Showers

>>191479
>I think there should always be a bowl of oranges on the front desk for anyone to have
你是中国人吗?

I dunno about should, but I'm super envious of the places with secondary mats that are pretty much always open mat as long as the school is. Really good way to justify those monthly bills.

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>>191479
This sounds retarded and specific but How can I takedown a sport shotokan guy? One leg in the front, small jumps, moving constantly, always at long distance and avoiding any grab and exchange.
A BJJ/MMA guy told me to do a single leg.

probably just mints. that'd be pretty cool. maybe spearmint, I like spearmint.

>>191610
I don't care for the smell of spearmint, wintergreen is preferable

>>191601
Is there striking involved?

>>191625
There is striking involved but the practitioners don't know how to use knees and sprawl.

>>191662
>>191601
Gi involvement is probably gonna be a big deciding factor here for suggestions. Not that the typical karate gi is great for rip & tear.

>>191662
>>191664

What's the context here? Are you fighting some dude that's gonna wear a karate gi? Are you in a cage/ring or open mat?

If they're blitzing in with point karate style moves, take a few hits to catch a kick and finish the single leg however you like.

You can shoot for a low single but you're probably gonna get kicked if you don't know how to set it up properly. A big overhand to double leg is always a good option (khabib style)

Really though, need to know the context here.

>>191527
And a ching chong nip nong to you too good sir

>>191689
Courtesy oranges are a thing at Chinese restaurants when you go with Chinese people and don't get the white guy treatment. I've never been given oranges at BJJ or judo class (coach used to give us snacks like that at wrestling tournaments but that's a bit different) so I was wondering if OP was Chinese.

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>>191479
Am I a full retard for basing my whole game around these 4?
Rnc and leglock have got me pretty far.

>>191692
well oranges are just the perfect choice
they smell nice, add a splash of color to the room, if you're autistic like most of us are the peel is very tactile and satisfying to run your fingers over
but practically they're conveniently individually wrapped, and they're a perfect snack to have before or after you exercise because they're so juicy and full of sugar and vitamins
I don't know what an electrolyte is but I bet oranges have them

much better choice than something like bananas which get stinky really fast
and even better than selling the gym members cans of jocko fuel for $5 each
the gym should be encouraging a healthful lifestyle, not pushing chemical elixirs on people

green tea and oranges, that's what you get. If you want to be healthy then look at what the people who live for 200 years are doing

>>191717
>much better choice than something like bananas which get stinky really fast
Bananas are popular because they're high in potassium to help hedge against cramps, even more conveniently packaged than oranges, and very cheap.

>>191719
the problems with bananas is their ripeness window is so small, you have like 1.5 days between being too green to eat and starting to attract flies
and the peels smell bad when they break down. The benefit of the citrus fruits is the peels dry out so they don't stink up the place while waiting for the garbage to go out, but everybody knows if there's a banana peel in there because it gets pungent real fast

>>191664
>>191669
Open mat with gi, the practitioners will always avoid short distance.

>>191601
You're going to need to learn striking defense. At the very least get one of your rolling buddies to put on some gloves or open-hand slap you as you shell up and close distance. You'll need to learn something of ring cutting/footwork to catch the slippery devil.

Kek hit him with an Imanari roll. Post footage.

>Captcha: TOSS
God wills it. You shall throw the karateka down.

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>>191727
>>191662
>>191601
Look up Rafael Aghayev. He made a whole career out of throwing bouncy sport karate guys.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bbte1tQma3E
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BO7jCpEm4BM

>use strikes and feints to force the other guy to throw back
>the other guy has to plant his feet when he's throwing
>duck under, grab something, and takedown

>>191748
>>191727

It is decided. Spam imanari rolls for 5 minutes until you catch him, then fuck up his knee. Or possibly get kicked in the face over and over again. Either way, film it and post it here.

Or go full BJJ retard: sit guard and butt scoot toward him saying "mount me, bro, mount me."

>>191721
there is tons of free bananas at 711 so I take all the brown ones for baking.

>>191601
If he keeps evading then shooting for singles and doubles won't work, you'll need to close the distance quickly and get into a clinch, from there you can sweep or throw

>>191721
>you have like 1.5 days between being too green to eat and starting to attract flies
What are you talking about? The minor browning is not rot, it's still completely edible, if less visually appealing

>>191479
Danaher instructionals are so good to sleep.

>>191703
How beneficial even are instructionals? I’ve heard it range from barely to I base my whole game around this

>>191894
Instructor not withstanding, it's incredibly reliant on your ability to self audit and learn. Some people get nothing out of it, some people play leap frog on their same time starts.

>>191894
It is just like >>191894 said,
I spent 1.5h a day studying one of the 4 but I don't think most do that.

>>191894
it's just information
information is only as useful as your application of it

if you're learning from it properly it should take you weeks to get through one of them as you watch a position lesson then with your partners practice it until you understand it well enough to move on. In this way it's not any different from going to a class
and that's as opposed to how most people probably use them where they watch it all the way through as quickly as they can and just assume through osmosis they'll be able to start pulling things off

or once you're experienced like me and have awakened your jiujitsu sharingan and can just mimic what you see because intuitively you already know how it works
the better you get the easier it is to learn new things
that's why you'll see the blue belts mimicking the teachers movements in the air while he's showing a move and asking to see it a few more times
and the black belts glance over one time at the beginning and 2 seconds into showing the move go oh ok then look off into space the rest of the time because they got it
then the fun trick is telling the partner with complete confidence what the next move is going to be and they think you have some kind of psychic abilities for calling it every time
but it's just intuition

>>191703
Great way to skyrocket to mediocre.

>>191894
Depends on your level and how autodidactic you are. If you are gonna get one, start with the gordon ryan escapes.

>>191839
Untapped market for Danaher ASMR of him quietly reading his notes on the history of grappling, from both Europe and Asia.

>>192051

When I can't sleep, sometimes I'll legitimately put on some old danaher instructional that I've seen a few times and just let his droning put me out.

>>192051
>12 hours of cute Danaher complimeting your bjj game ASMR
I would buy.

>>191894
When I started watching them and taking charge of my own learning/game is when I skyrocketed my skills.

I just find BJJ is not tought properly.

I use grapplers guide its like 50 bucks on sale it has basically a video encyclopedia on grappling with a one time fee

>>192309
>grapplers guide
submeta has passed it

>>192309
>I just find BJJ is not tought properly.
you would be right, people that do jiujitsu for a living are low IQ individuals
you already have to be low IQ to decide to make a living doing sports, and then it's a whole other level to do a sport that has no money in it
so they aren't sending their best

these are the people in charge of instruction, real dopes that have no understanding of learning modalities
"bro bjj is so complicated bro" no it isn't you've just been having an idiot explain it to you. You'd find a lot of things complicated if the person explaining it was 6 years old
"hey jonny, how do you drive a car?"
"you gotta turn the wheel and it goes vrooom!"
"woah, wow, I just cant seem to get this to work. Man, driving a car is so complicated!"

bjj is simple as fuck
don't let the other guy occupy the space between your armpits and hip. That's all there is to it. Don't let him put any part of his body in that space, meanwhile you occupy that space on him.
Congratulations you're now a red belt in BJJ

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>>192387
>don't let the other guy occupy the space between your armpits and hip. That's all there is to it. Don't let him put any part of his body in that space, meanwhile you occupy that space on him.
Now i know BJJ.

>>191958
Your better starting with Craig Jones and John Danaher. Craig gives you a simple beginning and then John takes its to another level.

Gordon shares a lot and acts like they are all equal.

>>192387
>real dopes that have no understanding of learning modalities
>don't let the other guy occupy the space between your armpits and hip. That's all there is to it.
You're just stating a guard retention concept. That might blow the mind of a white belt but it doesn't exactly result in skill development

>>192561
but skills come from doing, so give yourself a set of parameters to work within and just do that
this is the ecological approach, just like when you were learning to walk nobody had to explain it to you, the parameter was get to where you want to go as fast as you can
and you experimented by doing a lot of dumb inefficient things like crawling, rolling on your belly, and scooting on your butt
then one day you pulled yourself upright and realized hey these steps get me places, maybe I can do a few of them in a row. Wala, you're walking

bjj being the same, just set the parameters for the task
never let anyone occupy that space on you. And that's the only thing you'll think of until you're good at it
next, occupy that space on the other person while not letting him do it to you
next, make sure your butt is below your head while doing those other things
etc etc and within a year I promise you'll have a white belt at close to if not beyond black belt level compared to the traditional method of "ayee my fren today we will hworke on de treeanglee choake frome de guar" in a fraction of the time

>>192309
Huh, I feel dumb for not knowing about GG, thanks anon.

>>192331
Yeah but like 3 months of submeta pays for lifetime access to GG. I'm a basic bitch, let me digest the old boring shit in GG then I'll start hunting for cutting-edge shit.

