nd edition battle reports here, but notably including Space Fleet.Features more than just the usual engagements of Orks and marines as they break out genestealer and chaos cults, Arbites, Sisters of Battle and Squats in the mix.
I'm reading through old WD issues, GorkaMorka is getting a BIG push but it wasn't mentioned at all by the time I originally encountered the hobby, did it flop?
>>94627480Yes.
Are old unpainted Gretchins anything worth?
>>94627480Yes and No, it's been covered in interviews with people of the time and well, the game sold just fine in line with other games of its type, in general people still think of it fondly and play it, though Andy Chambers and the other staff are a bit eh about it as a game because it was basically 'punishment' for Epic 3rd edition actually flopping (well, only selling about a million copies or something but it did fuck up for sure) and they had to get it done in less than 3 months. Hence why it's just a copy/paste clone of necromunda with prototype of vehicle rules for 3rd 40k.But it was the first game where corporate decided that This Thing was going to sell This Amount rather than a reasonable, sane, expectation. So there was massive overstock, they had to deal with lots of returns, it was a huge embarrassment for them internally, and was basically the death knell for everything that wasn't going to be 40k/Fantasy (except the unforseen miracle that LotR turned up), hence nearly all following specialist games lines stuff being much smaller in scope; warmaster got butchered down from a boxed set like Epic beforehand to a book and metal models only, necromunda basically the same for its next edition, Epic 4th edition - same, Inquisitor being a book and handful of metal figures only, and everything getting shunted off to 'Specialist Games' as an effort to preserve things by the design studio. So its "flop" wasn't lack of popularity, it was GW absolutely fucking up and over-producing it and dealing with the consequences of that because they went Full Retard.
>>94627599Wasnt GorkaMorka just bought for the vehicles?
>>94627599And that's returns from 3rd party retailers who'd been shipped like 8+ copies or something insane where they'd sold their expected 1-3 because they're a mixed hobby store in the middle of fucking nowhere and can't afford to have these boxes taking up space, not returns from regular customers.All because some fucktards in marketing/management decided that Gorkamorka was going to be the next big thing, rather than you know, a decent side-game along the lines of Necromunda, with perhaps less broad appeal because not everyone likes Orks.The embarrassment/resentment part is also why it didn't make it into the Specialist Games load of games. The designers didn't want anything more to do with it because of why it happened in the first place, and corporate would rather forget about it because it was a very, very expensive mistake that did serious damage to the company.
>>94627579As gaming pieces yes, but no, this isn't pawn stars. Call us when you find a Nuln Spearman or a Braglub.
>>94628270Just realized that these slobs are all named for the Orks from the Book of the Astronomican, or vice-versa.
>>94627636Some people probably were getting it for that but well, not everyone was Ork players, and it wasn't like now where it was kind of expected to buy the side games to bulk out main game stuff (unless you wanted a fuckload of genestealers and terminators in Space Hulk's case).Plus they sold the vehicles separately.>>94627579Unless they're on the sprues still, even that shit goldfishblue can't seem to push them at more than £1.50-£2 per, can reasonably expect about 50p-£1 per depending on the state. When you got 40 of them per box, well, christ even I still have a fistful of the fuckers just sitting around that I can't be arsed to deal with when I could instead paint up literally anything else.
Local store’s secret Santa was so fuckin great. Got these and bought the last of the Heresy black books I needed
bought my first space marine, and (not) ready to play old school.Question:Can I play oldhammer with imperial guard? I find them more appealing in terms of aesthetics
Having fun making back ports for my friends' armies for our 2nd edition 40k games, but I got a problem with Dark Eldar.Should they just all be given poison weapons or should their poison just act like how poison normally acts?
>>94629594>Can I play oldhammer with imperial guard? I find them more appealing in terms of aestheticsYeah
>>94629610Geez I screwed that up re-reading it.Should they be given poison weapons that act like all other poison weapons of the edition or should their poison act differently?
>>94626707How did they made such vibrant green tables? Was it painted extra fine sand or sawdust or flock? Static grass wasn't a thing back then, I assume.
>>94629594Not only can you run IG, they get a bunch of cool shit that got taken from them in later editions. In Rogue Trader you get Imperial beastmen, Land raiders/speeders, rhinos, jetpack troops, ogres instead of the modern Ogryns, Robots, and a bunch of other fun silly shit. 2e walked back access to a bunch of stuff (or flat-out deleted it). Especially once the new IG tank kits came out. Allies are still a more formal part of the rules. 3e and 4e had huge vehicle rules revisions, got rid of a bunch of the "silly" weapons like grav-guns, and tried to fence off army lists WAY more than 1/2e 40k, but also added in more official vees and some cool new options like the Trait system. I do think the new 3/4x Force Org Chart system made pick-up play a hell of a lot easier to set up. Unfortunately it also made persuading people to do whacky shit for a home game a pain in the ass - a huge chunk of people started treating home games like they had to be tournament prep for some godforsaken reason.
>>94629854>Static grass wasn't a thing back then, I assume.You assume wrongly. Static grass is basically just dyed polyester fibers like the ones furniture-makers use for fake "velvet" upholstery. It was pretty new in the 70s, mostly used for model railroads, but by the late 80s GW sold a flocked, rubberized table mat for something like $20. Very, very common at the time. They did up most of their demo tables at HQ and local stores with sheets of the stuff, or a thick carpet of flock and static grass. The 'Nid photo in the post you're targeting was definitely shot on a GW grass mat, though.
>>94629594Guard are arguably their best in older editions due to being fucking weird. Only major flaw is that in RT and 3rd you will need a lot of bodies to field forced as guard were cheap points wise and requirements were really horde focused. Amusing way to work around it is running RT blood axes where guard were half the force
>>94629881I do wonder why the attitude for pick up games went from "alright, let's just mash these two armies together in yet another battle of the 41st millennium" to "I gotta optimize the shit outta everything"
>>94629544oh neat anon
Been building up my speed freeks army and finally got around to work on my boss. His still very much /wip/ nobbike needs some cheeky licence plate, help me come up with some? Also here's heavy plasma which I just finished too.
>>94630264GW pushed tournament play *extremely* hard almost the instant 3e came out. In particular they started the Outrider program after a few months and began offering free models to local organizers. For the new Land Raider launch they even sent out models to the Outriders a month or so before they went on the shelf to use as prizes. It did kinda work -- the playerbase easily tripled in a year in my area after 3e released. Clan War going under and FASA shooting itself in the dick didn't hurt, then Warzone did the horribly bungled edition change less than a year later and alienated a hell of a lot of their playerbase as well. In the 2 years after that FASA finally went all the way under, DP9 fucked up his media deal, Target Games went bankrupt. Wizards initially fucked the dog on the Urzas' Saga release, D&D 3 dropped, and the Pokepocalypse happened. Shit moved fucking fast from spring of 1998 to winter of 1999.
>>94630459Here's rest of the boyz, sorry bout the bad photo, this display cabined doesnt have lights, gotta take proper pics of them when they are all done. I still got some rtb13 orks coming in mail and got shokk attack gun to paint.
>>94628270I obtained a handfull of spries of them. I was just asking myself if it is worth selling them or just paint them.>>94628326Thanks for that info. So painting them is a better option than sitting with them for 10 years till someone wants them.
Why doesn't GW do a limited run of oldhammer models? They know it would sell gangbusters, so do they hate money?
>>94630698People who want oldhammer models are already getting them through ebay, recasters or printers.
>>94630698They probably don't have the masters for a lot of the old 80s stuff.The 90s stuff they do Made to Orders every once in a while.From what the Old World releases have been like so far, it feels like they're just releasing whatever they can find for each army with no like overarching aesthetic. Hence like End Times Gyrobombers and then Prince Ulther's Dragon Company.
