If you are a /beg/inner or /int/ermediate in art, please use this thread to post pieces for critique or ask for advice.Please stop replying to crabs, nodraws and howies and instead focus on posted works!>STICKY:Completed: https://docs.google.com/document/d/1uwaXKU7ev6Tw_or__o8ARpUb6r2rCZYJGqwSFV9AD98New collaborative: https://hackmd.io/UMnZVhNITW-T2wZpHw6d0Qw/ic/i: https://sites.google.com/site/ourwici/Hardcore: https://hackmd.io/7k0XRnIQR6SValR77TDfZw?view>WHERE to get study materialsannas-archive.org>>>/ic/artbook>>>/ic/video>Want to practice figures?quickposes.comsketchdaily.netcharacterdesigns.comlovelifedrawing.composemy.artmangapose.comline-of-action.com>PYW and give your feedbackWhat can be improved?Are there any resources videos or books you'd recommend to them?Maybe a redline or a technique, be specific.Try to reply to someone as you post your own work.>Cool teachersGlenn VilppuMichael HamptonSteve HustonBrent EvistonMarco BucciAndrew LoomisGeorge BridgmanHikaru Hayashi>Cool booksKeys To DrawingDrawing With the Right Side of the BrainHow To Draw Comics the Marvel WayThe Art and Science of DrawingFramed PerspectiveFigure Drawing For All It's WorthThe Complete Guide to Drawing From LifePrevious thread: >>7358093
quitting my job next week to go on an art journey for the next 6 months bros it's gonna be great
A failed experiment, a monster
>>7359762If you want to actually commit to this and see some tangible growth you should use this week to set concrete goals for the next 6 months. I'd also advise your goals align with some sort of curriculum.
Caught the tail end of last thread
>>7359766I've gone through a few courses and books over the last 2 years and I'm kinda sick of it, right now the plan is to keep making studies of art I like + actually start doing my own pieces So 3 studies + 1 OC a day is the plan starting out
I have yet to get some feedback on the Perlin noise. How is it? Did I do good?
>>7359765Man. I tried finally making a new character design today, after not getting any sleep last night and 8 hour school day. Yeah I don't know about this one. i hope I can salvage what I've drawn now, tomorrow.
>>7359779You are not me though
>>7359780I meant. I kinda failed today as well :D
>>7359782Let's be failures together and keep drawing
>>7359785yeah. Not today thought, my hand just refuses to cooperate with how I want to to draw, never draw sleep deprived i guess, nothing good comes out of that. I wonder how much I'm gonna laugh when I see my design attempt tomorrow after I've gotten some actual sleep.
>>7359765The only way you can learn to succeed is to learn to fail, and learn from failure.
tried to draw some stuff without reference yesterday in bed
>>7359765I really like the hatching texture. Be proud of the effort that went into your experiment.>>7359769The proportions look scuffed, but I can tell you put effort into your anatomy. Keep it up.>>7359778I think the pose is quite static/neutral. If this is the beginning panel of a comic it'd be good. For a character illustration it needs more of story. Overall it's clean and looks fine but nothing that would make it stand out (I don't enjoy this particular fetish so my critique is just going off how I would crit any character illustration.)
Started sketching out the panels and machinery that will make up the new beast design. Not so sad today. Big doinks
>>7359769Get a figure drawing book- or better yet go to some figure drawing classes if they’re available- and study it. To be completely honest anon, I think you should consider making a return to trad so that you can draw from life more to solidify your understanding Of the fundies, because there is virtually no fundamental present in this drawing. You aren’t at a level I think you should be working digitally, unless that’s your prerogative, and I think returning to a traditional format would be best for you.
Christmas vacation starts pretty soon for me. I get to draw when I want for about 2 months. how do I best use this time to improve my drawings?
>>7359809Completely fucked the definition of prerogative *, probably a better word would’ve been “goal” or “desire”.
>>7359802Thanks. I'll measure against similar characters to be sure about the proportions. Its a 5 head tall animu girl so its going to be a mutant either way lmao>>7359809What difference going trad would make? Digital’is far more convenient material wise.
I feel like I'm starting to get the hang of facial feature placement.
>>735981110 million floating boxes in void. You'll be instant pro
>>7359755Perspective bros/gals, can I get some help? Drew the stairs in pic rel from life and made the mistake of the stairs becoming gradually smaller despite them being the same size past the seventh.not too sure how to fix this.
>>7359826putain.....
>>7359837
>>7359837I'm having a hard time imagining these stairs in real life.Does it have an odd geometric shape jutting in the middle or does it curve around a corner?
>>7359842I posted a picture. It looks off bc im not very trained in perspective, hence why I’m drawing them lol
>>7359811what you do?
>>7359837Stairs don't just get smaller they get thinner too.
>>7359839>>7359837Your jutting wall is missing one of its faces. The railing is angled in and doesnt change depth. Try not to picture it as an angle rather as a road getting smaller the further away it is. Stairs appear both smaller and thinner the higher they are from your perspective. And the same is true. They're not angled they're getting smaller. The angle is a trick of perception.You fix this by doing it again.
>>7359844what? I'm just an engineering student, I rarely get actual time off so I actually want to draw this time, if that's what you're asking
>>7359837>>7359839/beg/sperm here but on the ref picture the upper left wall isn't straight, it goes a bit toward the left while yours go toward the right.Your ramp on the right also thicken as it move away which is wrong, it should become smaller.