>>192584
Oh god it's you

>>192588
>Yeah but like 3 months of submeta pays for lifetime access to GG

fair, I only paid once and downloaded the whole site it I think it worth it
I would just say it's better because of it's Chapters

I did the same for bjjcoreconcept worth it aswell

>>192588
Well I'm right and it's observable
Bjj ranks are awarded completely subjectively unlike everything else
A karate style has objective standards of things you need to know to get a belt
Judo for example, you play Judo with a black belt there's an objective minimum standard you can expect to experience
Bjj you might have a blue belt that's a killer and the hardest roll you've had in weeks, and a black belt that's a total potato
And white belts that can employ Danahers entire ashi series, along with coral belts that don't know anything thing involving a knee reap because they've never taken off the gi in their lives

The only standard for getting a belt in bjj is the person you're learning from likes you enough to give you one
It's a gift not an achievement

The absence of an objective standard requiring competency in specific techniques, the only thing that matters is principle application

>>191479
i haven't trained for a month and it makes me think of how much I miss grabbing the feet of cute asian girls

>>193133
lucky my class is a bunch of fat guys, tattooed druggies, and old men on roids

Gonna start bjj soon, anything I can do to be more proactive about protecting myself from foot fungus and shit like that?

>>193169
if it's an issue that comes up it's the gyms fault, that's the first thing
aside from that make sure you at least wash your hands and face before leaving to go home and get in the shower quickly
I don't use the shower at the gym, but if you're extra nervous just get some anti-bacterial hand wipes and give yourself a rub down to hold you over until showering

and no don't by the jiujitsu branded ones that are $15 a container when you can just get the regular wet ones brand for $3.50 for the same amount

i fucking love body triangles from the back

>>193169
Shower ASAP after training. Wear long sleeve rashguards and spats if you want to minimize exposure.
>>193177
I've been using this arm switch a lot lately:
https://youtu.be/yS-OAywQ3GQ?si=-Lcfvuml0HMlpoYe&t=573

>>193220
>Wear long sleeve rashguards and spats
I hate the feeling of the long sleeves and spats but I haven't caught anything yet.

two things I want to say
#1 its bullshit that my gym has changed to doing biannual promotions instead of going person by person like it used to
all this is doing is putting a time gate instead of a skill gate which makes it worthless. I literally know the day I'll get a black belt because it's scheduled and thats gay

2nd thing
I need ecological games like kit dales instructionals if anyone can find them, I want to take a look at what a complete curriculum is like
ps. ecological games are literally just positional training no matter how much that smolders faggot or whatever his name is seethes about it

>>193420

>ecological system

Reeeeeeee

Really though, you don't need an instructional for this. Just figure out some games with different goals/restrictions. We do this all the time at open mats

>>192651
>Bjj ranks are awarded completely subjectively unlike everything else
nothing subjective about competition especially with a submission
>And white belts that can employ Danahers entire ashi series
these people are regarded as retards by anyone who knows what they're doing
>The absence of an objective standard requiring competency in specific techniques, the only thing that matters is principle application
which means you develop actual skills instead of checking off some karate nerds list

>>193437
nta
I think having a "checklist", as you describe it, would be quite beneficial to beginners as it would tell them exactly what to focus on.
It would also establish an actual curriculum, rather than the "random submission of the day" approach used by many schools which while not horrible is also not ideal.
Judo does it that way I think; to progress you need to both show proficiency in a specific set of techniques and show your competence in sparring

>>193472
to add,
>It would also establish an actual curriculum
this part would also be useful if you ever trained at different schools, because it would give them an idea of your abilities and knowledge beyond just "he can *probably* beat _-belts"

>>193430
Right but I just want to copy the ones someone else already figured out

>>193437
>these people are regarded as retards by anyone who knows what they're doing
It's left behind boomer cope
Those that can't do, will talk shit
"Fuckin punk heel hooked me, heh I bet he wouldn't have been able to do shit if I passed his guard tho"
Did you pass his guard?
"No because that fuckin punk heel hooked me, plus I didn't know we were doing leglocks, if I had known it would've been different"
Ok so now you know, go do it again
"Nah I don't roll with fuckin punks doing unsafe moves like that...fuckin punks"

>>193420
>its bullshit that my gym has changed to doing biannual promotions
Yes, yes it is, you should leave immediately and tell the owner exactly why.

>ecological games are literally just positional training
Agreed. People acting like they've reinvented the wheel, just friggin drill, spar, and positional spar.

>>193595
it's sunk cost, I don't really want to go somewhere else

well that's not really true, I want to move away from here. But until that happens I'm not going to go to a different club

>>191479
Every time I see this thread my cock gets hard and I feel like fapping to Asian feet. Fuck you faggot

>>193674
based

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>>191479

>>191479
How'd y'all do at the Nashville open?

>>194025
what's the jiujitsu scene in tennessee
I need to find a place to move to and open a premier gym since I'm coming from a jiujitsu hotspot I'll be showing stuff 5 years ahead of whatever the community is doing

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>>191479
>Thread question: What kind of amenities should a gym have?
Holes in the walls with this type of stuff sticking out of them.

>>193430
Start in cat dog
Start in dog fight
Start with your backs touching sitting down
Common normal positions

>>191479
Amenities, what are those?
I want training partners and an instructor
I trained at a shit hole (think original Daisy Fresh) that felt like an abandoned building. Only stopped because day class died.

>>194061
probably would've been able to support the day class if the gym wasn't a shithole

>>194082
That's a good point. Lmao
Take it up with the owner he doesn't care

It would be nice to offer things such as coffee and tea to members
Even if even if you have a little pay what you want donation box for people to drop a dollar into here and there to keep the supply stocked

Unfortunately it's not sustainable, people will take advantage
We tried to have water bottles fully stocked and free to take, and even said we appreciate if occasionally people want to bring in a case of water we'll throw it into the fridge
But we had to stop doing that because even though some people would bring in water, it was always the same few people that would dquit and everyone else would just take
Had to tell them stop bringing in water bottles for other people we aren't putting anything in the fridge anymore, they can bring their own waters

I guess you get what you deserve
Once you get to the point you're spending $100 every month to keep beverages in stock you gotta say this business expense isn't doing anything for me

>>193498
its unsafe because white belts dont know how to do it properly especially if they cant even master upper body subs
>>193472
>>193474
you realize what you need to learn and improve by training consistently. any instructor worth his salt can judge skill level by watching you roll(as they're also rolling)

>>191479
CHINKY FEET SEX SEX SEX COOOOOM

>>194637
>you realize what you need to learn and improve by training consistently. any instructor worth his salt can judge skill level by watching you roll(as they're also rolling)
I agree, I'm not saying that this approach is wrong.
I guess I just prefer having structure and something closer to objective standards.

I spent the last 2 months watching Craig Jones submission and position escape, I like learning on my own

What should look at next?

>>195117
If you like Craig, look at power ride. It'll totally change the way you look at grappling.

Power bottom is good as well.

>>195182
sounds good thanks, would you say his Systematic submission dilemmas would be good for a beginners?
I haven't really looked at submission before

>>195240
Honestly, no. It's all about failed triangles into leg entanglements and I'd highly recommend getting pretty decent at leg entries first. Down under leg locks is a great intro to the leg game.

I really wouldn't suggest power ride either if you're pretty new. It's not gonna be as useful if you don't have a solid positional game first. Look into some open guard or passing instructionals if you're pretty new. I was passing blue and purple belts pretty consistently as a white belt after watching some passing instructionals, especially wiltse's.

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We have a situation here
I, a not black belt, am accidentally becoming a cult leader

People are really disaffected by the boomer tier instruction happening with all the shrimping and running laps and jumping jacks
Then here's 3 moves, ok now roll.
I just pay for the use of the mat space and training partners basically and I'm 100% teaching myself otherwise, the teacher has little of value to show me.
And well others have noticed I do my own thing and they're picking up what I'm putting down, and now they come to me to ask questions instead of the teacher
And I'm happy to help because the better they get the better I get but it's like there's a growing secret society and it's becoming noticeable. I'm getting texts and phone calls all day from people to talk about this stuff.
all of them individually have confided in how they feel their time is being wasted with all those dumb exercises the beginning of class, and how they are paying for instruction not to run laps, if they wanted to do that they would just go do it for free
The way I example principles is so much more valuable to them than the random moves they're taught every day.

I'm worried I'll get kicked out for treason soon though if I keep undermining the program and it becomes too obvious.
Folks are getting less good about even hiding it and just ask me questions with a black belt sitting right there

>>195292
Fuck that gym, bro. Join a different one.
No one should pay if there's little or no instruction.

>>195292
>I'm worried I'll get kicked out for treason soon though if I keep undermining the program and it becomes too obvious.
Why would they boot you? You're paying them to be their assistant.

>>195295
It's not that there's little instruction, it's the typical amount of instruction you'll find at bjj where like 1/3 is actually showing stuff and the rest is dumb exercises and free time
And a lot of the stuff you can tell is straight from a Danaher dvd because it's presented in the same order and if you've seen the DVD you know exactly what the next thing is going to be

>>195292
>this fucking guy again

>>195322
You know how peoples egos can get tied up in being the arbiter of secret knowledge (That's readily available on the internet) and he's gotten mad at people for getting together at someone's house to workout on home mats without getting his approval first
It's that kind of situation

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I hear you guys are easy going and don't take yourselves too seriously over here

>>195332
>there are no "don't let them stand up" instructionals on fanatics

Oh nononono

>>195325
>he's gotten mad at people for getting together at someone's house to workout on home mats without getting his approval first
What his voiced concern related to insurance or the use of the name of his business?

>>195340
He was concerned the guy hosting was trying to secretly poach students

>>195332
Based

I had a weird experience training today. For context I've been training 5 years and not spazzy, never had complaints.

I rolled with the blue belt girl. She was going pretty hard but I still dialed down my strength. Passed her guard easily and basically just positionally dominated her, even after allowing her to escape and sweep me once.