>>94630698I think the closest they tried was the one time they sold a single of each Jes Goodwin chaos marines in a MTO set.
I hated pinning these guys like you wouldn't believe
>>94631099Was pinning them really necessary?
>>94630264>>94630461That was always there. The older style gm'd campaign games and less serious pickups were still part of the culture but the idea of optimizing and cheezing lists and whatever has always been part of that game base and games in general. Not saying it didn't shift, but to remember all the various times they had to explain stuff like https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mw5NfJlRrcQ
>>94631161I dunno, but the heads sure seem sturdy now
>>94630666What happened in 2021? What a downgrade.
>>94631386Why do you think it happened 2011 and not 2016? I have no idea, i found that pic and found it funny.
>>94631161Says a man who's never had a totally-doesn't-need-pinning normal model topple off the edge of a table, crack, and have parts skitter off into the nether-realm under the dresser never to be found again(until three years later when it blows out your hoover).
>>94631992Let me tell you about pinning
>>94630459>needs some cheeky licence plate, help me come up with some?M4D CNTF45TAK1N6 SH1T>>94629854If I remember the procedure right for back then as described in the how to make terrain book, it was a board covered with fine grit sand painted green, possibly drybrushed yellow then covered with flock. We've come a way in terrain making tech, as more materials have become widely available and techniques refined. Though honestly I still prefer the look of a flocked board over a printed mat.
>>94630459>needs some cheeky licence plate3R3 W3G0
>>94632397Damn thats a good one>>94632180>F45TA ooh thats very good, short too so it would fit the plate nicely>M4D CNTlel
>>94630459GGA-NI-ATHX1138 (as is tradition)BRD-529 (a Chicago classic)RED-UNB1GSP0RZ0THR-5QGN0S-BRN4>>94632397this is also good
>>94631386>be Satan>fuck up basing>better paint a rainbow, if anyone notices feet smeared in paint I'll just cry bigotry and homophobia>and done, how delightfully devilish
>>94632639>BRD-529It's red though.
>>94631386Not really, skin is done better and gun is weathered, it's a mixture of more complex techniques done fairly well.
>>94630459DD-313 (pic related)
>>94632740And BDR-529 is black and white, what's yer point?
This weekend got some hobby stuff with oldhammer going as I work on some knightmare models to put together, gap fill and plonk on a base, will show once it's primed. Waiting for clear day
>>94636369>shoots left and right but never forward
/GROG/ got more alive.
Well, this was quite a project. I hope I managed to give it proper paintjob and pins hold. Still need to finish the flag and that licence plate
>>94640753Ebin, forgot the pic
>>94631992Boomer her, no one pinned heads, ridiculous
Rolled 4, 1, 2, 2, 4, 1 = 14 (6d6)I'VE CHARGED IN WITH MY HIVE TYRANT WHO IS BRANDISHING TWO BONE SWORDSWHO WISHES TO FACE ME IN HAND TO HAND COMBAT WITH MY WS OF 9 AND 2 PARRIES?
>>94642486>Hive Tyrant, we a have a warrant for your arrest. Don't make this hard on yourself.
>>94642486LOGAN GRIMNAR FEARS NO OVERGROWN INSECT! TASTE MY BLADE.
Rolled 4, 1, 2 = 7 (3d6)>>94643403attack dice
>>94643403I hate space wolves so fucking much, they got more special characters and unique wargear than most other armies combined, all of which have some kind of gimmick to them, they just have to have better stats and stuff than anyone else without anykind of downsides to them.Because of that gay smug aura they extrude makes them just so unlikeable even if they have cool thing going on about them with the viking theme.
>>94643416fug. That's a 4+8 for 12, -vs- a 13 (+1 for the charge so 14) for the Tyrant.Grimnar loses the combat. The slimy bug leader slams 2 attacks onto the massively bearded Chapter Master. Now how will the damage play out?
Hive Tyrant stats for whenever >>94642486 gets back and so no one has to flip through .pdfs
Since they made base contact and grimnar isnt immune to psychology, he must roll fear test to see if the legs it before any attacks are made
Rolled 6, 3 = 9 (2d6)>>94643541>>94643403Wolf Master of the Wolf Wolves has a Ld of 10, so let's see if this son of Russ can embody the spirit of the Great Wolf.
>>94643727Close call, but he bares his oversized fangs and proceeds to give zero fucks about the hulking xeno that is about to hamburgerize him. I'm sure the Khorne infused relic axe has nothing to do with it.
>>94632765Anon, that weathering looks terrible, come on.
>>94643751But it is done at least, but I know for a fact that what we got here is another example of a zoomer pretending to be a grog because he is just afraid of colours
Rolled 6, 6, 6, 1 = 19 (4d6)>>94642486Obligatory:>Kharn enters the chat>can't be parried, gets to reroll fumblesWS of 9 as well lets goooo
I'm sorry if this question is asked here spot, I'm not sure, first time posting here. I used to play a ton of 40k with my family and a few close family friends back in 7th edition, then 8th edition as well. We have been 40k fans since playing dawn of war as little kids and reading our dad's copy of rogue trader, and are still fans, but we lost interest in playing 40k tabletop late 8th edition and 9th. Long story short, we are looking at getting back into playing but want to play 3rd or 4th, but can't settle on one of these two. Is anyone able to outline the differences between 3e and 4e and why you would play one over the other?
Rolled 2 (1d6)>>94644652bit overkill arleady but rerolling that fumble>6 6 6THIS PLEASES THE DARK GODS
Rolled 6, 4, 1, 1, 3, 5 = 20 (6d6)>>94644652>>94644677Tyrant scores 4Kharn scores 6 + 2 from crits + 2 from Tyrants fumblesSo Kharn scores 6 hits with STR 7 from his axe against the Tyrants toughness of 6, needing 3's to wound
>>94644652Impressive. Unfortunate that the Tyrant declared the charge, but Frenzy means Kharn still gets 2 CC attacks. Gorechild is S7 against the Hive Tyrant's T6. Roll 'em. >>94643458This is also obviously why quest threads are banned as the spam created by rolling and commentary means you burn threads down fast. That and the fun of old school PbP forum bullshittery.
>>94644736Oh yeah, forgot to add in those crits. I should play 40k more than once every 5 years.
>>94644752I'm just as bad, I forgot to double his attacks from his frenzy, shoulda been 7 dice instead of 4(native 3, doubled from frenzy 6, CC weapons bonus +1 = 7)
>>94644672Most would probably agree that 3rd with a healthy mix of 3rd/3.5th/4th ed Codex selections would be the most interesting. There was some healthy discussion last thread on that very subject.3rd to 4th changes very broadly:1. You can always rapid fire within 12 inches, even if you move.2. If you manage to inflict a wound on every member of a target squad you can nominate one of them that MUST attempt a save.3. Vehicle changes such as vehicle weapons are now split into two categories: "Main" (Strength 7 or greater) and "Defensive" (Strength 6 or less). Vehicles can now move up to 6" and shoot with ALL of their Defensive Weapons and ONE of their Main Weapons. Vehicle damage is somewhat different as well.4. Close combat has been streamlined. Everyone participates 100% within 2 inches.5. Sweeping advances now rely on your initiative plus a d6 thus making them less random.some overpowered meta tactics were nerfed going into 4th as well. 3rd also has the more subjectively aesthetically pleasing rulebook with loads of Wayne England bangers and a classic layout. 4th is the beginning of the Kopinsky era, and the layout is much more typical of modern 40k. The 3rd edition softcover rulebooks also have way better binding than the (typically GW bad) 4th edition hardcovers.