>>7359845>>7359850Alright. Thanks for the help anons . I’ll post a retry later
>>7359854>>7359854Don't be afraid to use a ruler to make straight lines. You can use whatever you have too. Another pen. Your phone. Finger. Having a consistent starting line will help a lot with such sharp angles.
>>7359868Chronenbergian
Sovinov1
>>7359868Hot bod
I watched Arcane for the first time yesterday. Loved it. But I had the reoccuring thought that I will never make anything as beautiful. Have you had a similar experience begsisters?
>>7359895Remember that isn't one person. That's a group effort. And you could be part of one one day. If only for 1 scene or 1 background.
>>7359895No.
I did this a few days ago.>>7359895usually it's when I read through 80/90s comicbooks or watch OVAs, lately i've been having this feeling because of artist friends
chat, xiao weichun or taco, what will give me more gains?
>>7359921>what will give me more gains?DRAWING AND PYW
>>7359922Ok but hear me out..how? Just kidding, I just want to start copying a good book for anatomy and seek some other anons who have experiences with these book to tell me what is better objectively
>>7359755Help. My perspective is fubar
>>7359924Just look at each book and decipher how you want your figures to look once you’re at your desired skill level. Whatever book you pick will inevitably have a strong impact on your art style, so just decide based on that. You don’t need to wait either, you could be done copying and studying the cover of pic you sent by the end of the day
None of these anatomy books are good at showing anybody what WAY to go about being able to draw the body.Glad I never bought any of them.
>>7359926At first glance I can say that the kneeling girl should be bigger than it is just because of perspective alone. She's way closer to the "camera" than the standing girl.
>>7359924To be honest with you, I don't think anyone here ever did none of those drawing exercises you talk about. That's why I replied to you "just draw and pyw". 80% of anons here are no-draw crabs, 15% are pre-begs wich don't follow ANY advice whatsoever, and 5% (or less) actually love to draw, so you won't find them here most of the time, they are drawing and lurking someplace else. And that's what you should do, just draw and do not care about anything else. If you want that kind of feedback deviant art is the right place, this place is good though, to post stuff and gets brutal critiques, this is a great place for begs. I don't think beg work should be posted in social platforms like DA or Twitter. This is the place to post your amateur work "safely".
Making a copy. Got about this far. I have no clue how to paint. For reference, I drew this: >>7359604
>>7359953Go back and reattempt the back foot.You're better than that.
Trying to draw environments more, if anyone has any advice for the best way to improve there.
>>7359959Better?
Gimme halloween costume to draw.
>>7359999
>>7360000Cursed quads of autism.
>>7359984Those legs in the ref are pretty scuffed to begin with honestly
How do my proportions look? Just jumping into construction for the first time.
>>7360027Thanks, my observation skill certainly didn't help me lol. In terms of learning, you think it would be a good idea to implement this or to just move forward since I'm just trying to make a copy?
Is it over?
>>7360033Mm, I'm thinking we're back.
>>7360031The piece itself has many inconsistent elements.If you're trying to learn from it. I wouldn't. If you want to use it to learn by fixing it's issues that would be an interesting project.
>>7360033in fact, for you, things have only just begun
>>7360030arms should be a bit longer, he should be able to comfortably grab his dick and balls otherwise keep going at it and try it from other angles
>>7360033>me on the left
>>7359963I love it anon, maybe the walls could use some more texture, same with the carpet , but I love characters in motion and silly poses, great job
>>7360035I don't think I will then, but I will keep it in mind. Thanks for the feedback.
>>7359953
>>7360048Haha yeah, I noticed that. He had to crank out some context I guess.
Someone rip me to shreds. I'm far too proud of my output recently.
>>7359517A lot of tensions in the original reference though, so not really sure how to play around with that
>>7359895I thought Arcane was pretty ugly >>7360033Why is Mankey doing that wtf!
>>7360068That would make you the exception.
I FUCKING CANT FUCKING DRAW
>>7360089Can you write, don't you? It's basically the same.
>>7360048anatomy doesn't matter if it looks good
>>7360092>Can you write, don't you?this guy's a nowrite /beg/ don't listen to him
>>7360034>>7360036But that doesn’t answer my question thoughbeit?>>7360068Because aipom was being an annoying cunt
Can someone recommend me a good course for digital rendering/painting?
>>7360093I didn't think it looked good. It looks really good in thumbnail tho
I like to think I am getting better at accuracy even if I still cant draw 3d worth utter shit.Looks lovecraftian. Like an alien displaying the image of a face on the air.
I know I need to just keep drilling faces, but damn I really want to get to the point where I can draw bodies. When I do though, and I get any bit of the form halfway decent, it makes issues in the face so much more obvious.
>>7360126The biggest thing you need to learn is how to see, each line must be the same as your reference, don't see an eye, but see individual lines. Measure in your head how far everything is apart etc. Construnction is mostly a meme especially for anime heads. A simple circle and some guidelines is enough, rest must come from your observation. Your face is flat, a real face has a certain roundness to it making it look 3d, you need to feel the FORM. I highly recommend his book and or video course.