The more the roll went on she spazzed even harder and was almost screaming. Round ended and she just turned her back, I said thanks for the roll and she just shook her head at me. I asked what was wrong and she snapped "I don't want to talk".

Did I do something wrong or is she just salty that she couldn't beat me?

>>195441
Some people just have lousy days. It probably has nothing to do with you. I saw a purple belt rage quit at an in house tournament once. And I had a black belt get pissy with me because he didn't like how hard I was gripping his collar to defend an ankle lock, so he transitioned to a heel hook and then heel hooked me again immediately after I tapped. Doesn't mean he's a bad person, just means he had a bad night. He's been cool with me every other time.

And hey, even if it is a pattern and she's just constantly pissy, you can only take what she gives you. If she wants to get overwrought during rolls then that's what she needs to work on. You just need to be steady and consistent, IMHO.

>>195441
Might be frustration. Getting crushed because the other person is just that much bigger and stronger than you feels like shit
I would know, I'm typically the smallest person in the class, for me every roll is a fight for survival

>>195289
Shout out Wiltse's instructionals. Wrestle Up was the best butterfly and X-guard instructional that my blue belt Marcelo wannabe ass could've asked for.

>>195441
Nothing you wrote indicates you did anything wrong. I would try to give her space to get over whatever's going on in her woman brain so you don't become the target of any nonsense.
>is she just salty that she couldn't beat me?
Could be that, could be she's got issues she's trying to work through regarding physical contact with men.

>>195441
Just proves the only reason we even allow women on the mat is to show off their fussy
They aren't real competitors

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just thinking about the time when I'm stuffing a shot by pushing down on the back of the head, and for context I'm just a stuff master like unless your wrestling level is legitimately good, not just bjj good but wrestling good, don't even try it because you aint getting my legs

anyway so I stuff a shot and then a crusty middle aged TRT juice junky black belt with coffee breath tells me my completely successful stuff was wrong "you gotta do it like this" and he proceeds to show a C grip on the back of the neck to push the head down
objectively he's wrong, but gotta be respectful and not argue "ok thank you"

then I stuff another shot later on and he's in the peanut gallery HEY YOU'RE NOT DOING WHAT I TOLD YOU!
ok..
so then for the rest of class I had to do it the wrong shitty way he insisted upon and wouldn't you know it, I wasn't stopping the singles anymore

abolish belts

This is what happens when Judo faces against pure BJJ but scooting faggotry
Pottery
I think she even ended it with a kimura I think
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=E5Gz6GutqIg

>>195519
It's hard to find matches online now because there's a whole bjj youtuber sphere with uppity blue belts thinking they're worth something BJJ VS JUDO EXPERT ROLLING COMMENTARY

>>191479
How do I stop breaking ribs?
I broke my second rib in 2 months this week. Both times I just moved weird when someone was trying to pass my guard.
Do I need stronger abs?

>>195588
Do you roll with bigger people?
Like 20+lbs difference?

>>195588
That happened to me in my first month of rolling. Well, I didn't break a rib but I had a pretty nasty intercostal strain. It happened when I exhaled the wrong way at the wrong time on bottom. Since then I've learned to breathe better and protect myself better.

Keep a little bit of pressure in your thorax when you're in vulnerable positions on bottom. Learn to recognize when you're bearing the brunt of his weight, and don't take full breaths, just sip some air. Learn to breathe and brace, and power breathe.

And yeah, get stronger abs and get stronger generally. Doing the big compound lifts will actually help you learn to breathe and brace while moving.

Also, don't know about your gym, but at my gym no one would look down on you for declining a roll with a much bigger guy, or asking to start on top if we're doing positional rounds. Be smart, train constructively not destructively.

>>195588
3 things that could help you
1st abs, work up to doing toes to bars
2nd get good at position escape
3rd would be gain some weight nothing crazy but 15lb, bones need food

Craig Jones is bullshit
https://twitter.com/JosieAldoMMA/status/1784415245748076564

>>195519
>random fat girls no one has ever heard of
How about olympic gold medalist vs. BJJ guy?
https://youtu.be/mQLXl0myP0E?si=8LlLOhE53lRNsMPv

>>195946
>pulls guard
Cringe

>>195981
>guy is sitting on his butt in front of you and you still manage to give up your back
Cringe

>>195982
>referee standing there to ensure you climb into his guard willingly or you lose the game

I watched a bunch of different grappling instructionals, it's like the same 4 techniques for arm, leg, feet and chokes and a group of more specific ones

>>196389
Beginner:
>Everything is the same
Intermediate:
>Actually everything is incredibly specific and there's a thousand variations of every position and lock
Advanced:
>Everything is the same

>be powerlifter
>walk into BJJ gym, never done anything like this before
>getting shown some moves
>partner up with blue belt to practice
>he has 50lbs and 4 inches on me
>"Okay try it on me for real. I want to see what it's supposed to be"
>he can't submit me because he's too weak
>laughs it off

Bjj bros? Did you get too cocky?

>>196507
Yes
Lemme guess he sat right down on his butt or laid on his back?
Most of these guys doing bjj can't have any success if the other guy rejects the gentleman's agreement
Jiujitsu is really fucking hard when the other guy refuses to play along.
Day after day they keep getting told don't use strength, don't move so fast, don't do this, don't do that. And they get these false positives after being conditioned on how to behave and they see they are getting pretty good when everyone else is behaving the same way

Then you just throw an Athletic guy out there on the floor and they don't know what to do because nobody else is playing that way

https://youtube.com/shorts/7tPzcY4dx-c?si=wH8EJxcLWOrjaWyG

>>196507
I don't want gymbros invading the world of martial arts.

>>196507
Nah. It's just that strength matters and anyone who says the opposite is coping.
Good technique can compensate for lack of strength and strength can compensate for lack of of good technique, but in both cases it's only to an extent. If you want to be any good, you need both.
BJJ athletes tend to be on average less fit than in other combat sports, because it's the most 'hobbyish' and casual right now.

>>196514
It's like I always tell the copers, your strength is a sword and your technique is the edge on the blade, but a big dull sword can still be used to smash things

>>196511
>Day after day they keep getting told don't use strength, don't move so fast, don't do this, don't do that
Find a better gym then. The only "gentleman's agreement" I'm aware of is "don't actually try to injure your partner"

>>196516
Noo you can't just muscle out of things! Noo you can't just stand back up if you dont like the position! Noo you can't just back away from my butt scooting, you need to pass! Noo you can't just stiff arm me away and push me over!

Many such cases

>>196517
What happened in UFC 1?

>>196518
Ah well 30 years ago a guy beat some random nobodies his brother picked out for him to fight and also chose the rules

That appeal always makes me yikes a little bit the same way the karate guys will say yeah but 60 years ago karate won 2/3 matches against muay thai (under modified rules) so that proves its legit!

>>196517
I implore you to re-read my post
>Find a better gym then

>>196521
I prefer you implore people to find a better sport

>>196517
>Noo you can't just back away from my butt scooting, you need to pass!
Everything else you said was fine, but yeah if you're just going to refuse to engage in training you should fuck off and find something else to do. That's like running around a boxing ring instead of actually sparring.
Guard pulling in competition is one issue, but in training who cares? What are you going to do when you happen to land a takedown and have no clue how to pass/submit?
Fucking retards

>>196507
What was the technique?
Sounds like some combination of you being stronger and him being shitty at the technique.
Everyone who trains would absolutely agree that speed, athleticism, and size make a HUGE difference.

>>196532
the player that sits is the one taking the defensive posture, what he's doing is akin to just shelling up and refusing to throw a punch until I attack first so he can counter punch me

the player standing is the one driving the action, so the sitting player is obligated to stand up with him. If he wishes to pull a guard or something he needs to make a connection and pull the guy into it, He doesn't get to just sit on the floor. and if he's scooting at you then you are under no obligation to let him touch you and grab your legs any more than you are obligated to let him grab any other grip he may want during normal play. If he can't bring you down he doesn't deserve to have the position he wants.

>>196520
Okay I can't stand for you talking ill of Ken Shamrock that man is a true grappler and lost do to brazilian tricks.
They let him use his wrestling shoes all the way to the semi finals talking them away before the final match, and then choking him with his brazil belt.

>>196532
if they aren't hold me in guard I will back away and go at them from a better angle and boxing is all about finding the best angle of attack

>>196537
>defensive posture
This retard again oy vey
>make a connection to pull guard
Ok then what? You just refuse to pass? Maybe you should just wrestle. I don’t understand you dumb faggots. All about muh standup and rules of engagement but make 0 attempts to strangle or break limbs
>>196539
>go at them from a better angle
Nothing wrong with that. My beef is with people who just completely refuse to engage with a bottom player. Even more cowardly than avoiding a wrestling exchange
>exchange collar ties for 5 minutes
>get takedown
>on top
Or
>guy pulls guard
>on top
Somehow people complain about this lol

>>196540
if I refuse to pass then you should just attack me from your guard
surely you're able to attack from that position, surely you don't require me to drive the action forward for you to be able to do anything, surely

>>196540
>people who just completely refuse to engage with a bottom player
Ah fair

>>196542
>if I refuse to pass
?
No one is forcing you to grapple buddy. If I have top position I am trying as hard as I can to pass and submit because that’s the entire point.