>>94644672Wayback machine totally breaks the formatting on old low res website versions but,>https://web.archive.org/web/20070121232601/http://uk.games-workshop.com/warhammer40000/tactica-vehicles/1/and>https://web.archive.org/web/20070125125713/http://uk.games-workshop.com/warhammer40000/tactica-assault/1/are two fairly comprehensive GW articles on the changes.
>>94644819I've still got my 4th rule book and the binding is holding on by its fingernails. Sucks because it's otherwise a great book. Lots of sovl as the kids say
Rolled 6, 2 = 8 (2d6)>>94643458Let's see if my space bug can do wound papa wolf with S6 v T5
Does 3rd edition 40k have a Crusade style narrative ruleset I can use to make a campaign? A few friends are interested and it seems like a good way to get them in.
>>94643951Damn, anon was right on point >>94632729
>>94645839We had few trolls like that litter the thread, frankly, good thing that moment you actually talk about playing the game and enjoying hings they tend to quit out of sheer anger of it all.
>>94645791Well, not sure it is present there but if you want, you can probably hacksaw together something similar by nicking something like necromunda character upgrade rules? Have some notable minis get extra stats or something like that
Rolled 1, 4 = 5 (2d6)>>94645520Lord Grimnar is in Terminator Armor, so he saves on a 3+ on 2D6, but the Bone Sword has a -3 modifier, so lets hope I roll higher than a combined 6!
>>94646275Grim
>>94646345None more grim. >>94646275And so the Great Wolf loses a wound (2 remaining) to the towering bio-monster and its living blades. Next Time! Will the stoic master of the Space Wolves and his enchanted axe break through the furious onslaught of the tyrannical Tyrant?Or will the Hive Lord prevail and send Viking wolf papa to yiff in hell? 完
Might be the wrong place, but there's grogs here. My buddy has a box of old pewter minis including picrel. Anyone know what the heck this is? There looks like something was etched roughly into the bottom but it was totally unreadable
>>94646726And my shot at fixing it up
>>94646726Looks like an excremental.
>>94646736Nice job. When I have old minis with an integrated blob base that I don't wanna carve, I tend to dremel out a hole in the plastic base, then epoxy it in. It sticks out way less that way.
>>94646818That's a good high effort idea I will keep. I usually build a little mound with putty to smooth out the problem, but for this guy hoped that glopping on some texture paste would hide it. I was being lazy. It sort of works, though those with keens eyes will know. To stay on topic, here's some oooolllld Necromunda figs I cringingly named. Bonus points to anyone who figures out the "Neo" model.
>>94646736from poo to pro :)
>>94646966Is he from Trinity Battlegrounds or Havok or something?
>>94647454Nope. Pewter, OOP, not GW though.
>>94645791>>94645864They have experience rules and a simple 'How to Campaign' section in the back of the book. I'm visiting relatives for christmas so youll have to settle for this bit I ripped from a PDF instead of better a better scan for now.I also think Cityfight may have added more but I'm not certain on that.Fuck this 900s Captcha bullshit by the way.
>>94647739That is exactly what I was hoping to get my hands on, thank you. I have the book, but I haven't finished reading all the way through. Didn't know something like that was in the core book, figured it'd be in 16 different white dwarfs or homebrew.
Is there a way to make 2nd edition's combat system work with bigger units and armies? I was going to suggest pooling the combat scores onto a unit v unit basis (Where it is the collective combat scores of the entire unit that determines the number of attacks v the losing unit similar to shooting) but then I realized how quickly that could get out of control with WS6+ units.
>>94647944>Didn't know something like that was in the core book, figured it'd be in 16 different white dwarfs or homebrew.Yeah, 3rd and the 4th edition rulebooks were pretty packed full of good shit like this. There was also a pile of stuff related to campaigns in white dwarf. There was also a great series of articles for a whfb campaign system for 6th edition, I know it's not 40k but it's still wort a read for ideas.
>>94644819That isn't what most people would agree at all, based on previous iterations of this thread or other places where grogs gather to grumble(a good group plural that actually: a Grumbling of Grogs). Pretty much everyone - who's interested in that era - lands on 4th core rules and mostly 3rd/3.5 'dexes from what I've seen(usual exceptions being SM, maybe BT, some also allow 'nids and Tau), which just seems sensible, I can't think of a single downside to using 4th over 3rd it was a strict improvement, more of an iteration of 3rd than anything else really.I suppose you could make a case for All Rulebook All The Time 3rd where you use no codexes at all and just stick with the BBB lists inside it in the same way some people swear by 6th WHFB + Ravening Hordes only, but personally I don't think the "pure 3rd" experience is as good as its fantasy counterpart of the era.
Got some random bits from Alternative Armies, here's 3 of themPicked up the Retained Knight closest in resemblance to the LE2 Imperial Space MarineThe Space Goblin on the end is almost certainly a 3D sculpt then cast in metal. Just picked up a load of random dudes for sci-fi games, and he threw in a few other free miniatures on top of the already advertised free miniatures, which is nice.
>>94650018Three more, why not.
>>94650029Also on a more /grog/ note I picked up one of Tony Ackland's (?) Adventurers for Asgard Miniatures, Bryan Ansell's company before Citadel. They have Nick Bibby's original Space Marines too but I'm not paying £4.50 each for one
>>94646966>high effortOh no, the high-effort option was to cut out the blobbase entirely, clean the remains, then pin the legs to the base that's actually used.Another high-effort would be to carve a space for the blob in an MDF base, high-effort since I take care not to go all the way through.But fuck doing all that shit either way, hence going "hole in plastic".
Going though my bits box for some oldhammer inspired projects for next year and thinking, anyone know spot where one could nab some 4th ed WFB bloodthirster scans? Got some missing legs and heads in a bits box.
>>94650018Man, I have seen slotta bases get flack before, but what a massive improvement tabbed minis were over integral bases.Carefully trimming bases off of a bunch of (plastic thankfully) frostgrave and quar minis right now so I can actually get to the fun part, which is conversions and painting.
>>94650159Bloodletters? The only Bloodthirster scan I have seen is pic related.
>>94650018>>94650029>>94650034Patrician choices anon
Finished the squad. Happy early sanguinala /grog/
>>94651426Forgor picture
>>94651444Well done
>>94642108I pinned every part of every metal model I had the misfortune to assemble. Maybe the old lead minis have addled your memory, gramps.
Not many people seem to be aware that in Rogue Trader only Tyranid Warriors and Hunter-Slayers were real Tyranids, others (Genestealers, Screamer-Killers, Zoats, Grabber-Slashers, Squigs) were just Bio-Constructs created by Tyranids.
>>94652036Weren't genestealer their own thing until they got folded into Tyranids in 2e?
>>94652238They were folded into Tyranids in Advanced Space Crusade. Technically they only became Tyranids in the 2nd edition, since they were just Bio-Constructs before that.
>>94650197That's the one I am after, seem that all "sale" variants got deleted of it, so need to look elsewhere I guess.
>>94652595aHR0cHM6Ly9nb2ZpbGUuaW8vZC84QURIRUQ=Merry Christmas.
Is there any method to calculating how many points an infantry unit should cost? Coming up with a homebrew for 3e 40k.
>>94653350I've seen one floating around for 2nd edition (Using it myself for my own backport project) but can't say I've seen one for 3rd.
Help me out /grog/nards, how am I supposed to do it right in 2024? Just punch it out and glue it together with PVA or tacky glue? Or do we know better than that by now?
>>94653408I guess that's worth a shot. Link?
>>94653613http://www.warspawnedpainting.co.uk/uploads/1/0/5/2/105203349/2nd_ed_points_values.pdf
>>94653511Yeah man, pop the vintage cardboard's cherry. I would use a glue gun though, just so you don't have to make little clamps while the PVA is drying.
gotta love some of the old face paintjobs you see on the market
>>94653511Oh, those are originals? I printed mine on paper and glued it on foamboard, like that guy on minisodes channel did but with originals too.