Posted this in the last thread Before I realized there was a new one
>Found out yet another one of my fav artists just traces from 3d modelsFOR FUCKS SAKE. WHY EVEN AUTISTICALLY GO OVER ROBERTSON AND LE FORM AND ALL THAT FUCKING BULLSHIT IF NOBODY IS GOING TO DRAW FROM FUCKING IMAGINATION?
>>7360139If you want to do that you can anon. Do you want to? There are literally no rules that you need to follow
>>7360135Lost cause
>>7359839I cant believe Bro just doxxed himself desu
>>7360126Grind 500 floating loomis heads every day.
>>7360135>Construnction is mostly a meme especially for anime headslmao. pyw
>>7360126Lol. Lmao.
How can I learn to draw if I have no fucking talent?
>>7359811What I've always liked about your drawings since I've noticed them is that even though they might not be the highest in skill, it's quite clear a lot of care went into drawing your character. It really shows in your work, and I think your ideas with the whole mixed media collage story telling, while eccentric, are also quite charming. It's nice. This is what I'd consider soul. It's creating for the sake of creating with a love for what you do. It's something that shows in the work and can't be faked.
>>7360183Just start drawing whatever you wanna start drawing and do that for awhile. Why are you doing this?
>>7360183There's a visible progession happening even if you can't see it. I'd say you're at a point in refining your motor skills where you should actually start drawing as that'd help you more than these exercises. Your last cylinder exercise is passable enough to start constructing so I'd step up my practice to that if I was in your shoes. Keep it up anon.
I will surely get good at drawing cute girls by drawing triangles and squares over and over
>>7360183
>>7360126its not as bad as you think. heads in 3D are extremely difficult to draw. youre on the right track
>>7360193Lying to permabeegs is bad and you should feel bad.
>>7360193>Just be permabeg forever bruh>Being mediocre and wrong is unironically good bruh
>>7360192That just looks like directionless practice and the results are about what you'd expect from that.
>>7360200>>7360192>Everyone can draw anon!>Talent doesnt exist>That guy never improved in 9 years while kids become pros in a couple months because (buzzword)Just fuck off already.
>>7360126What no fundies does to a mofo.
>>7360204Are you blind? What exactly is their goal? Can you tell me? They're doing realistic portraiture and landscape paintings then drawing anime girls from imagination? Are you retarded? Does a person who wants to play soccer practice boxing at the gym? Do people like you really? Jesus fucking christ.
>>7360206Don't fall for the demoralization thread takeover bait bruh haha.
>>7360207Had me pressed for a second haha mb.
>>7360207>Everything I dont like is bait
>>7360187>Just start drawing whatever you wanna start drawing.Just how?
>>7360225pray to Apollo, and perhaps the Muses too
Started drawing recently so im still not sure if my construction is okay, but the upper half of the body always looks weird to me, especially the hips/waist area. Breasts also turn out bad small or big. Also im not sure but the ribcage area doesnt look wide enough i feel like.
attack of giant ratbear Almost complete failure
>>7360225Cris done drew my wife holyy. >>7360229Is this mikeymegamega construction? Just draw along with his videos a bunch of times and listen to him when he says how and why he draws the lines the way he does.
>>7360192Checked that guys blog, he still paints, pic related. Also he said the anime girls were just for fun, plein air landscapes were his main goal.
>>7360236Yeah its him, i watched one or two vids of his a few days ago but ill look into his channel a bit more ig. :v
>>7360232I like it. I'm working on something similar.Yours is far more dynamic and interesting though.
Guys I had an epiphany today I have wanted to draw for many years, and every time I start, I stop after a few days And then after a while I look at drawings and start to suffer and start to draw againWhy not cut out the middle man, the result is the same, it starts and ends with me drawing anyway, so why not just fill the gap.. I must fill the gap Kind of an obvious thought, and one I have had many times, but I feel like it has just clicked
Be honest ints. How long did it take you
>>7360253
>>73602534 years of half assing it. I could have gotten here in between 1 or 2 years if I wasn't a lazy fuck. I think this can be applied to most people on this board. You'd be surprised what some consistency in the discomfort zone can do for your progression.
>>7360130You need to turn your heads and figures to 3/4th view, doing straight on headshots is absolutely useless for begs.
Guys I had another epiphany In order to not quit drawing you just need to tell everyone around you that you are now an artist and that you drawI quit smoking that wayTold the cashier at the store near my flat and my neighbour that I won't smoke anymore and then I felt too ashamed to buy cigarettes Now I haven't smoked for over a year and a half
>>7360126face to head ratio is not good.
>>7360185Thank you. I really like drawing my character. It's nice to see that there are people who like my drawings
>>7360232the perspective is not dynamic enough, same as last one. when drawing big nigga looking at little niggas try having the camera looking up at the big nigga
>>7359837you shoud start with the horizon line, wich you can see pretty clearly from the wall joints on the left in your ref. All receding lines from the stairs should converge to one point there. The staircase has also a vanishing point above the horizon line, because the stairs go up. With this foundation, you can construct the rest of the staircase by transfering the height of the stairs back in perspective.