>>196546
see this is the problem with bottom bois, they just lay there and expect the top to do all the work
"the guard" is a bullshit arbitrary position, if we were wrestling you've lost the match for going there
you're pinned, you're the one that needs to do something about it

>>196547
This is why jiu Jitsu without strikes is a meme lmao

>>196548
it's weird too because even within the rules of sport jiujitsu the guard is frowned upon. All possible scoring positions are done from the top, the only way to score from the bottom is to sweep the guy so you're not the one on the bottom anymore.
in the event of a tie the decision is supposed to go to the guy on top, that's how I beat gordon back when we were purple belts, he pulled guard and the match ended 0-0, I never passed, he never swept, but I got the win because I was in dominant position

>>196533
I don't know the terms. It was a thing where I start on my back and he is on me from the side pinning me down, then he's supposed to grab my arm and pin the wrist down while rotating the elbow upwards to crank my shoulder. But he was unable to pin my arm.
Fwiw, I was unable to get unpinned though

Butt scooting is a fundamental problem with the sport; it's not just a personal hangup.
It's intentionally taking a position that is by all accounts disadvantageous, and moreover looks and feels instinctively idiotic, BUT due to the rules, it's not actually disadvantageous. It also simply skips a large chunk of the game. In reality you'd just get kicked in the head. The sport already awards points based on advantageous striking positions and is thus ostensibly rooted in the realm of real fighting. It needs to also disincentivize the butt scoot for that reason.

>>196554
ude garami for us scholarly types
americana if your teachers skin is darker than a paper lunch bag

>>196547
>if we were wrestling you've lost the match for going there
Different sport, and you don't lose the match for being on bottom. Retard
>>196548
>this is why soccer without picking up the ball is a meme
>>196550
>in the event of a tie the decision is supposed to go to the guy on top
Then why are are you crying about guard pulling? You're being handed top position. I love guard pullers because I actually know how to pass and submit
>>196556
>In reality you'd just get kicked in the head
You could apply this retarded logic to pretty much any combat sport. You morons only apply it to BJJ to be contrarian 4channers.
Wrestlers give up their backs, which is deadly. Boxers don't acknowledge grappling or leg kicks. Judokas don't allow leg tackles. Just fucking train MMA if you are going to nitpick like a woman

I genuinely don't understand the guard pulling whining. I fucking WISH my training partners would concede position
>inb4 muh sport
>inb4 muh spectators
I don't train for spectators, I don't give a fuck about BJJ being in the olympics. Pin and submit.

You idiots act like getting a takedown guarantees a great position. Sometimes you exchange collar ties for 5 minutes, get a takedown, and expose a limb. How is that better than forcing (and passing) half guard on a guard puller?

>>196562
It's not internally consistent. You're awarded points by gaining advantageous striking positions. When someone sits down on the ground in front of you, that should immediately give you a point because you could kick them in the head.

>>196562
If you are on your back you're losing
End of discussion. You're the one that needs to move
Being on your back is losing in the eyes of sport and in the reality of fighting

>>196554
Americana
It's the quintessential "big guy" submission, because you generally need to be stronger than the other guy to hit it

>>196567
Yeah, and if your opponent is sitting on your back, you're also as good as dead, yet wrestling fags conveniently overlook this reality
There are exactly zero "realistic" martial arts, every single one of them concedes some realism to the rules. MMA is as close as it gets, if that's what you fancy

>>196564
If you want to strike him, you need to get past his legs.
https://youtu.be/jf-mew1wnuA?feature=shared

Just pass, bro. He's put himself at a disadvantage by sitting on the ground. Just pass, pin, submit.

>>196588
Blowjobbers treat showing the back like some kind of foregone conclusion, and it's not. There's a big difference between showing your back to someone and giving your back up. The most effective way to escape is to turn away, and as long as you don't let him under your far side armpit while you do that you're not in danger

>>196591
The current meta in MMA is to just beat him up from inside the guard because people realized that's a better pin than side control. He's stuck down there under you so passing will just give him more ability to get away. Craig's power ride series is based explicitly on this fact, there's no need to pass the legs to attack and the only reason we do it is because bjj scores it as a way to get points. It's a bad habit

>>191479
For learning submissions what order do you think people should learn them?

I believe it should go
1 Back Attacks
2 Front Headlock
3 Kimura
4 Armbars
5 Triangles
6 Leglocks

Want to know the gayest thing to ever gay? We're having a "belt promotion ceremony" that will cost $100 to attend

Collectively everybody said fuck that

BJJ midwits be like

>you gotta learn to learn with pedagogy bro. you'll never go to adcc just by copying whatever your instructor does
>omg I'm learning so much from this $500 craig ryan dvd by copying everything he does

>>196765
That says more about the low quality of instruction out there in most places where a 4 hour video tape gives more value than their in person teacher does over years

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>paying for instructionals

>>196632
I agree that defending against attacks from the back as well as from full mount.

I'm glad you put leglocks at the end. That is indeed the last submission you should learn. You need to know how to defend from armlocks, chokes, and neck cranks before those.

Thoughts on doing wrestling and nogi at the same time?

Tried gi bjj once and didn't really enjoy it. Lying there and fighting off the back in full guard felt like cope. Heard nogi is more like wrestling and more practical

I just want to learn to defend myself and idk if wrestling is enough or better than doing nogi as well

>>196799
Perfectly fine if you're young, don't have a physical job, recover well, and can afford to eat enough to sustain the work.

>>196800
I'm only planning to go twice maybe three times a week. I'm 30 so not young but I'm not completely out of shape and got through a wrestling class with the regulars that attend it. Was sore for a few days afterwards but that's to be expected I guess.

Also tried bjj and judo sessions. Didn't enjoy judo or bjj so will stick with wrestling and try nogi as well then

>>196795
Counter point, leglocks are the path of least resistance and workable against much larger people with way less investment in their practice and less auxilery skills to set them up, therefore should be high priority in learning them so you immediately have a reliable tool at your disposal you can retreat back to
As having confidence breeds improvement

>>196834
Fair, but in the I think a person can learn all these (Back Attacks, Front Headlock, Kimura, Armbars, Triangles, Leglocks) moves before blue belt
>I was a white belt for 1.5 year

>>196764
Get the fuck out of that gym now.

>>191479
My neck makes a cruch noise anytime I get RNC or Guillotine, is there any guide to help?

>>197048
It's not worth it man, save your neck and not only that save yourself from a life of agony

>>197082
my neck was fucked up already from when I was kicked in head(rugby)
I just need rehab advice

>>196834
Yeah but leglocks, neck locks, spine locks, and wrist locks are also the most dangerous to practice by a newb. It's safer and easier to learn armlocks and chokes before you move onto that stuff.

>>197085
Professionals regularly fuck up neck advise for patients they see in person. No one in this bisexual clothed frottage thread is going to be able to see through their wifi signal to tell you what's wrong.

>>197085
all I can tell you is do exercises to give yourself strong traps such as shrugs and the cuban press, and stop doing jiujitsu

I'm at the point in my life where I'm realizing there's no amount of jiujitsu that fits into it. I'm down from 5 days a week to 2. my necks gets extremely aggravated from even mild contact and I just don't have the ability to recover anymore

It's degrading before my eyes

>>197104
Why don't you do neck strengthening exercises

>>197125
NTA, sometimes when the damage is done it's done and there's not much you can do about it after the fact, other than try to ease the pain and prevent it from getting worse
Most injuries can be rehabilitated, but sometimes you're just SOL. Most often when it involves the spine

Why do women have such soft, easily wrist lockable wrists?

>>197270
They're made for rape.

Is it easier to become the best judoist or jiu jitsuistuist

>>197279
probably easier to become a top level jiujitero considering how every ten or so years there's some random literally who autistic purple belt that decides to get on roids and dedicate their entire life on spamming 1 or 2 techniques until they're a champion

I have been doing gracie combatives and go further faster. I'm an assasin. I'm a killer.

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Who else /out here/

>>197270
I didn't expect to see Mike Glover on /xs/.

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>>191703
my favorite title of Craig's is False Reap Allegations
Just title not talking about content but he is quite good.
I think the removed or re-titled that one.

Is BJJ the only option if you want a martial art that can apply to MMA and be able to spar without becoming braindead at 30?

>>197968
No.

How do I loosen up my hip flexor as quick as I can?

>>197970
What other options are there? Sambo and wrestling?

How are you rolling with people significantly smaller/weaker than you?
On the one hand I don't want to just smash them using all my strength and weight, but, I find that if I try to go at thier strength level I just get beaten. Sometime I let them do things which reasonably I couldn't defend against a person of my size and weight, and I lose, I feel this is wrong now. Anyone got any tips?

>>197968
You need striking too imo most hobbyist boxing gyms spar moderate shots to the head

Muay Thai gyms spar moderate to the body , light to head

>>197968
For grappling you have wrestling of all types, judo, sambo, BJJ, submission grappling if you want to count that as its own thing
With striking it's harder. There is kyokushin, which goes hard on the body but doesn't use head strikes (as far as I know at least). With MT, boxing and kickboxing you have to explicitly communicate with your training partner and hope they're not retarded

>>197986
When I know I could just out-strength someone to victory, not that it happens often, I usually actively try to use less strength because if I just overpower them, neither of us will learn much

>>196517
Bro, you need to find a different gym asap. All of the things you listed are used in my gym by everyone all the time.

>>197986
On one hand, don't be a dick. On the other hand, rolling with an advantage gives you the opportunity to practice stuff successfully, instead of just getting shut down all the time. My coach told me to start coming to evening classes because there are more middle/high school kids to practice takedowns on. Work to reliably take down skinny fourteen year olds, then move up to taking down full grown men, then attempt your takedown against the pro team guys, lol.