>>94654129That looks great.
>When even the !!CURRENTEDITIONGOOD!! meta chasers recognize 10th sucks>>94644672I second 4th rules with whatever compatible codexes you want to use.
>>94653752Hate glue guns but Christams Eve is the deadline so good call.>>94654129Yeah man, I was lucky enough to find a starter set for a decent price while traveling so I brought that home. Geez it is a hefty box! GW was generous back then. But it's like 30yo and your prints look honestly better. Any link to that episode?
Hey /grog/, you mind having a read through what I've done so far for my backport of modern models/units/factions into 2nd edition? Still heavily WIP and has changed a bit since the last time I posted it, but I want to know if I am on the right track with designing these datasheets and rules. You can skip reading the space marines one, I am probably going to do it last because of the sheer volume of crap modern marines have. Tried my best using sources I currently have to make it, but I know already certain things are going to be off or misremembering certain rules.
>>94654708I did a pretty laborious touchup of some very decent scans a while back if you want to have a backup set for printing out. same link as here >>94653134
>>94653134Huge thanks anon!
>>94654876I sure do! Thanks a lot anon.I found the Minisodes video and if anything this guy should have done exactly like you if he really intended to rescue his set. His results are decent but it would have made way more sense to find a digital copy, enhance and print it than glue a piece of history to foamboard and waste the printed verso in the process.
>>94653752>I'll just visibly fuck up the model because I can't be arsed to hold it steady for a minute, who cares amirite?
>>94656099I ended up using super glue because time was short and I figured out the quality was so over the top there was no big risks here. Plus it's battered building so if I end up doing a mess here or there it's weathering/battle scars.I'm interested though, why do you think glue gun is a no-go?
Hey /Grog/, did the studio ever paint some blood angels bikers for WD or army box sets back in 2nd-3rd? Having trouble finding pictures of any.
>>94656186Crisp, I'm glad that these card buildings that waited 31 years to be played with are finally going to see their intended use.
>>94656186I recommend trying out the Battle for Armageddon tutorial scenarios with them, we had a blast with them. They are very well desinged and can challenge even experienced player.
>>94646726>>94646736I think that might be a type of aberration from dnd. I don't remember the exact name of the monster though but I'm pretty sure that it's from dnd.
>>94657125Space Crusade Space Marines, nice.
>>94657338Yeah they fit 2nd ed monopose ones very nicely. I also got space hulk plastic terminator and advanced space crusade scouts to got with my blood angels
>>94657485Amazing
>>94657498That's the good stuff right there. Some real impetus to clear my painting backlog.
>>94657485South Pole>>94657498North Pole
>>94656265I have an image in my head that I don't think is actually real of an attack bike in BA colours. Couldn't find it. There were IF bikers in one of the army box set covers.
>>94657830I find that best motivation to paint stuff is chance to get to put it on table. I don't play with unpainted miniatures.
Merry Christmas lads have a good one
>>94659170Merry Christmas everyone.
>>94659170Merry Christmas to you too, anon. And to all you anons here in the thread today. I hope you've had a lovely day of it, and if not then for better days to come too you. I hope you've all got a sick as fuck project to share with us all next year, I know I've got something in the works that I can't wait to show you all.
>>94659170Merry christmas and may there be plenty of hobbying
Collecting Blood Angels is hell now, the old weapon sprues are impossible to get so you can't really assemble assault squads or Death Company, and even if you did have sprues, you'd have to make a difficult decision whether to give Death Company chainswords for later editions or actually good close combat weapons for the 2nd edition.
Merry Christmas, nearly finished this old Citadel mini.
>>946615783d Printer goes brrt.
>>94663406Not a real collector
>>94663435Good. Artificial scarcity is retarded when we can make prints of them.
>>94663435Shouldn't you be on Facebook with the rest of the anal purists then? In other news, got a nice Christmas treat coming up for all of my fellow fake collectors.
>>94626373>https://pastebin.com/nnNqqFLnThe pastebin is dead OP.
>>94663406>that fat plasma pistol
>>94663435I don;t give a fuck, I'd take someone who reasts and 3d-prints and makes his own models in the old style and actually plays games over "muh true collector" anytime.
>>94663406>>94663777You wouldn't happen to have scans of the Oldcromunda metal weapon sprues, would you?the chaos CCW sprue is great news though and I'll be grabbing it the moment I see it appear
>>94664020Immaculate taste, but unfortunately those have been on my most wanted list for absolute ages. Some of the best hand weapons on those, and the revolver stubber is one of the coolest sculpts ever.
>>94663435While I'm totally for the 3d printing and recasting, sometimes the real thing just feels right. I restored multiple plastic ork vehicles from bits of broken models instead of just getting chink resin copies. I might have to get the grot bomb launcha from DLM tho.
>>94665882I do both too. When I find good deals on old minis I buy them, but I also buy from metal recasters and print my own stuff from scans and personally resculpted stuff. Would love to buy a spincaster if I ever find one for cheap. Making my own metals from scans would be endgame. Rescuing trashed old stuff is definitely the best, but prices can be obscene even on the grottiest 12 thick coats of paint and broken shit. Covid ruined the markets.
>>94664020merry christmas anonaHR0cHM6Ly9tZWdhLm56L2ZvbGRlci90YjlrMUFLVCNmUmdQXzMyNWR3bDA0OGVjWVRVbzNn
>>94663406also same anon as above, how did you clean these up i have most of 2nd ed as stl and want to contribute but am not a blender wizard
>>94666631Process:1) Edit mode - untick selection to visible - border select - delete the sprue - separate loose objects.2) Object mode - add mesh - plane. Duplicate planes as needed, move them around to use them as virtual nippers to clean nubs and shit geometry closer than step 1) using Boolean - slice3) Individually select each NGon created by step 2), Triangulate Faces and then Subdivide Edges to get sculptable geometry.4) Sculpt Mode - I use a Wacom Intuos tablet with a combination of the Crease, Scrape, and Inflate tools. Dynatopo is on, with Subdivide Edges, Constant Detail and a resolution of 12. 5) Everything else is up to your drawing skill and experience with maneuvering around in 3D space. I've cleaned with a mouse too, but not really precise and no pressure sensitivity. Also, you really got my hope up with that link thinking it was the Necro bits. >>94663777So going by my progress, the Chaos CC's are going to be done in about 18 more hours of work, though the fist was the most fucked of the 4 weapons.
>>94666771thanks for the tutorial, are you posting these anywhere? if not i can make my own :)
Thanks Iron Snakes anon, I finally published the stuff you gave me. I left your name out, but you can email me again if you want it added.https://scratch-that.org/2024/12/25/warhammer-40k-2e-battle-between-iron-snakes-and-space-orks/
>>94666875As per my post:>>94663777This is my XMAS present to my fellow Groglords. They'll be up here when they get finished. (And then will magically show up in some paid file on that shithead's telegram, but ¯\_(ツ)_/¯, that's life.)
>>94666931Marvelous! I thought that my email got eaten, glad to see that it all arrived to you and I'm stoked that you used it for an article! Merry Christmas, mate, I'll be in touch with more battle reports, not just 40k2e, some classic Warzone too when I can manage it.
>>94666931Nice batrep, bookmarking your blog. Good on you for keeping a blog going. >>94666999Nice modeling/converting! Your Dread is amazing. Got any more pics of it?
>>94667011>Nice modeling/converting! Your Dread is amazing. Got any more pics of it?Thanks! He was a real labor of love, I think I have some more recent photos I can share, if not I'll take some later on for the thread, gonna do some painting this evening so I can get that done.