>try to copy digitally with grid>perfectionist ocd kicks in, can't even make a rough sketch without ctrl-z'ing compulsively, and since i'm very bad, i'm stuck forever
>>7360126Another couple attempts after skimming fast through these.Left is referenced hard. Right is from imagination.Tried to apply a bit of a tilt to the right for right one. It came out mega fucked and wrong still..>>7360205Please dont rub it in.>>7360294Ehhh I didnt bother with the head. I was focusing on the "faceplate" and left everything else doodled>>7360193Some NEET I know got it under a few weeks while I am still blind. Going "It is difficult and it is ok for you to be shit" only rubs it in way more with how the other artists, especially him, have the spatial talent to pull it off while nothing while I am fucking blind.>>7360135Ah Vilppu. I dont like how esoteric his shit is unlie Huston who is far more structured and down to earth. All my attempts at studying him have ended with frustration because I have no idea what he means by form and there is no method other than just copying the outlines with no apparent construction.If I am wrong, which I am, it is because I am utterly retarded and permabeg.I will take your advice and just keep plagiarizing from references, saving every single anime girl tilt possible to steal for later.Thanks.>>7360175Stop stalking me.
First time drawing buildings, this is a church I saw when I was in vacation in Cádiz, Spain
>>7360192that's pretty good progress
>>7360402You will NEVER get good until you grind 800 floating loomis heads a day.Until then, I'll keep laughing at all your sad attempts at doing nothing at all.
Putting in flats. Definitely chose some mismatch colors. Ik at the very least the skin is supposed to be a bit redder I think though.
>>7360420lyenette?
>>7360423Yes.
ESL retard here, how do I actually self-study anatomy? I feel like I can hardly learn anything without a teacher next to me. So far all I've done is watched a few vids about the most basic stuffs like head to body ratio and spend 30m-1h redrawing random anime girls like picrel every night.
>>7360446None of these anatomy books specifically outline what steps to go about learning, they just show pictures of bone and muscles and don't talk about what way to go about drawing all these bones and shit in different angles.
>>7360420I'll never not see the model inconsistencies. But the image is esthetically enjoyable. The colors are dull but I think that adds to her expression.
>>7360446You need figure drawing, not anatomy.
>>7360461Well fuck me sidewaysThanks I will look into it
>>7360285Even though I don't have proportions down yet? Wouldn't that be practicing 3d before I'm ready?
>>7360481start practicing 3d (aka forms) so you learn the shapes of what you're actually trying to draw instead of symbol drawing themhuston or hampton can be your friends here, both for heads and for figure drawings
>>7360481okay ill play along. When is this state of "ready" going to be? And why is worrying about marginal proportional errors on straight on headshots the way to get there? I personally think worrying about proportions as a fresh beg is absolutely fucking useless and will only slow the beg down.
>>7360492I'm just trying to take fundamentals seriously. If the consensus is that I should be working three dimensions already, then I'm down to take a crack at it. I figured ready would be when I could draw straight-on faces from imagination without needing guidelines, and have those shots come out proportional.
>>7360450Hnghg cotton puppussy
>>7359755Study I made out of some cute pic I found around.I really wish to be able to draw in this kind of stylized anime art.
>>7360503I know right? What a doll.. (literally!)
I'm making a VN about twelve identical sisters. Here're the characters so far. I think I have to redraw some of them because they look too janky.
>>7360534I think you picked too small a brush too fast.
>>7360549>some of them
>>7359755Linework and form are my weakness and I think its rooteed into not using my shoulder enough.
I made new character. thoughts?
the design had different hair at first, but I just couldn't make it work, without it turning visually confusing
>>7360481Time to drill this for the foreseeable future
>>7360606
>>7360606>>7360618Fan of Franktonius I take it? You’re doing amazing. Just a few scuffs here and there with line work and anatomy.
>>7360618thanks for the adjustment, this is the ref i used and it seems to have a longer midsection but not as long as i made it, and also didn't put enough pudge on the thighs so it's scuffed in a lot of ways especially the arms and head where i gave up almost completely>>7360628wasn't aware, I saved this from a random thread ages ago but it seems like it is Franktonius lol, thank you
>>7360617Fair first attempt. Have you seen any method to doing the head or are you just emulating other begs regurgitaions of regurgitations of loomis? If not go read a few pages of loomis or watch a watered down video. Or even better go pick someone elses head drawing method if you have someone more interesting in mind. Here's a great lecture from steve huston https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2T7cDY7YDsg
>>7360646I took from DLAS for the method. I'll happily look into this huston fella though.Should I be trying different perspectives as well? Or should I just stick to the 3/4ths until I have that down?
>>7360420Now that I look at the reference, I'm under the impression that for the most part he blobs over his sketches then reintroduced some lineart here and there. I've never blocked in, much less painted before. I'm cooked. Picrel is another one of his works.
>>7360651hotaru..
>>7360649I think a side profile one once in a while is very helpful too. But yeah stick mostly to 3/4ths.
>>7360573cute freckles
day 3 drawing will finish tomorrow probablyI don't really like it though, proportions are messed up, and I kind of gave up on shading from the reference and just started to improvise
A pose for today
>>7360651ok this perspective/anatomy looks real fuckin weird broits like she has no ass/pelvis and her thigh on the floor just...spawns? also it looks way too disconnected
like a butterflya wild butterfly
Reminder, this is all the skill you need to become a millionaire with your art.
>>7360691It is so over.
>>7360691how the fuck do I stylemaxx?