>>197980
1 treat flexibility as a training modality the same way you would with lifting
If you break a sweat stretching that's not a bad thing
Two critical techniques are proprioceptive neuromuscular facilitation ot PNF for short
And nerve flossing

Your body will not physically allow you to move past a certain range, it will lock up before you actually get to the full range
PNF puts a small amount of load at the end ranges, your body feels that it's safe to proceed, and it allows the muscles to relax further

Nerves don't really stretch and adapt the way muscles do, what you have is what you have and they are a commonly limiting factor
When you stretch and feel tingles at the ends of your feet or something, it's because your nerves are being strained
Nerve flossing techniques allows your nerves to move freely through the joint so they don't need to stretch, they just go with the flow

Research shows that you need 10 minutes per week of stretching to make gains, not counting the warm up. it can be all at once, 2 minutes over 5 days, doesn't matter how you break it up
Because of that time requirement it is recommended you do no more than 4 skills in your program at a time because it can get overwhelming

>>198031
Any literature or other resource recommendations?

>>198031
Thanks, this is really helpful

>>197980
In addition to what anon said, a lack of flexibility in one area may have very little to do with the area itself. Especially in the hip girdle. A weakness or lack of flexion ability in the foot can easily create a transferance to the groin, adductors etc. If you find that the methods he outlined are either incredibly grinding or producing no results, you may need to branch further away from that area. Possibly even up the body.

>>198055
I think it just my hip flexor since I am able to hold a deep squat and duck walk without breaking a sweat,
but as a recovering neet I can say I did not take the best care of my whole body

>>198090
Yeah I was just giving you a heads up what to look for. If you were the typical shut in, you just sat too much. So it's very likely you're right, and if not it's probably gonna be your lower/mid back.

>>198094
Well thank you for the information

Friendly warning to any with sore hip flexor
DONT PUT ICYHOT ON IT

>>198170
Somebody got the ooooollll spicy sack

>>198171
yeah...
I did

>>198172
Avoid the temptation to wash it out. Water activates the compound.

>>198175
I found that out, in the shower

>>198176
Fucking kek. Congratulations, you've played the world's oldest wrestling prank on yourself.

>>198171
One time I bought a bottle of ghost pepper hotsauce and was shaking it up before opening
And for whatever reason I was naked, fuck you I'm home alone so sue me, and the cap flew off and the sauce splashed all over my cock and balls
So I was sitting there naked at the edge of the couch with my whole package submerged in a glass of milk wondering where it all went so wrong

>>191479
if I just copy my gyms rolling time (five round of five minutes without a one minute break) will that work?
I am planning on doing it daily switch between burpees, kettlebell swings and jump rope.

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So after a few sessions and injuries, im unsure about how relavent wrestling is for self defence. A lot of the techniques like dropping to the knees, turnovers etc I think are very sport specific

From a self defence perspective, is no gi bjj a better option to train? Does it fit better in terms of actual combat with strikes? Is it better for someone older?

I want to learn high percentage stuff that I can use in real life to subdue someone, and it seems that's only a small part of wrestling. Maybe I just need to grind it out for a year but idk

>>198418
Greco-Roman specifically might be more directly applicable to self defense, since it involves more upper-body technique and less level-changing. Look into Shivworks and Craig Douglas, a lot of their curriculum is derived from Greco-Roman. Of course, that's a merely academic point, since it's nigh impossible to find a place to learn Greco-Roman as an adult amateur hobbyist.

Imho, the praise wrestling gets for self defense isn't really about technique as much as it's about spending your developmental years getting pushed to the limits of your ability by a hardass wrestling coach. Tl;Dr, get your kids into wrestling.

For an adult amateur, jiujitsu might be a better bet. Long term sustainability is key, you need to train long term to develop real, practical skill. A lot of jiujitsu stuff is sport specific and "not practical" as well, but you can't become a competent grappler with just a little bit of grappling. Go all in and learn the whole game. If you can win against your skilled training partners, out grappling some untrained retard won't be a problem.

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>>198429
Yeah my club offers a mix of Greco and freestyle but it's mostly experienced young guys who have been doing it since childhood. I can almost sense a catastrophic injury on the horizon for myself (a beginner)

I can totally see the conditioning aspect as I can barely get through the 30 minute warmup and then I still have an hour of the actual class left. Spending your developmental years doing all this cardio and flexibility training would make you a great athlete for sure. How much of its technique is applicable with strikes? Not a lot i imagine

I was mostly worried about not being able to practice takedowns in no gi but I'll see what the class is like once my injuries have healed. I think I need to be honest with myself and admit I'm not a youngster willing to learn how to get suplexed on my head whilst juggling a full time job, family etc.. hopefully the no gi stuff is a bit more adult beginner friendly . I just want to learn how to defend myself if someone grabs me. Maybe I just need to sumomaxx and become 140kg of fat and muscle

>>198433
Nah, don't become a fatass. Mobility is survivability. Do get stronger, just don't bulk too hard.
Winning the hand fight is prerequisite to everything else in grappling. That's what enables you to prevent getting grabbed, or to break his grips off of you. It's what enables you to control him and control his hands, and get to a better position to either gtfo or access a weapon.
In nogi you might not drill explosive takedowns endlessly, but you'll certainly get a lot of practice winning grip battles. You'll also probably spend a lot of time escaping bad/bottom positions, which might save your life in a bad situation.
You can work on stand up too. Even if your partner is grounded you'll need to stand to pass. It's easier to work on staying on your feet defensively than trying to become an explosive takedown master.

Do the best you can with what you have. This is the essence of martial arts, imho, and it's why it's a lifelong journey, not a shirt term youth sport.

>>198449
>but you'll certainly get a lot of practice winning grip battles

I thought grip battles only applied to getting/defending a takedown?

>>198449
Thank you for the informative reply, I will give no gi a try then. Hopefully it's more my pace and has more of what I want to learn

>>198454
Nah, think about it. To pass guard, you need grips. To wrestle up, you need grips (underhook). To isolate an arm, you need to control it. To attack the neck, you've first got to strip away the arms defending it. Etc.

In a "self defense context", some asshole is trying to put his hands on you, deflect his grips, tie up a wrist tie, and arm drag the shit out of him. Get to the outside, and now you can gtfo or keep fighting from a much stronger position. Just a for instance. You want to draw a weapon, or prevent him from drawing a weapon? Better win the hand fight.

Maybe it's better to say, "everything starts with grips/hooks AND posts/frames", but my point is just that that initial point of contact determines a lot of what plays out. And my point further is, even in a sporting context, one thing grapplers of all stripes do a hell of a lot of is hand fighting, which might just be applicable in a lot of ways to things outside of sport (speaking to anon's initial reference to wanting to learn grappling for self defense and to avoid getting grabbed).

Got a sore red lump on the side of my calf
Weird place for a pimple, wish me luck lads

>>191479
white belt here I do one class and I am too sore to do another class that week, any tips?

>>198563
Fix your nutrition and sleep habits, make a point to stretch out and not be sedentary on off days, and then suck it up and go to class.

Do wrestling shoes prevent injury? Or does getting your feet stepped on hurt as much as without boots?

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What should be the watch order for these 4?

>The Fastest Way: To Increase Your Submission Percentage (No Gi),
>The Fastest Way: To Become an Effective Guard Passer (No Gi),
>The Fastest Way: To Develop An Unpassable Guard,
>The Fastest Way: To Becoming Effective In Standing Position

I'm completely new
I was thinking I should watch The Fastest Way: To Increase Your Submission Percentage so I have a end game goal first then I can build off of a understanding of what I am aiming for.

But Idk after that.

>>198728
You should instead first watch pritt and Chris Paines shit which will elevate your defensive principles to better than most purple belts basically over night, and then you can worry about attacks

Remember: attacks are always more effective if you're confident in your defense should they go wrong because you can take greater risks

>>198739
Fuck Pritt. Who's he trained? What accomplishments does he have? You'll just learn to roll around and turtle to get out of everything.

Just watch Go Further Faster series by Danaher for Gi, and New Wave Jiu Jitsu for No-Gi.

>>198745
Danaher inherited a generational athlete, Gordon is successful because he's a 6'2" mesomorph with aspergers and Eddie Cummings taught him all the leglocks he rose to fame with. That's why when he left the leglocks stopped evolving
John was just the guy lucky enough to be in the room
The guy has had literally thousands of students under him across decades in the main city of the world, it was just a Numbers game that eventually he'd get a really good one

>>198747
>mesomorph
made bs, stopped reading

>>198755
Body types are a thing, get over it

>>198747
Danaher's trained and mentored the best BJJ athletes in the world. Everyone who studies under him marvels in his genius, and it's only Team Butt-hurt who have anything slightly bad to say about him.

Prit hasn't trained anyone of note, he's done nothing of note, people don't speak highly of him as a BJJ practitioner, unlike Danaher who was a STUD in Renzo's old gym when he could still roll. I've seen people get hooked on his videos and resort to those stupid Hawking, Running-Man BS postures. There's a reason the best in the world don't do stuff like that, because it only works against people who suck.

Gordon may be a dickhead aspie, but even he mentions he was honestly nothing special at the beginning of his BJJ training. Same with Eddie Cummings, who Firas Zahabi mentioned kind of sucked for a long time, then Danaher made him into the athlete he is.