>>94666999Apologies again, I got sucked deep into IRL stuff. I'm going to make a 2025 effort to post more regularly. I've got a few articles already baked for release. I'd love more oldhammer stuff, so send anything you like. On my end, I plan on playing some Space Hulk here (it will be 3e Space Hulk so not precisely oldhammer)
1 of 4 done. Possibly my finest work ever. aHR0cHM6Ly9nb2ZpbGUuaW8vZC9KUHU2VVg=
>>94667414
>>94667414>>94667440Thank you anon. People like you doing things like this keep the hobby going.
>think I spend too much on warhammer>take a peek on ebayI feel better already.>>94667414by the empra, excellent job anon!
>>94667440>10000hrs in mspaint Thanks anon.
Yep, it's gaming time.
Painting some old Epic 40k ruins for a Pocket Warhammer project.I did go with a grey plaster/yellow brics colorscheme as per the 2nd Edition Starter Set's cardboard buildings.Felt like not bothering with the detailed rubbles on the base and just paint the whole thing bright green to help the ruins pop out a bit more. Is it a good idea contrast-wise or do I really suck at this?
>>94670279The well manicured golf courses of our ancestors would approve.
>>94670082Will be breaking out Heroquest and Lost Patrol to entertain the visiting midgets over this holiday weekend
Someone posted john blanche miniatures in a previous thread and made a fun shield challenge, so I figured I'd post mine.Merry belated Christmas guys
>>94670513Okay it turned out really easy to paint the base without hitting the rubbles so I did go through the extra effort.Should I paint said rubbles light grey like the plaster or yellowish like the brics? Or something brownish like dirt? Trying to not detract the eye from the ruins themselves. Might as well fill them green anyway if you guys reckon it will end up a color-busy scene at 6mm.
>>94671348Wall color but hit it with agrax or marine juice or similar warm brown wash.
>>94670798Missing textures, nice
>>94671739A man of culture. Favorite 80-90's vidya?
>>94671867I guess that would be perfect dark 64
How does one kill that which cannot die?
Got an awesome assault marine sculpt in a trade from my buddy for an ice cream. Gonna paint him up for my Mantis Warriors.
>>94676108Gem chest 2E Mark VIIIs, my beloveds. Perfect Jes Goodwin proportions era.
>>94670798Thats a nice freehand (no pun intended). Also the clashing tones are a vibe
>>94675620Burn the last shard of his soul!
Hey /grog/, newfag here who has been playing smaller games of 2nd edition 40k with friends and we have been loving it but are now wanting to add psykers to the mix. I read in the quick guide I have about drawing cards which will give you your force to cast powers but also other effects, how many cards of each exist in the deck? I tried looking it up but I am getting nothing of note.
>>94671739Thanks! I had to look up missing textures lol>>94676847Thank you! I showed it off to some friends and I feel a bit better about the green and pink together
>>94678112Do you not have a (PDF) copy of Dark Millennium? And if not, how are you even going add Psykers without the rules?
>>94678233My group has been using this pdf:https://2e40k.com/pub/Librarium/2ndEditionBattleBible/W40K%202nd%20Ed%20BattleBible%201.7.2.pdfThat has everything BUT the number of cards. Thanks anon for giving me the direction.
>>94678112
>>94678276Thanks anon
>>94678240>>94678280NP.I'll throw the 2 box sets up on gofile in a after dinner.
>>94678112https://projectanvil.blogspot.com/2017/03/get-started.htmlShould be PDFs of all the necessary cards from the Starter Box and Dark Millennium. That's where >>94678276came from. Everything else is uploading to: aHR0cHM6Ly9nb2ZpbGUuaW8vZC84QURIRUQ=
>>94678240There's semi-regular updates, so you're a bit behind.
>>94679102>>94679291Thanks anons, now we get to try some of the real wacky stuff.
>>94679587I would google up on how other players have adjusted the psychic phase after you get a game or two in.
I know you guys love to read my spergouts on John Blanche and his painting approach.But this is probably the closest I have gotten to preordering a new product with zero reviews from a paint brand I don't use. Putting money in JB's pocket is something I can really endorse.
>>946800552 boxes of 10 paints each. 50$ ish dollars a box. I might have to call my LGS tomorrow and see about ordering.
https://youtu.be/ImhZClSQv5w?si=KS7PgV7XGdnDEZGKGoing by the comments age I am terminally out of the loop.
>>94650059There's also a medium-effort option - Wargames Atlantic has started selling plastic bases that are designed to be used "upside-down" and have a divot in the top like the original Battletech hex bases. you can drop in a puddle base and then fill in around it with basing paste or putty. As a bonus it helps keep the figure weighted
>>94675620Multimelta ought to do it.
>>94681236Neat. More for historical minis with shallow puddles like they show, but it's still nice to have another option.
Ron of great work here. Ork anon, blood angels anon, I see you both. Lots of other great work. Lads I've got about another week where I can concentrate at a desktop to put up some posts on the blog. Beauty shots, projects, battle reports (or partial battle retellings with some photos). Whatever. If you want to hand it over I'll try and figure out a way to fit it into a blogo post so it has more staying power than a grog thread that disappears. I know some of you have already given me stuff in the past and I've hopefully put it up. Email in the pic
I know there's a kill team general but this is where the cool kids are so I have a question.My mate got me a kill team of chaos marines for Christmas, nice of him, but I haven't been into Warhammer since I was 14 in 2002. How do I paint these fuckers to feel old? have that look that I miss? Also I cant pick what legion to paint them, what should I go Emperors Children or Word Bearers?
>>94687865Well, easy way to make them look old is looking up color sections of the older era 40k books, there should be some in this here thread, as well as on google, so 3rd era chaos I think is your time frame?
>>94687865Check out the Night Lords upgrade sprue
>>94687976Would be rad if I hadn't already put together my boys. Thanks for the info though.>>94687956This is a very good idea, ill look into it but where would I find the info? A codex? a White Dwarf?
>>94688270Both really, google will show you some pdfs of that era codexes, in middle you will find the old paint sections usually. White dwarfs for sure work too
>>94654844Put a date on the front page, that way people can know when you have posted a new version. And you gotta work on your typesetting my man, people are going to open that, scroll past 70 pages of identical looking text their eyes glaze over and then close it to go take a shower.Bold your unit entry names. Where are the page numbers? Add a table of contents! You also have a lot of repeat information, condense the weapons into a wargear section instead of repeating them on every page, I dont want to have to cross check the hyperphase whatever from 3 different pages to see if its the same.
Is there better aka easly redable version of 3rd edition Space Marines codex?Also is there better version of Imperial Guard 3rd ed first codex, scan is quite bad but I saw high quality regiments page.
Alright ive been working on the rules for engagement range for like a week now going in circles trying to streamline stuff without working myself into a corner. Id like some feedback as to which of these two versions seems more intuitive.The quick rundown: >top optionEngagement range can be "expanded" by purposely delaying your attacks in combat, lending to the notion of minimum and maximum engagement range. My main issue here is its hard to have the rules all in one place, and by the time you get to the rules for 'who you attack who' its kinda too late.>bottom optionBy defining a rapid and expanded engagement range up front, I can just reference these. I can have all the rules up front in once place, but it feels a bit more clunky.
Been doing fresh high quality 2nd Ed. Token Layouts. Still need to add the Turn Token and a few Blight Grenade tokens.There is gonna be a wee bit of free room. The layout already has extras of most tokens, but are there any more I should add on?
>>94690105Nope. 3rd edition suffers greatly from early internet shit scans. Buy them and debind them with a heatgun and do some 600 dpi page scans and put them on archive.org. Be the change.