>>7360535Line
i give up with boards and socials, it's all just nonsense, drawing made me asocial and ugly bum with no money or perspectives, i just quit and get back to my uni to get some education and then gonna kmsnormies will get social engagement and life satisfaction even with kid scribbles, but as i was born as autist i get nothingif you have no soul you will always suffer and your works will suck, i swear. (you) can't grind soul
>>7359755How do I improve? What should I focus on the most? I've been drawing for 7 months for 5-9 hours a day and skill-wise, I'm not any different than many who have drawn less in the same period (I would say slightly or even noticeably worse.) I don't think I'm efficiently using these long hours of practice and I haven't been able to figure out how to do it on my own. Some of my big problems: I tend to rush a lot. This is really noticeable.I have no idea how to rotate heads/faces in perspective from imagination. I can do loomis and asaro heads in perspective freehand, but no idea for normal, even simplistic faces, I am stonewalled. Hand and feet. Have never practiced them, I know they look terrible. I have other issues, but these are the ones that I think are the most prominent. My morale has been in the pits for the past week or so because my art has honestly been degrading.Any advice as well as book/video/lesson recommendations would be nice.
>>7360651
>>7360651So appeal really trumps anatomy eh? And here I am grinding poses FUCK
So I made a sequel..
>>7360726appeal is the most important thing
>>7360733I agree. Unless the issues are distracting.
>>7360571TFD - total follicle death
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3ZJdy4lB5Bc
Sketch in progress
>>7360745And a random drawing I did to decompress
>>7360726I mean it's always good to learn anatomy. I'm just trying to figure out his process cuz I like his color choices and the way his paintings look. I don't wanna be a permasketch.
>>7360745Anon. I love your style. I love your imagination. I love your dedication and love of your craft. I wish I was a wealthy aristocrat so I could lounge around and watch you work.
>>7360730>Dave and Bambi ocHow old are you?
How the fuck do you draw this pose. I've been trying for over an hour and had to redo it several times and I still can't wrap my head around it. I'm about to give up. I feel like I'm wasting my time trying to fix things that I don't understand and it feels counterproductive
>>7360758Dont you see the arms overlapping stuff behind them?
Hello beg, yesterday i couldnt post, because i got 1day ban for posting in political thread outside of pol. Never seen this janny behavior before: getting banned for posting in wrong threads (usually they just ban the OPs).Last Dinner v2. Instead of demon waiter it now has a spooky looking face representing diabetes encouraging the American to keep eating high-fructose corn syrup!>>7359826you forgot to draw his neck>>7359811looking at the hands and proportions... keys to drawing>>7359805is this work in progress or is it finished? crop the right part, there is nothing in there>>7359900i kneel and i coom. the reflection on her crotch / abs looks confusing though. is that supposed to be a bulge or what?
>>7360760Sure but I would like to understand the form and what's going on with the body at this angle overall, especially if I want to only loosely reference the pose and change placements of some things. This isn't even that complex of a pose and I'm struggling immensely
>>7359900kinda looks like a female femto
>>7360726Appeal is easier with good anatomy.>>7360758Try making an overlay of tubes and boxes over the photo.You got the angles mostly right up until the hips, then it veers down to the left with a bend to the right in your attempt.
I drew these from references. I have no idea how to approach drawing limbs.
i think everyone pursuing art should watch this short min documentary on sam dillemanns it's very inspirationalhttps://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kzMXBITH9wstap in
>>7360792entartete kunst, disgusting
>>7360762I kinda just don't really draw necks in my art
>>7360762Not a bulge, I just thought it'd look interesting, the rendering was pretty much done from imagination as it came
>>7360810*I thought it'd look interesting, but looking back on it, it's a bit fucked.
>>7360762>Last Dinner v2I thought it was the "sin of gluttony" in a seven deadly sins series.
This took me 1.5 hours. How do I get faster, and what do I need to focus on the most right now? I've finished Kenzo's Love Life Drawing cycle except for his segments on rendering and coloring, as I figure those are too advanced for me.
>>7360817Speed comes from proficiency. Proficiency comes from practice.Everyone's work flow is different. You will develop your own. Draw more.
>>7360549this is a +18 board.Please head back to deviant art with the other children.
https://imgur.com/ryIYUEgyou too can charge and outrageous amount of money for anime girls.
>>7360787understand stand the muscles that make up that limb. Thery stretch. Bunch. Wrap around.
>>7360827Lol thats dirt cheap I do fullbody renders for 400 USD and 100 USD for backgrounds per character. For character sheets that are rendered I make like 1000+ USD easily for like 1-5 days of work, EZ
>>7360827popular artists charge based on demand, i follow this guy and they were like $60 for years
>>7360817This looks nice anon. I think you should do it again, polish your technique, fix some details like the calve muscle there. Also do a bigger drawing of this figure. Or you can do detail parts of her, Like her torso or her face.
>>7360803He has a messy style but I wouldn't call it that, the art isn't really the point even it's his worldview I find interesting
Progress.
Finally managing to put features on the heads that I've been drawing. Thanks for being surprisingly supportive throughout this last week, /beg/. I'm really enjoying showing off the highlights to this thread.