>>198833
>Firas Zahabi
Let's not bring that idiot into this conversation, his only claim to fame is being friends with gsp. He can't make a video without name dropping George or John. You want to talk about worthless coaches? It's no coincidence he's the biggest one in Canada and that country basically doesn't produce anybody of note

Anyway back to the topic at hand, points are some arbitrary bullshit. Do you want to score fake made up points in the gym or do you want to be unsubbable?
This is the cancer in jiujitsu, people prioritize dumb shit like "retaining a guard" or "getting hooks" some arbitrary bullshit that some retarded Brazilian grifters decided was important
None of that actually makes you a better grappler. Unfortunately that's the stuff Danahers instructions will prioritize because he teaches sport jiujitsu. It's through the bias of winning competitors literally nobody cares about, not about being the best possible grappler.

>>198839
>maintaining a position that prevents your opponent from attacking effectively is worthless
>controlling your opponent is worthless
Not sure if retardation or Premium Grade bait

>>198833
>it's only Team Butt-hurt who have anything slightly bad to say about him
I don't think I've heard them say anything bad about him, most certainly not about his abilities as a coach. Craig regularly dunks on Gordon and New Wave as a whole, but the worst I've heard them say about Danaher specifically are the "John Danaher is probably a serial killer" jokes

>>198860
Hooks give a way out, side "control" gives a way out. Now those are the positions where you'll only be successful if the other person is really bad
Consider knee on belly as well, the position is so dogshit that pros don't even bother with it even though it gives points because it's an engraved invitation to lose top position
The rules of the sport cultivate bad grappling habits. Ignore them and learn to grapple

>>198883
Oh god it's this guy again

>>198745
>Just watch Go Further Faster series by Danaher for Gi, and New Wave Jiu Jitsu for No-Gi.
I don't have new wave
the reason listed the 4 fastest way is because a friend gave them to me on a usb

>>198923
People doing sport jiujitsu and thinking because they're good at that it makes them good at grappling period are the same as people doing sport karate thinking they're good strikers
It's the exact same situation in fact

>>198926
What is your criteria for "good at grappling, period"?

>>198934
Good grappling comes down to control
You're the one that decides when and how your opponent hits the ground
At any time on the ground you can choose to stand up and he can't
When hes down he stays down for as long as you want him to be there and when he gets up it's because you've chosen to allow him to
You decide how pleasant his time on the ground will be, if it's going to be simply held there without discomfort or if it's going to be agonizing

These are the goals of good grappling, and they are not the goals of sport jiujitsu or John's teachings
He bases all his methods under the assumption the person you're against is mandated to act in a certain way due to the rules

Look no further than https://youtu.be/rvytqwi36DI?si=XO8LoDDQpt89JJNo

This is what happens if you follow John's advice outside of sport jiujitsu

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Thoughts on the CJI?
My thoughts is if you pay the athlete you would get more out of them
Also fuck arabs

>>198947
Couldn't that leg lock attempt gone either way though? I've seen people get leg locks in Street fight videos and finish them.. it was just unlucky that the winners balance and escape was good

>>198973
craig is a cool guy
i dont really watch or follow high level jiu jitsu
if the competitors get paid more that's good for them i guess

>>198973
From a viewer perspective; one camera, the pit, and streaming free on YouTube means I'm at least watching the first one. Whether or not they can get more names and/or good match up potential is gonna determine beyond that.

>>191479
Lads almost 3 years into bjj here as a blue belt and I just feel I ain't progressing correctly. I have no systems and essentially beat most noobs with conditioning. Can someone please tell me what I can watch to educate and elevate myself

>>199025
I'm also a 3 year blue belt.

I usually note down what positions or techniques I'm struggling with after each session and try to work on those for a couple of weeks at a time.

A recent example: I kept getting pinned in reverse half-guard, so I looked up a few escapes, drilled them with a buddy and did some positional sparring from there until I felt like I had mentally digested the techniques and could execute them with some success.

I don't think it's much deeper than that: either you find holes in your game and try to patch them up, or work to integrate new techniques that look interesting to you.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8qKTHf-Dnkk

So I was talking to a guy about MMA and bjj .... He used to trains and fight... He kept saying he got his blue belt from hoyce Gracie..


And I was like... Huh? Royce Gracie? And he said HOYCE gracie

I thought.. hnm haven't heard of him... That's strange. I just found out now that Royce is pronounced Hoyce..

How much of an idiot did I look? Or is this normal mistake?

>>199049
Normal. The real secret is that Helio is pronounced Real-Ee-Oh

>>199049
People can be bad with names

>>198982
But look at his methodology in the leg lock, he didn't manage the other leg or the arms at all, Because you don't have to do that in sport jiujitsu, because there is no consequence of getting your face smashed in with punches because your leg lock isn't working
Think about all of the different guard positions, in sport matches people would argue that they are anywhere from neutral to superior positions, In the context of MMA every single guard position you are losing objectively because he can just hit you and there isn't much you can do about it

Sport jujitsu does not mandate the same level of full body control as what I would consider good grappling to be, Because if someone gets off the hook you just reset and do it again, there is no consequence
But with that we can see what the consequence is when you aren't grappling appropriately for the context you're in

>>198947
>ignoring his 9 other fights where he won, 6 of those via submission
>>198728
You should watch the Unpassable Guard one first, and work on escapes simultaneously.

>>199139
>ignoring his 9 other fights where he won, 6 of those via submission

>wins exclusively against regional cans
>loses against the first actually good person he fights
many such cases

>>199140
Does it not count when he RNC's a guy ranked at #3? Only counts when he loses to the #1 ranked guy? Retard

>>199154
That's the only good guy he's beaten. Also one of the only ones with a wikipedia page.

>go to 2 free trial classes at a gym
>15 mins of insanely hard warmups
>Completely gassed before class even starts
>instructor shows a random move
>never shows how to defend it
>drill it for some amount of time again non resisting partner
>tell him to resist but we don't know how to
>class ends

>go to other gym
>same shit

This CANNOT be how bjj fags actually learn things right? Are these instructors aware of how literally any other skill in the world is taught? You'd progress 10x faster with any decent pedagogy.

>>199154
you're kind of missing the point
he got his face smashed in because he tried to do a sport jiujitsu ashi garami that didn't account for upper body control since it isn't important in sport jiujitsu

so watching instructionals on how to be effective at sport jiujitsu isn't going to make you the most effective grappler you could be. ESPECIALLY if you have no interest in competing under the silly ibjjf rules. It's a real shame how gyms will just use those rules as the house rules in their club for what is and isn't important even though nobody is even competing in anything that matters

>>199166
Yeah but irl against normal people you'd have broken the top guy's leg long before he realized how to angle himself to punch you multiple times

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>>199167
>Yeah but irl
Whoever gets their hands to the weapon on their waistband first wins. If you're smart enough to bail out on the leg log like the guy in webm-related you win, if you go for the sport BJJ move like in the MMA match you lose.

>>199168
that ones gonna be hard to justify legally speaking

>>199165
I bring this up often around here but I get shouted down. What you've experienced is in fact the way most people learn it, it's the reason it takes 15 years to get a black belt and they still suck at a lot of things at the end of it

for whatever reason people resist the task based approach to training even though it's been shown time and time again the fastest way to learn something is to just play around with it within certain constraints to develop the skill you're after

>>199169
>guy on ground getting attacked defends himself
>this is a problem
What kind of cucked hellhole do you live in?

>>199170
>I get shouted down
For being autistic about it. The correct approach you see in good schools is a balance of the two concepts but you're hyperfixated on only one part of a good teaching system.

>>199176
did you watch craig on joe rogan? he said he was self taught by reading books and watching videos, didn't even have a black belt over him, and only got formal instruction from lachlan for 2 years before going over to john
know what the take away is? you're better off teaching yourself jiujitsu and just rolling with your friends than you are going to most of these boomer retards running "academies"

it's a shame how many people want to become high level athletes and the main thing holding them back is their coach being absolutely ass at teaching them

>>199179
I'm sorry you were had by a McDojo but not everywhere is like that. The teaching system in judo at every school I've visited (and the two BJJ schools I've visited, for that matter) combines these concepts. If Brazilians and their groupies are too retarded to figure that out I would think that says more about them than it does the validity of a best-of-both-worlds methodology as maintained in the judo pedagogical system.
>self taught by reading books and watching videos
Who wrote the books and made the videos? They sound like they'be be good coaches to have on hand.

>>199182
The people that wrote books and made videos during that time were the free thinkers of the era blazing their own path
The Brazilian way doesn't work
And the japanese way might be even worse
You must wash the rice for 3 years before we let you make the sushi
You must practice the kata for 5 years before we let you do kumite

The only thing saving judo is there's a competitive sport with a lot of money in it. The ones at the top of the sport sure as shit aren't repping the gokyo. They're doing calisthenics to increase their action capacity and playing.
Learning moves is bullshit, if you want to be good at rhe sport then just play the game. And judo is wise enough to let that be a path to black belt. Fuck the knowledge, if you throw people well enough you get one, simple as

>>199185
>And the japanese way might be even worse
>You must wash the rice for 3 years before we let you make the sushi
>You must practice the kata for 5 years before we let you do kumite
That's not even close to how it works in judo.
>The ones at the top of the sport sure as shit aren't repping the gokyo
Go watch some Olympic level judo practices. They all drill uchikomi and they all do randori. Practicing technique helps reinforce the relevant neural pathways and makes you better at executing it during play. You see this kind of training at all levels of sport.