>>94690038Very good feedback, thank you man.
>create 3E because 'everyone wants to play bigger games'>have to create 40k in 40 minutes a few years later
>>94691971I still find 3rd to be sorta meh edition, it's really one of those times where I can legit say later editions were better as were previous ones...it much like 10th ed are just fucking boring.
>>94691512This is what I am gonna run with. Now to do the opposite side.
>>94692332>>94691512Dont forget the bleed. extend the background color outside the intended bounds of the markers, so when you cut them you dont end up with white slivers along the sides. Then you can get yourself a square punch if you want. Always space things out when printing so when you cut one badly you dont ruin the neighbor too.
>>94692439There is no background color, these are scans. I do see your point, but preserving the artifacts of the original color printing process is the whole reason I am bothering with this nonsense. I could clone stamp bleed but that's a lot of extra work. I also use a framing mat cutter to cut tokens, making it trivial. And a real circle cutter to cut rounds. Punches would be cool to fake the original die cutting, but finding ones to match random GW token sizes would be impossible. There are 5 different token sizes on that sheet, and only 3 are square. Thanks for the feedback nonetheless, I'll keep bleed under consideration when I remaster the card templates.
>>94692815>these are scansOh I did not realize, sorry. I thought you had re-created them by hand.
>>94696815That filename reminds me, if you use Livingstone's choose your own adventure books art, dark souls quite literally starts there
>>94696815I really wish Wil Rees had done more art with GW.
>>94692332Well thats done. PDF is in the same folder as linked >>94679102
Anyone know if there are decent scans of the Necromunda painting and modeling guide?
>>94697847thank you, a lot of people getting into 2nd keep asking for these
I've gotten my hands on the old Chaos Dreadnought but I need some help deciding between the power scourge or the power claw shown in the catalogue. The scourge is the one everyone knows but I like the claw, I feel like giving the dread a big, red, meaty claw would be nice.I'm also debating giving him a gobbo green base, seeing as its from 2nd edition it's only fitting but it won't match my planned basing for my 3rd edition CSM. On the other hand, it seems some of the models from 3rd also had goblin green bases so maybe I could just base them all that way.
>>94699419Power Claw because, as you said, a big red claw just screams oldhammer.And a square base. Snakebite or GGreen base rims. But you also have to just trust your gut and go with the scheme that makes you happiest.
>>94699365Thank you for saying thank you. Also just realized I that I can swap in/out a few tokens for a complete Necromunda 95 set as well.
>>94699419I find the claw is a bit too small on the dread. I wish I had the scourge instead
>>94700031Big meaty claw it is.>And a square base.That might be a problem, I've already glued the bottom half of the dread to a round base. Might have to see if there are any 60mm round to square base convertors online.And while I'm now committed to goblin green bases for all my chaos dudes all the marines are already painted sons of horus green which is rather muted. Hopefully all the gold trim, bones, and red bits will help them stand out against it.>>94700332That's true the scourge makes the dreadnought look bigger. But it hangs about an inch or so past a 60mm base rim which has me concerned about it taking extra storage space. And I'm honestly strongly considering just getting two more to build all the weapon options. Two more bodies and that mail order thunder hammer and heavy bolter and I'll have the trio.
Anyone have the 2nd ed ork codex they could upload. One in pastebin is fucked?
>>94700434>>94699419Just use magnets and swap them as desired. Dreads are ideal for it.
>>94627599Reminds me of slop movies that need to make a billion dollars to break even.
>>94700825aHR0cHM6Ly9tZWdhLm56L2ZpbGUvV1BBZ3lMNVojN2RFTjVaX0hWUlJYaFBZLS1aSlN2QlJYYndGc3FfdGp4YnV1U210aVhuOA==
>>94700825aHR0cHM6Ly9nb2ZpbGUuaW8vZC9INk5GZXI=
>>947009112nd edition really is best edition.
>>94700870The thought had crossed my mind. The hole on the weapons connecting them to the torso fit two 6x2mm magnets while the hole for the melee weapon to the shoulder will need some drilling to fit a magnet. But I have a spare melee shoulder so I can use that for the scourge and if magnetized I could swap between the scourge and claw freely.However, since everything is metal I worry if the magnets will be able to hold the weight of the guns. Perhaps I can cut just a bit off the weapon mount to keep some of the peg inside of the hole one it's magnetized for extra support.
>>94699419>On the other hand, it seems some of the models from 3rd also had goblin green bases so maybe I could just base them all that way.They used a lot of the leftover 2e models in the studio for photoshoots well into 3e, and later on some of the early 3e stuff was still cropping up for well over a decade. Especially Jes Goodwin's stuff. There was a big exodus from the Heavy Metal teams when the early 3e shakeup hit, and they started doing the new basing styles in the lead-up to the Armageddon campaign.>claw or scourgeIf you're Slaanesh, it's practically required to take the claw. Also the Scourge is a huge fucking pain in the ass to store and move around the table on a 50mm square, which is what those suckers were packed with until mid-Third. >>94700434 Don't stress too much about it, though, as soon as the 60mm bases came out they started packing some in with the Dreads.>>94701138>since everything is metal I worry if the magnets will be able to hold the weight of the guns. Perhaps I can cut just a bit off the weapon mount to keep some of the peg inside of the hole one it's magnetized for extra support.This is the way, yeah. I've magged up multiple all-metal Dreads, they need some of the peg to stay aligned. You can also drill a bit further down in the peg-hole before you put the magnets in to preserve even more of the mating/support surface. I also counter-bored the peg and put slightly smaller magnets into it to get a better mechanical bond -- if you don't a shock can dislodge the magnet from the Dread body and then the whole thing might as well not be magnetized at all.
>>94701237Excellent, thanks a bunch anon. Tomorrow I'll spend more time planning on what to do with magnetizing the dreadnought. For now I'm going to work on cleaning up and assembling some 3rd edition Dark Eldar and CSM.
>>94700908>>94700911I couldn't figure out how to use this
>>94701343
>>94701343Welcome to /tg/ in general and /GROG/ specifically, tourist. I hope you enjoy your stay. Perhaps consider lurking for a few more threads before posting requests, or maybe browse the back catalogue of threads linked in the OP on one of the handy 4chan archival sites.
>>94701343Search for Base64 decoder and paste the gibberish into it to get the web address. Sometimes people use Rot13 instead so if B64 ever doesn't work try that. Dumbasses keep acting as if they're wizards guarding ancient knowledge by refusing to just tell people which is retarded because literally the only point of encoding links is to stop bots grabbing them easily, any of the actual people who'd want to take links down learned the trick five minutes after people started using it.
>>94701639
>>94701343>I couldn't figure out how to use thisIt's light.Handle's adjustable; good for righties or leftiesBreaks down into four partsUndetectable by x-rayIdeal for quick, discrete interventions.
>>94703398Um, what does this little red button on the bottom do?
>>94701639It's a basic respect test and is a user made Captcha. Sure, primitive encryption keeps the web spiders at bay, but it also is a super basic form of gatekeeping and ensures continuity. It also helps draw the line between being helpful, and spoonfeeding driveby leeches. Spannungsbogen is also a functional concept. If you work for something, you might appreciate it a bit more.
Happy new year /grog/
>>94706368Happy New Year!
https://graemedavis.wordpress.com/2024/11/02/advanced-heroquest-some-outtakes-i-found/Graeme Davis found a load of his unused AHQ content and has been posting it on his blog. Pretty fascinating reads.