>>7360745Not sure how I want the light sources. Originally I wanted blue and red lights on the hover craft thing reflecting off the character. But also maybe a big wide yellowish light would be cool. Or I ignore the hover thing entirely, crop the photo and have light sources from below for ambient city light. Decisions
Practicing boxes with hide's lv2 croquis, would doing more of this improve the ability to grasp form and foreshortening or is doing boxes in a vacuum better
>>7360906Those are quite some poses...
How does this level of random color choice work? I’ve seen similar other paints where it’s just sometimes entire visible brushstrokes of what seems to be random colors, yet in the end it looks like it makes sense. I feel like especially for my watercolor, I need to understand this.
>>7360419Are you trying to haunt me or teach me or something?
>>7360907Well... weird poses are good practice for the boxy mannequin no?
>>7360931they don't seem so random, to keep it short learning about impressionism is a good place to start tons of vibrant colors and a lot of fun with the lighting effects.
And todays haul: xmas drawn early. I wonder how the City of God xmas DLC will look like. Like i can imagine horror motives in xmas, but not quite so in our weird settings with demons.>>7360906very nice>>7360810well even reflections on chrome surfaces show form, you made it too round so basically she has a penis, you are accidental coomer futa artist now>>7360718i recc doing keys to drawing, skip to chapter called illusion of light and then start rendering your stuff. Pick up charcoal stick / contee or go for ink. your pencil undersketches are basically maxxed out, now all you need is to learn how to render atop of them>>7360669very lovely. pro beg tip: people dont like detailed details on womans hands, all your rendered knuckles and skin made her hand to look old. Less is more in terms of appeal with women
If I want to learn to draw and already own a ipad, is it worth it to just buy the apple pencil and learn digital from the start or is there a reason to start with pencil and paper first?
>>7360965From my experience, if you intend on only doing digital, it would be okay to use only digital. On the flip side, some argue that the difficulty of erasing/undoing mistakes of traditional make it for a more useful learning experience. Paper and pencil is cheap, do both, in my opinion.>>7360956I kind of figured they weren’t, but my understanding of color doesn’t really give me the tools to understand how they are choosing those. I’ll look into Impressionism specifically, and see if that helps.
Finish. Opinions?
>>7360967Thanks, for the advice, I'll try both
I'm four days in trying to draw every day and I already missed a day!I was told that I should learn how to see proportions first before before anything else because I'm pre-beg so I tried today.I knew I would be pretty bad but I'm a bit worse then I thought.
>>7360986Why don't you just trace to get a feeling of them proportions?
>>7360987I though tracing was bad if you actually wanted to learn?
>>7360968Looks pretty good, I don't know if there's anything much to talk about. Looks like a throwaway sticker you'd find at a con.
>>7360989Who told you that? LolTracing will not fuck up your learning, if anything it could be useless if you do it the braindead way. Just make a conscious effort to understand why each line is where it is. Tracing for learning is not bad, tracing for presenting a finished work as your IS bad.
Deleted last post, forgot to post image. >>7360665I remember seeing this bitch on the catalogue for like a month straight. Unintentionally, it looks like the other women are judging her.>>7360961Thanks Pawell, I think you're the only person who has ever replied to any post I've ever made on /beg/. And twice it was a recommendation for keys to drawings lol, although I never finished it. Ironically enough, I think I got to the light and shade section and then stopped.I don't think I've maxxed out pencil sketching so much as I have sketch-maxxed. I never did any finished drawing before October so I'm struggling with them a lot. I think there's still a lot I need to learn with getting proportions and anatomy right, but I'll read that section and some more of keys to drawing and focus more on rendering.>>7360968Nice, this reminds me of SEQUEL. That shading line at the centre of her corset is completely flat, which almost looks like an error. I feel like it should round out like the white bit is.It looks nice, the hands especially are really 3D to me, almost like CG models.
Bought some colored pencils to try out coloring. I'm pretty proud of this as a first attempt (though I think the position of his arms is off)
>>7361029nice kiyru
>>7360961>>7360762>years of mindlessly copying art books for thisoh no no no
figure drawing so fun but i have no idea how to draw a face
>>7361034that anon is good though
>>7360961>Windows activation watermarkAHAHAHAH OHNONONO
>>7361039Pawell can never be good, since he has the wrong idea of art, and the wrong mindset. He's autistic and afraid to draw what he wants to draw everyday, since he only copies art books for years now. Every artist that ever lived didn't get great through copying artbooks, but by drawing by themselves and solving problems they encounter while drawing by supplementing it with artbooks, not the other way around.
>>7361039>that anon is good thoughLOL.L MOAAAAAO AAAAAAAAAHHHAA
>>7360992>Looks like a throwaway sticker you'd find at a con.My goal is actually to make assets for a game idea I have so I can see where you are coming from. Thank for the compliment.>>7361020>Corset hadingAh yes, I see what you mean. Noted.>HandsThank you, I spent a lot of time on those hands lol glad they came out alright.
Monki
>>7361041dumb permabeg
>>7361077>haha today I will draw a guy in a cool pose>uuuhh this doesn't look right at all fuck..>Ah! I just tell everyone it's supposed to be a monkey! Haha I'm a genius
>>7361081Wow, nice argument you got there bro! Thanks for validating my post! You could have answered with real constructive criticism of my post, but you resulted in simply calling me dumb and a permabeg, therefore telling me that I am right.
>>7361086Lol you're funny dude.I just doodled some lines and tried to make a body out of them, and eventually it turned to this.