>>199187
The main function of uchikomi in that room is physical conditioning, they're doing it with high speed and intensity so their turns and steps are explosive and powerful

What they don't have is some jackass standing in the middle of the room listening to himself talk "Ok so you're going to grab the bottom of the tricep and as I pull I'll take a step to the left causing him to take a step forward and then...."
Then everyone claps like trained seals and goes back and forth comploantly 3 times each
That's how nearly every bjj room in the world looks, and if you'll find the rooms that actually produce good athletes don't train like that

Every single one of them will say
here's your task:
Here's an example of how that might look:
Go do it live

And the coach will attentively help people troubleshoot any problems they run into

>>199166
He made mistakes in using the technique. That does not invalidate it.
>didn't account for upper body control
Are you saying leglocks in MMA are ineffective? Because that's just stupid.
>watching instructionals on how to be effective at sport jiujitsu isn't going to make you the most effective grappler you could be
You're defining effective as it relates to MMA. Not everyone trains for MMA rulesets. Why would a guy who's goals center around BJJ rulesets spend time worrying about other shit?
You faggots only do this for BJJ and not for wrestling, judo, boxing, muay thai, etc.

>>199235
I'm not doing it as it relates to MMA I'm doing it as it relates to grappling period, the problem is that people doing BJJ think that their rules are king so the methodology that makes them successful in their really weird niche competitions makes them the best grapplers
Meanwhile they don't know how to do stand up, they can't wrestle for shit, they can't get up off of their backs, They put themselves in compromised positions constantly
And then people spend all this money on instructionals to learn from a bunch of juice junkies that play grab ass in their echo chamber
I'm the best grappler in the world out of all 5 guys that do this sport professionally!

>>199241
While your posts are generally annoying, and many of your chosen examples are argued improperly, I do agree with most of what you say. The default flavor of BJJ school is trash. Paying to do jumping jacks and shrimp up a mat, have a 30 second youtube video mumbled at you by someone who barely knows english followed by 20 minutes of rolling is not an effective way to learn. The best grapplers are those who put in the effort to direct their own training and growth beyond the beginner level. I also agree that a lot of bjj dudes suck ass at takedowns and cope their way around that fact, though I think that problem is beginning to sort itself out as more wrestlers get involved with submission grappling. Where I train now definitely takes a better approach to teaching than my previous Brazilian instructor and, as a result, we're very highly ranked on smoothcomp despite being a young school.

>>199241
>I'm doing it as it relates to grappling period
Again, you're only applying this to BJJ
>they put themselves in compromised positions constantly
Wrestlers literally lay on their belly or stick their neck up from referee position. Judokas stand straight up and completely give up leg takedowns because muh ruels. Why are you not sperging about those issues in those sports? Why are shitty takedowns in BJJ worse than the complete neglect of submissions in wrestling?
It's because you're retarded. Different sports have different rules. People who hope to achieve success in their sport will focus on the rulesets that matter to them. Armchair monkeys like you will make up arbitrary rules for people that could break your limbs effortlessly

>>191689
out of pure curiosity, what made you repeat this old unfunny comment word for word, in response to seeing chinese characters?

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>>199235
>Are you saying leglocks in MMA are ineffective?

NTA but I agree that leglocks that have you facing the opponent are inherently more risky when strikes are involved than they are in sport jiujitsu. Leglocks that are safer and higher percentage in MMA are ones that turn your opponent facing away from you so they can't hit you. Charles Oliveira is a great example of this. Whenever he's going for a leglock, it's usually a heelhook or calf crush where he's off to the side or behind his oppponent, making it really hard to land ground and pound.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZiVXzX9CQiU

>>199258
You don't need submissions to fuck someone up on the ground, and many wrestling positions have submissional aspects to them and use pain compliance to hold people in place
On the other hand you do need to have takedowns
It's just a joke people would call themselves ground fighting experts without reliable ways to put someone down there

>>199260
racial jokes are funny

>>199260
>>199267
>unfunny
I'm the moonrune poster and I got a chuckle out of it.

>>199269
if you cant laugh at yourself why even bother?
https://www.youtube.com/shorts/w7EcmRiLeUs

>>199265
Isn't it better to learn bjj as it's easier on the body, has more options and even basic safe takedowns such as body lock into trip or high crotch will work on the average person, especially with strikes it will likely devolve into a hockey punch fight until one/both fall over

You don't need perfect single leg dragging your knee and changing levels, in fact this is dangerous on the streets. Then on top of that wrestling is a young persons sport done on mats. Not good for a hobbyist adult. This is why bjj is essentially better and can be trained longer

Or am I wrong?

>>199270
Man, it gets worse. Tonal languages were a mistake.
https://chinesepod.com/blog/2014/10/25/how-to-read-a-chinese-poem-with-only-one-sound/

>>199271
I don't necessarily think BJJ is safer than wrestling, I think it's because wrestling is a sport first so the wrestling room is a highly competitive environment and it's just overtraining wear and tear related injuries
The average BJJ room is really casual, but a competitive BJJ room is not good for your health
So id say if you taught wrestling in a more relaxed casual way it would be just as safe, maybe even safer

Like when I look at BJJ injuries there is almost always an injury in classes regarding stand up sparring
And there is very rarely an injury in judo randori by comparison, which doesn't make sense since they spend so much more time on the feet but you don't see as many stand up related injuries

But actually when you think about it it does make sense, I think it's a similar situation where a dull knife is more dangerous than a sharp one because you have to push harder and accidents happen
So I think if BJJ spent more time working on it's to stand up aspects and the practitioners were sharper it would be safer for them to do more of
The same thing happened when heel hooks got popular, everyone was afraid of them because no one knew how to do them in a controlled way and now they are just a normal thing

>>199272
there is a somewhat less unhinged version that can be done in english

ahem:
Buffalo buffalo Buffalo buffalo buffalo buffalo Buffalo buffalo

>>199265
You said you weren't talking about MMA, only grappling. Try to stay on topic retard

>>199279
Not seeing where it says MMA in that post

>>199276
>The same thing happened when heel hooks got popular, everyone was afraid of them because no one knew how to do them in a controlled way and now they are just a normal thing
Same thing with lockdown. I've heard older grapplers talk about how people were trying lockdown after Eddie beat Royler and people were blowing knees out left and right. Now it's pretty common to teach lockdown stuff to new people.

Half the people you talk to say bjj is dumb and useless

Half say it's the greatest martial art on earth

Who is right?

>>199378
It's most people's first style right now. They also aren't typically athletes of any kind of real competitive thing before that. This leads to both opinions, because either you meet a lot of awkward fucks with even more awkward ability, or you love it so much you can't see the merits of something else. Whether they're right or wrong doesn't matter at that point.

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>>199378
when you see people practicing in a jedi costume you need to assume they're in a cult until proven otherwise

they use it as a cheap parlor trick to make it seem effective "here, wrap yourself up in these ropes and let me grab on to them. Heh, pretty hard to move now isn't it? I would totally beat you in a fight if this were real"
and the room temp IQ body builders go WOOAHH IT TOTALLY IS LEGIT!!! I laid down on the ground and the guy laid on top of me and I totally couldn't get up!!!

>>199378
BJJ can be very effective for self-defense, but also contains a lot of sport-specific stuff that will get you killed if you try to pull it off in a proper fight. So it's up to the practitioner to exercise their common sense and know which is which.
Best example of this is pulling guard/butt scooting. Makes a lot of sense in a sport BJJ setting, is massively idiotic anywhere else

Effectiveness aside, it's a great workout and since many practitioners are middle-aged dads who just want to keep active, the people are generally pretty chill*, this is imo one of the main reasons why it's so popular

*of course this depends on the specific gym, a heavily competition-oriented gym will have more people taking it very seriously

>>199277
>Buffalo buffalo Buffalo buffalo buffalo buffalo Buffalo buffalo
This made me tear up, thx

mma scoring for cji makes sense
I wasnt a fan of ibjjf points system

>>199379
This aligns with my experience and perception, as well. By the time I touched BJJ I had already spent years in wrestling and judo, giving me enough of a background to immediately recognize both the potential strengths and potential blindspots of the system, but a reasonable number of the BJJ guys I've encountered are as you described.

>>199378
>Who is right?
The people that actually train and have an opinion somewhere in the middle.

>>199402
The longer you train jiujitsu the more you'll feel like you've wasted a lot of time that should've been spent on judo or wrestling

>>199403
>should've been spent on judo or wrestling
If your at gym with no standing you should switch gym
I been in a gym with both high level pure bjj guys and wrestler

>>199394
>>199386
>>199400
>>199404
I once had to restrain someone and I tackled them to the floor from behind, then wrapped my legs inside theirs to flatten them out, then got them in a rear naked choke to keep them there until police arrived

This just came naturally to me. I have never studied martial arts before. It also seems like this is the pinnacle of jiu jitsu?

Does anyone with half a brain already know how to instinctively control someone?

>>199404
bjj is pretty much officially over now with the CJI having a 7 figure prize and being scored like MMA
its going to be all about ride time now

>>199403
The thing is for anyone above the age of 20 judo or wrestling will cripple you before you become decent at it

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>>199407
they try to market an instinctional behavior like some kind of arcane knowledge that costs $3000 a year to acquire from a brown guy that didn't finish grade school

>>199408
>its going to be all about ride time now
Hey I think thats a good thing, I have trained with UFC guys and I like MMA I just can't be going to work black eyes. So I do nogi/submission grappling or what ever you want to call it.
As long as I can go to a gym de-stress.