>>94703655>Spannungsbogen is also a functional concept.fuck off you pretentious pseud loser, if this is how you write on /tg/ I feel real sorry for the tutors that have to mark your assignmentsI honestly can't be fucked breaking down how retarded what you wrote is (when you were actually saying something) but it is obvious the reason why you're being obscurantist is that desperate to be on the inner for once, but being such a powerless pindicked dork that this tiny muscle flex on some dusty general on 4chan is the only you can do soalmost certainly with somebody else's scans too
Does anybody have scans of the 2nd edition terminators? Or any other terminators for that matter.
>>94706368Happy new year
>>94703655Seeking out this thread full of grumbling assholes on this shitty hellsite and asking for help is sufficient demonstration of sincerity to merit help, and the only person homosexual enough to believe that you do this shit for any reason other than to grant your vapid, empty, pitiable life some brief flash of validation by pretending to be something more than you are is yourself. The only gate we should be keeping is whichever one you snuck through, you hateful twat.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=a8fM-QzQh14>the imperial juggernaut>it can transport 3 banebladesit does WHAT?
>>94712055That's what a Capitolis Imperialis can do after all; they just took that idea, refined it a bit, gave it a more '40k' name and stuck it in a more appropriate scale game.Fuck I wish that guy was a better at filming though, he has such a collection of stuff and so many cool scratchbuilds but his vids are always just kinda wobbly and blurry, it's like if I'd tried to make them.
Since they said to eventually delete Virus Outbreak and Vortex grenades, is there any other weapons or rules you think should've been dumpstered from 2nd ed 40k?
>>94713474>is there any other weapons or rules you think should've been dumpstered from 2nd ed 40k?Graviton Gun.
>>94713474Combat drugs, power field and whole space wolves codex, especially their wargear
>>94713474The Virus Outbreak strategy card had a "rip it up" ruling in WD but vortex grenades never got any kind of official banning (and there is absolutely nothing wrong with them).
>>94715603Only problem with vortex grenades is that the counter for them is just as expensive. Orks could get vaxxine squig for 50 points too to counter virus outbreak. Virus Outbreak would have been alright if you could not drop it on enemys deployment zone.
>>94709674>this mad they can't into n64Not everyone that asks for help should be helped in the way they ask, or at all.
>>94626373are there any STLs for giant trolls like pic related? need them for my snotling hordes army.
I'm a Fantasyfag but am considering getting (back) into old 40k. 3rd ed is what I grew up with and what I've been gravitating towards but after doing some research it seems like a lot of people shit on it and say to play 2e. Can someone redpill me on the difference and which one is ultimately better? I prefer the art, units and factions of 3e but 2e sounds like a funner game.
>>94716174I grew with 3rd too, but 2nd is way superior and I play it exclusively now. 2nd ed needs a lot more prep work tho, but everything is easily available for printing it yourself. Game itself is way more complex down to a simple grenade throw being an event especially when it goes spectacularly wrong. Army building feels great and all factions have their own way of list building. Mighty heroes truly are mighty and you dont have any reason to field them in small battles. Games are generally small scale, like space marine 1500 points which is "standard" size game is roughly just one proper hero, couple mandatory characters, max three squads and a vehicle. Psychic phase is just another game on top of the regular game, its just wild, pic related.Tldr; yes 2nd is better but more demanding
>>94716174Essentially >2e is wacky and has a lot of leeway to make your own force. It's also extremely complicated in some areas, especially the vehicle rules, and codex creep gets pretty brutal. >3e has most of the best codexes, but the rules have critical issues (notably close combat)>4e fixes most of the rules issues and introduces Combat Patrol/Kill team (the fun one that encourages you to actually make new models). Unfortunately mid-4e is when GW lost the Chapter House lawsuit, fired Fat Bloke, and The Great Enshittification of Codexes Began. So 4e rules patches on top of mostly 3e codexes, *especially* for Chaos and IG, is the best way to do 40k from that era. 2e has its charms, it's just not the game you probably fell in love with.
Look what mail brought today
>>94717423In to the funny juicy you go
>>94690474please respond...I just wanna have someone to talk homebrew rules with since /fourk/ died.
>>94690474Bullet points anon, they help. >Engagement range determines how close a model must be to engage in melee combat. >This is used to determine striking distance required to engage and remain part of melee combat. >Engagement range can be increased by using Speed. >SIMPLE EXPLANATION OF RATIO HERE>SIMPLE BREAKDOWN OF WHATEVER SLOW ISI checked out at >good enough
>>94717573/fourk/ died for a reason. I'll look into your pdf soon but others gave you some very good advice already.
>>94717395>Unfortunately mid-4e is when GW lost the Chapter House lawsuitChapterhouse lawsuit was during 6th.
>>94717609Yes you are right. I'll format and polish the sentence structure as I move forward. But which version did you like better?>>94717784Makes me sad. Those were some of the best weeks on tg.
>>94717395>fired Fat BlokeWhat, why?
>Newfag playing 2nd edition 40k>Finally get to test out the psychic phase>Hive Tyrant casts Hypnotic gaze on the Genestealers and get a lot of value from it>Enemy uses psychic duel against my hive tyrant with his librarian and the librarian loses pretty hard (Damn dice rolls lol)>Next turn he tries to use a power>I play Daemonic attack>Psyker is dragged to the warp screaming thanks to the demonsThis is fun.
>>94717395>mid-4e is when GW lost the Chapter House lawsuit,The Chapterhouse suit (which they actually won around 1/3 or their claims for, enough to force CH to cease operation) ran from 2010-2014, so concurrent with the end of 5th Ed to the start of 7th Ed>fired Fat BlokeHe was replaced right at the start of 4th Ed, less than a year into it
>>94718513>>94717785for some reason I remembered CH being earlier, my bad. But yeah, losing Fat Bloke and a bunch of the other old guard while putting a pillow over the face of Specialist Games was a pretty harsh turning point.>>94718290Something like "incompatibility with the future direction of the company". Basically FB was pushing to keep general hobbyist stuff, shits-and-giggles rules, and a more "gamers talking games" tone in White Dwarf and GW wanted to make it an even more blatant advertising rag while cutting down on extra content. You can really see the difference after he left.
>>94717861>But which version did you like better?Neither. They're both overly informal and wordy. Rules are technical documents. Aim for clear and concise.
>>94718845
>>94718872
>>94718887mmm, scorched brown, I miss smelling cocoa whenever I opened a pot. >>94718669>Aim for clear and concise.this.>>94690474You're writing like a sophomore Humanities student trying to hit word count, my man. That shit is rambling, repeats itself constantly, and has quite a few spelling and grammar errors. The tone's deflecting from the content onto yourself with all of the "when we say x, we're describing y". stuff, when you can just say "X means y"Furthermore you're putting numbers at the end of sections instead of the front, which *removes* context. Some of the extra stuff seems to be more tactical advice than rules; you could put it in a sidebar instead.I recommend looking at the Clash of Spears rulebook. They have a really good layout -- a wordier but still concise full description, then a bullet-pointed reference at the end of each section.As an example, here's how I'd re-write a section of this>Engagement Range is the distance at which a model can take part in a melee combat. The base engagement range is normally 1". [ed: specify where you can find the numbers for Engagement range on a model's profile here -- for example "Some weapons grant a longer Engagement range, which is noted under their special rules"]. Any model can expand their engagement range (typically to 2") by reducing their combat speed one level. >Sidebar text:>[For models locked in combat, Slow speed should be enough. Preserving their base speed lets units react more effectively on the battlefield. Speed is particularly important to units attempting combat withdrawals.]That cuts three massive paragraphs into two clear statements, and still gets the extra context onto the page. Always imagine your reader is in the middle of a game and trying to skim the book so he can look up the number he needs for the next dice roll.
>>94718872Man I miss when the Exorcists were a cool Radical experiment that could go horribly wrong at any moment instead of the neutered GK ripoffs nuGW made them into.