What's the bigger problem here, my hand or my eye? I've spent days where I just experiment with different pressures trying to copy a tone per se, but it was ineffective.
>>7360904
warm up after not drawing for 3 days
>>7361090Are you studying from that really blurry jpeg, or do you have a higher quality ref?It seems like you've omitted her ring finger. There is a lump of pixels there that seems like its the finger, but it's actually really hard to tell. I think the biggest problem here is the ref honestly. What's the painting's name?>>7361097How do you do that? This is something I struggle with immensely. Furries are too powerful.
>>7361101Oh my god I was looking at it and thought it was half of somebody's face since the resolution was so low lmao.>>7361090Even with such a shitty reference, you should still be able to break it down. Trying building it up with boxes and cylinders, then detailing it. >What's the bigger problem here, my hand or my eyeYour eye, but man that ref is not lending any favors. Measure.
>>7361101>>7361109Yeah, I was, hence why I committed to using it as a value study instead of copying its lines. Fragonard's *The Love Letter*.
>>7361110>>7361101>>7361109My question(sorry for being so vague) was more how to improve my range of values, because even with using various pencils and trying to practice my pressure it's still so rough.
>>7361101>How do you do that? This is something I struggle with immensely. Furries are too powerful.Construction and guidelines, you need to draw 300 boxes before you even think of drawing furry heads
>>7361113Why not just use the entire painting and put a greyscale filter over it. If your deadset on hands, I'm sure there are better references you can pick. Better yet, why not choose statues like david with his dick out? Or unpainted figurines if your into that.
>>7361101Permabeg.
>>7361116any recommendations on books and shit for construction other than loomis?
>>7361101What do your faces look like?
>>7361132Draw a box.
>>7361133Shit and only this shit when from reference. It's a lot worse when from imagination, especially cartoony/anime faces. I just made this a few hour ago. >>7361020
>>7361142Your art looks familiar and before I even read what you wrote, I could tell you definitely rush your art lol. I totally know that feeling of wanting to crank out as many drawings as possible, but my god, really slow down. Especially when your laying down shading or else it'll just look like shit, then at that point, just don't bother. Being a sketchlet is fine, but your lines never look finished cuz your always putting lines down like your sketching I think so you really never get that practice of drawing nice clean lines. Tbh you can probably get away with just looking at references and imagining/drawing a box in the perspective it's in. No need to rotate gazillion boxes I think. Tbh I think you'd benefit from digital, you'd have the ability to draw over your sketches and refine them without being limited to pencil. Especially for faces, but I only draw anime so what do I know lol. It's just so much easier to move things around in digital yk. Also don't worry about imagination, your pretty creative already aren't you? It's ok to rely on references.
>>7361132Dont listen to that other anonDraw a Box is a scam, the guy who made it sucks at drawingMorpho is good for learning construction in general, but for furries you'll have to study artists you like and figure it out yourself
studies
>>7360967yeah I feel you, there are 2 books I love about color Hornung, David - Color _ a workshop for artists and designersarthur stern - how-to-see-color-and-paint-itThe first gives you tools to understand color relationships in terms of hue, value and saturation, the second is practical but will help you see color better and understand images like yours better.>>7360986Good job anon don't get discorague, don't break the streak! You need to lose your hand, do this with a pen, fineliner, marker, just something unerasable on paper, later you can do it digitally. Sometimes its better to try several times fast, each iteration you will see what you can do better or try ideas. webm is an example of what I do when I try something new and challenging. its 2x speed in reality it took me ~3minhttps://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0TqNldrAbIc
ATTENTION: https://youtu.be/kszLwBaC4SwI just posted artistic genius; what can you get out of his last music video, his last song? The sadness of death, the happiness of a new beginning, the hatred of god or this world? If you could put down his last song onto paper, what would it be?
>>7360665Damn it's like you are picking the ugliest poses imaginable. She looks cute on the other photos but here she looks like she has downs
>>7361039oh you sweet summer child
I cant draw appealingfaces
Show me your face.
>>7361180
>>7361184
Wish i could buy a new drawing tablet but I would drop the hobby again in a few weeks if not days so i have a bumpy old screenless wacom from 2013 that can't draw straight lines...
say hi to Dani(elle)Dare I say, I had fun drawing her and I'm quite happy with it
>>7361029infinite room for improvement but it's very sovl
>>7361093oh fuck I'm digging it
>>7361226TAKYON!
>>7361029good, and the fact that you drew yakuza alone makes you my brother
>>7360345How the hell did you draw over his sketchbook??
why do some authors preach 3d construction and some 2d pure observation or whatever?which approach is better
>>7360495Drawing like any skill is best done on the edge of comfort. If it's outside your scope, you're gonna learn something even if you try not to
>>7361247You do 3D construction and then stack 2D observation on top of it.
>>73612472d is copy route. 3d is construction route
>>7360571>>7360573Work on expressions and this can be a comic. It's the only thing lacking imo. The art is good enough, other than expressions, to be able to move a story along.
>>73612472d is french academy retardation entirely made up in the late 18th century (when the french are at their lowest and poorest) purely based on replicating bargue plates like an NPC. 3d construction is from the Russian Academy (and thusly the Chinese ateliers) based on learnings from Renaissance artists (as continued by Hogarth and Vilppu) that has produced history's best draftsmen and artists.