>>199407
for the most part but the fun is doing it who knows how to react properly. Your instinctively aren't correct most of the time.

>>199407
Once you get a dominant position like a back mount, controlling and submitting the other person isn't that hard.
It's getting to that position, or escaping it if you're on the receiving end, without getting caught in a submission that's difficult, and that's where the real grappling happens

>>199413
>How to react properly with a bunch of convuluted rules to make the encounter into a chess game instead of an actual fight for dominance

>>199419
convuluted rules...
Don't hit and respect the tap,
what do you think I am talking about?

It is more fun to roll with someone who knows how to respond to submissions. If I get a armbar I want to be stacked and put on the defense.
If you don't like the rules go make your own.

>>199419
>the extremely convoluted rules of "no punching no biting no eye gouging"

>>199407
>I tackled them to the floor from behind
>the pinnacle of jiu jitsu
This is like calling the knockout game the pinnacle of boxing. The struggle comes when you have to control someone who is competent and/or paying attention.
>Does anyone with half a brain already know how to instinctively control someone?
If you were physically active as a child the basics of grappling are relatively intuitive. Refining and expanding upon these basics gives you a lot of tools; e.g., if you actually applied a proper RNC to that man he'd be unconscious in about four seconds and you'd be holding a dead man by the time the cops showed up, just like Daniel Penny. Knowing what you're doing gives you the option to pin and restrain a man without hurting him or to put him out of the fight quickly (broken limb or unconsciousness). It also gives you a chance against stronger or more technically competent opponents.

>>191479
>>199408
I been thinking about this, are rides the better then or equal to submissions now?

and

I am thinking of changing my strategy from focusing back control / straight jacket system.
Should going for rides (leg lacing and wrist rides) to burn out there muscle for whole 5 minutes round.

>>199441
Yes, rides are what will optimally lead to submission. Cooking the guy until he can't fight back
Unlike passing which is high energy expenditure for both of you, riding is only high expenditure for him.
Passing is a tactically retarded thing to do and is only harped on because it gets score. It doesn't really have inherent value to do that right away, it's simply the timeline of a match that forces it.

All pro matches are at least 10 minutes, and as much of that time as possible should be spent grinding him out on the bottom

Is bjj so popular and useful because most fights in reality are a very messy battle for control?

Everyone sees big judo throws and thinks whaoo that would kill them judo>bjj

but its just not practical in reality?

>>199446
How are you going to ride if you don't pass?

>>199441
>>199446
Rides are great but submissions should always be the priority. I've had a lot of success with the lower/upper body rides but they really only exhaust your opponent if they care about getting up
>t. been at B-Team since they opened
Here's Craig talking about this recently
https://youtu.be/Z905rtKVOaA?si=c-7oDUfQaVWjzd8x&t=161

>>199489
Very few people on this board have been in a brawl. I'm not some wannabe tough guy. I got attacked in the street and it's absolutely chaotic. Remember all those schoolyard scrapes? It usually winds up when the 2 guys are entangled in the ground and then somebody usually gets the mount and beats the shit out of the other. I was able to execute a flying mare, but not before I took an elbow to my cheekbone.

A well-executed judo throw on concrete/pavement will critically injure if not kill someone who has no idea how to break falls. But there's so many variables like not getting a good grip and posture or the other dude tripping up your leg or grabbing your hair or belt.

BJJ is popular because the UFC showcased how and why groundfighting and submissions were overlooked for generations despite earlier pundits like Gene Lebell talking about this since the 1950's. Martial arts popularity came in waves. Judo and Jujutsu (koryu kind) was the big thing for the first half of the 20th century. Then Karate in the 1960's. Chinese unarmed styles in the 1970's thanks to Bruce Lee and Hong Kong flicks. Ninjutsu in the early 1980's.

BJJ was primarily designed through experimentation in its early decades as a street-fighting tool because Brazil was a very dangerous place (still is). The Brazilians honed Judo Newaza on Positional Hierarchy because it prepares you for what to do when you're caught when the other guy has your back, you're in his side control, or other unfavorable zones.

The problem with BJJ is that it became spotified like Judo did. Sport BJJ has too much butt scooting and lacks initiation of offensive action to bring the guy to the ground. The original BJJ had guys utilizing judo and wrestling takedowns/trips/throws to off-balance, soften up, and then they could seize the advantage for submission.

So train both stand-up and ground.

>>199492
Controlling the legs
The reason you're always told to control the hips is because that gives down stream control of the legs, but the legs need to push on the floor
If you shelve and staple legs the hips are an afterthought since they aren't free to move anyway, then you climb your way up
It's the basis for how khabib controlled people. It was all about shelving the legs first
That thicc japanese highschool girl wrestler is great at it also

>>199495
Ask Craig why that JT guy with the podcast has such a hate boner for him? If he doesn't know or want to say I'll ask my friend who knows both of them why
Talks about Craig like he pump and dumped his sister

>>199515
>Ask Craig why that JT guy with the podcast has such a hate boner for him?
I had never heard of him before this comment, but I just watched his video. Sounds like a bitter loser lol calling Craig a psychopath who only wants power

>>199516
His whole argument is craig is trying to make money!

Ok?

AND GET FAME TOO!!

OK??

>>199515
>you're always told to control the hips
?
I was never told to control the hips, I was told that passing is getting past the legs, so that I could get chest to chest, so that I could pin. Conversely, if I'm playing guard, I'm not putting my feet on the ground, I'm putting my feet on you, in addition to my grips, to control you, then to sweep you, so I can get on top, get chest to chest, and pin.

Are you trying to describe a specific style of passing? The legs need to be contended with one way or another. I feel like you're trying to court controversy and lay down these hot takes, but just end up arguing against nothing.

>>199525
He's talking about leg riding, not passing guard. Sometimes you get there from attacking turtle, countering leg entanglements, half guard, leg drags etc.

>>199526
Gotcha, that makes more sense. I hate turtle and almost never go there, and I'm a basic bitch and know nothing about the leg game, so that explains at least some of my confusion.

I've seen passes/passing based on bundling and/or stapling the legs, but it's just one more passing option.

>>199515
>JT guy with the podcast
who and what podcast

>>199531
https://youtu.be/dWoEVymQdIg?si=Yt6wW1Ob_DqqdItv

He's salty about Craig making money from jiujitsu but mind you is using it to build a platform to sell his training programs

>>199532
This is really funny,
>MY MOM KNOWS HIM UGH
kek

>>199533
lol the channels sub count was 32k this morning, now its 28k

Does learning bee jay jay make you able to control someone standing up as well?

>>199577
Your going to learn how to grapple some

>>199577
a little but not particularly well

should I go to brazil to train bjj if I never did bjj before and don't speak portugeuese?
the idea seems romantic, plus I wanna bang hotties

>>199582
What

>>199585
questions in bad English gets an answer
in bad english

In Brasilian Jiu Jitsu, can you grab?

>>199586
Okay nerd

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any good copes for newer people with less experience becoming better than you?

>>199590
It gets you better training partners faster so you're less likely to get mogged by the next new guy who decides to take his training slightly more seriously than the resident slacker (You).

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>>199592
thanks

>>199593
What do you think has been holding you back, both in general and in relation to the other guy?

>>199590
Some people have better natural aptitude. Some people have better previous experience. Some people have better self study skills. Some people have better control of their diet and rest. Some people are just better. If you're not working on everything but the last to some degree, then you have a lever to pull.

>>199577
Yeah
Not quite as good as wrasslin but you'll be able to wrangle an untrained person pretty well

>>199584
>I wanna bang hotties
You mean you're gonna get fucked by trannies

>>199628
Migrate when ready

>>199584
>brazil
>seems romantic

Whats your thoughts on this :
easy answer i already know -" do what ever you want " but hear me out

I'm a brown belt
I use bjj as an outlet for life stress, work, family responsibilities etc.
I go, get a sweat and or help someone else or learn a new transition. It's a hobby.

my coaches are now openly pressuring me to compete because they've seen what I can and cant do and really want me to travel to different states with them, go 'into the tournament season'--but I have mixed feelings about it. I stopped competing years ago as I decided to focus on my career and priorities like that.

but my coaches are putting the bait in front of me as " well if you want that black belt we have to have some time out at events again. we dont want you to have a time based black belt'
i like the thought, but i also just dont have the time. I feel like im a lose lose = it takes away the 'escape' i use bjj for while also disappointing my people if I dont follow through

>>199651
Show up to your next class in a white belt. Unless you're signing fight contracts, competition isn't any kind of compulsory.

>>199651
Tell him if he wants a medal so bad to go win one for himself

>>199651
Just explain what you explained here and don't allow yourself to care what color strip of cloth holds your gi closed. Consider going to tournaments for fun and without the autistic prep you'd need to ensure first place in each one.

guys i fkn hate being pulling guard - half or full - really just being on the bottom and try to avoid it as much as possible. i also cbf with leg/ankle locks - top pressure and simple chokes/arm bars are great. curious to know if anyone else is the same.

>>199745
>top pressure and simple chokes/arm bars
Love em

Did positional rounds last Saturday
I could had to submit or sweep while keeping guard.
Fuck that, I was sweating like a pig

>>191610
peppermint dave or mark the mint man could help with this

>>199745
Guard is one of the most unique parts of BJJ and it massively fun when you’re half decent at it. Straight ankles and heel hooks are also low hanging fruit