Finished for the night, after many days of Simple Green and brushing I finally got to work on my Captain. I haven’t decided if he’ll be an UM or Rainbow Warrior yet. The blue is more purple than I expected but I like it. Tomorrow I’ll finish the flesh, heraldry, and power glove design then I’ll do the highlights.
>>94720133Beautiful
>>94718669Im still in the 'get meaning on the page' part of development, but I do still appreciate your feedback. >>94719473Ive been struggling with the notion of engagement range for because of the english meaning of the word 'engaged'. In original source material the authors are very loose with the word 'engaged' to simultaneously mean 'locked in combat' and 'within engagement range' which are notably not the same thing. Im currently in the middle of a re-write where I got super detailed about this only to have it all fall apart cause I boxed myself into a corner with conflicting definitions. Thank you for the pointer towards other references, I'll check out clash of spears. And even more thanks for your concrete example.>trying to skim the book so he can look up the number he needsI had the idea to write in the concept/variable for 'engagement range' to try to establish a connection between similar/related rules throughout the book to make things easier to remember. But that means looking something up in the index might take you to the page without the answer.
>>94721495Honestly I'd just bite the bullet and define stuff as "locked in combat" and "engagement range". And probably go for a recursive definition, like "A model is considered locked in combat if it starts its movement phase within the engagement range of an enemy model", then have the choice about keeping or lowering speed happen before the movement phase.
>>94721495>Im still in the 'get meaning on the page' part of development,Write less. Put the actual rules you need to know in bullet point. Put the bullet points in order. If you can add more words to them or clarify try that. As is you don't have meaning on the page because you put too much shit on the page. There have been at least 2 posted examples of how to define engagement range that worked a lot better than what you were up to. Steal those.
Hey grognards, I was giving 4th edition a try with my best friend and he pointed out to me Rapid Fire was different in 3rd. We cracked the book open and sure enough it looks like it was different!My understanding is Rapid Fire allows you to shot once at 12" if moving but twice at 12" or once at 24" if stationary in 3rd.Whereas Rapid Fire allows you to shot twice at 12" if moving but ince at 24" if stationary in 4th. So less options here.Was this change induced for balancing or streamlining purpose? Honestly I find 3rd edition's take on Rapid Fire more logical.Also there's some babble in 4th about how you can't shoot a Rapid Fire weapon when assaulting because your weapon's bursts in said assault are already included but I can't see how it's not absolute bollocks since there's only two modificators for an assault: charging and having 2x single hand weapons.Plus if you upgrade a basic trooper from a Rapid Fire weapon to an Assault or Heavy weapon they don't tell you to adjust any stats either. So yeah, I call bullshit here. I hope I'm wrong though because I was parsing through Hail Caesar few months ago and Rick Priestley was still trailing the same lie so that would be a ficking loooong time getting away with it.
>>94724957>Rapid Fire allows you to shot twice at 12" if movingI think the change was just to increase the effectiveness of shooting. So that more closer quarter fire fights would break out. 3rd had a lot of center of the battlefield scrums Some units would move, others would just stand still and shoot and not move the entire game. So they wanted to mix it up a bit - freeing units up to move a bit more makes movement more of a factor and makes the game less dull.
>RT marines>modern chapter schemesI cant hate them
>>94725004Oh okay, I can absolutely see that being a thing. Heavy Weapon is already a strong incentive to not move much so no one needed Rapid Fire to push for this gameplay too.To be frank I was re-reading the whole thing and I think I misunderstood 4th's rules. My first take on it was that you could ONLY shot once up to 24" if stationary whereas on second read it looks like you can EITHER shot twice at 12" or once at 24".So it's basically easier to use and remember than 3rd's rules while also giving you more incentive to move forward. Good design choices overall.Apart for the assault bullshit. Rick Priestley could easily have given SMG weapons something like a +1 Initiative in a Charge to mimick some quick hip spraying instead of pretending it was all accounted for.
>>94725175Priestly designed Bolt Action and I think SMG's and assault rifles have an explicit bonus to assaults there
>>94725223Nice. Do you remember the specific rule he used? I couldn't participate yet but I saw an anon here trying his best to update 4th edition and it amused me that at first glance it looked like he was struggling to maintain some of the finickiness of who can fight or not in an Assault.If you look at Priestley's more recent works like Warlords of Erehwon you can see he absolutely doesn't care about this at all anymore and he's happy to abstract it to a nice and good "if one mofo is in range then everybody's in!". I can definitely see my buddy and I playing 4th this way.Priestley also get rid of Roll to Wound and while it is the right choice I can't see such a houserule being imported in a grog 40k game though.
What's a decent snappy creed or motto for for /mydudes/ Space Marine chapter? Iron Angels (named mainly because I was gifted a bunch of DA minis but don't like DA, so I had to incorporate the angel element to the name). They are a staunchly set in their way chapter which sees themselves with a primary responsibility to contain or destroy DAOT creations, which their sector is rife with since in the age of strife it was home to very high tech humans who destroyed eachother, leaving behind ancient sealed military bunkers and buried ruins full of dangerous high tech. Every motto I think of is either too wordy or already taken
>>94725729>Iron lights the darkness. >Never forgive, never forget. Something about sins of the past.
>>94724957From what I remember what this mostly lead to locally was instead of everyone rushing towards each other in rhinos or whatever and piling out to assault, it changed to that followed by short ranged shooting instead.>>94725729Let the dead remain soDeny what once wasI dunno, but the movie looks kinda cool, probably up on youtube somewhere like most old kung fu movies: https://www.dailymotion.com/video/x8i8zfx
>>94725789"The sins of the past will be the death of our future."Or"Once was, shall never be again."
>>94724957Rapid fire got buffed a little bit every edition from 3rd to 6th. To the point where you can shoot twice at half or once at max range, regardless of how you moved.>>94725295>assault finickinessThe real rules for assault in the editions I know well (4th 5th 6th 7th) all have their problems.The to wound roll is good imo. d6 systems just dont do well with dice mods, dice gates work much better, which is why we have cover saves and not hit mods. If you use a bigger dice though then its easy to combine stuff. I like the starship troopers way, but I wont say its inherently better or worse..
>>94728305A solid chunk of 4th's design was deliberately nerfing the shit out of close combat after how brutal it could be in 3rd. Instead of leafblower lists there were quite a few lawnmower ones. I do not look back fondly on trying to handle high-WS, 11+ Armor walkers -- the Sisters of Battle Yahoo group adopted a filk called "How Do You Solve a Problem Like a Wraithlord" (off of the Sound of Music's "...Like Maria") as our anthem for several years. Most of the changes were designed to prevent people being in a situation where the opponent just couldn't respond at all, like the new Walker rules, or to keep one unit from rolling up a whole army on its own in a couple of turns4e also started pushing the concept of "firefight range" which had mostly been a term the fans were using themselves up to that point, and trying to tone down transport vehicles following a couple extremely abusive lists in mid-late 2000. They also did a bunch of more subtle things, like price tweaks on wargear and harsh limits on the number of power fists and equivalents in multiple armies
>>94715923I'm the anon who told him how to do it you delusional retard, so I obviously can into it. And yeah sure if someone comes in acting like a massive, gaping, soppy twat - basically like you are - then they should be told to fuck off, but anon didn't, they just asked, and it takes less effort to answer them and spread stuff to more people thus increasing resilience and adding to the sum total of joy on this miserable ball of shit than it does to be as much of an absolute mong as you are.Seriously, even if you can't climb down from your towering ego in public, at least have the honestly to admit to *yourself* that you're just a bitter twat who does this so he can feel special for a change.
New thread ya gits>>94731142>>94731142>>94731142
>>94729906Nou