>>7361247Depends entirely on what your goal is. Trying to construct the world around you teaches you perspective/form. 2d observation is good for learning proportion and gesture. Generally the road map is proportion > gesture > construction/perspective. The logic being very clear when you begin progressing. The thing is, you'd know all of this IF YOU READ THE FUCKING STICKY. IS IT JUST THERE FOR SHOW NOW? FFS. IT BECAME A STICKY BECAUSE THIS TRIED AND TRUE METHOD OF LEARNING THE FUNDIES HAS BEEN REPEATED AD NAUSEUM THROUGHOUT THE CENTURIES.
>>7361257>PrimaryObservation and SightConstruction and FormPerspectiveAnatomy and Gesture>SecondaryValuesColorDesignCompositionDraftsmanship>TertiaryNarrativeStyle
>>7361247Different tools for different problems.
>>7361258This is the exact order, and imo it makes complete sense. You can always learn our of this order, but in this specific order the fundamentals build upon themselves.
>>7360965If you do, try not to get stuck spamming ctrl z. You have to learn to let mistakes goor you're going to hate it
>>7361217sex with danielle
>>7361234Nice try! Decent for a beginner
there is no /int/, you will always be /beg/
>>7360662I have no idea what I'm doingday 4 drawing
>>7361279Thank you! I sometimes mindlessly draw female figures out of boredom, but it was only very recently (yesterday, actually) that I started drawing with the goal of actually improving and getting somewhere.
>>7359769First draft more or less done I'll rework the bottom of the hair and add some accessories where i can.
>>7361287Hatching looks cool either way but where are you going with it?
>>7359755Kinda need some celshading tips. I cannot seem to get the lines to be as sharp or clean as for example, post related.https://x.com/NicolasGravelQC/status/1853114048142868708/photo/1It is me just having shit pulse or should i be using something that isnt lasso tool + sharp eraser
>>7361308>>7361308>>7361308
>>7361306Post your flats. I can show you what you're doing wrong in new thread.
>>7361147>really slow downYeah, that's definitely something I need to work on. I'm trying to do line economy practice and put more thought into every line now. >just looking at referencesI get what you're saying, and of course I'm going to continue using references for the rest of my life, but having a developed "memory" drawing is really my number 1 goal while studying, so that box head rotation is something I'm still going for. >Tbh I think you'd benefit from digitalYeah, I'm all for digital when I can afford it. My paper and erasers are so cheap that even really light lines don't erase. >only draw animeThat's definitely no mark against your skill, I wish I could draw anime-style figures or characters. The only thing I can draw with any decency whatsoever is slightly exaggerated realism. Thanks for the advice and responding
>>7361345>Line economyIs line economy really a thing? Why not just worry about putting down as many pretty lines as possible? Why stress yourself out over constricting the way you draw lines?>developed "memory"; boxed head rotationAren't box rotations more of a iq test though? I could be wrong of course. >My paper and erasers are so cheap that even really light lines don't erase.Don't worry about the lines you can't get rid of. Your practicing, no? Worry about the lines you are putting down. Have you ever watched a mikeymegamega video? He uses a cheap mechanical pencil to sketch then firm up once he's laid down his guidelines. You'd probably benefit from following along it since he almost always explains why he draws the way he does. Even if your lines linger after you erase, focus on your next lines. If you wanna really be unforgiving, sketch lightly with pencil, then go over it in pen and really watch as you can't erase your mistakes.
>>7361368>line economyYeah, its moreso about recognizing the important fundamental lines in a drawing rather than reducing line count, although reducing line count is often a side effect. Watching Villpu draw is a good example of it because every line he puts down is very deliberate. Sometimes I put down lines from observation without putting much thought into it. >box rotationsI mean, I think on IQ tests there is a shape recognition section where you're given a shape and have to recognize what it looks like when rotated, but that doesn't mean it doesn't apply to drawing. Many artists say, and show, that drawing a box in perspective leads to drawing freehand. Watch Kim Jung Gi draw and you'll see what I mean. >Don't worry about the lines you can't get rid ofI didn't say I was worried about them though? It's just that it makes doing finished pieces a lot harder than if I was drawing digitally, which is what you said. The only lines I'm worried about are the ones I thoughtlessly put down, which stems in large part from my rushing. >mikeymegamega Never seen any of his videos, but I'll give them a try. If it's just about drawing over sketch lines, you can see I do that in both pictures posted this thread. Also I'm pretty sure I recognize your art, aren't you the one from lsg who only started drawing like a month ago? I hope you don't take this in an offensive way, but I think you're unironically too "talented" to understand some of my issues lol. Obviously, I'm taking into consideration your advice, but drawing from imagination is a skill that can be trained and is one I plan to train.
>>7361326there you go
>>7361163It's very subjective but I'd like to attempt to answer your question. First, David Bowie appears as David Jones in this music video for his last song, and I'm arguing this because the Biblical allusions within the video appear to assert this. Because we know that the artist read extensively there are likely many references to the death rituals in various cultures but ultimately the Biblical tradition is the decisive one. He appears as a compound David-Goliath figure arguably because he wears a sling, and we might suspect that he has a wound of some kind between his eyes (like Goliath). The three condemned men on the cross also wear slings, suggesting that in a certain way they are also David-Goliath figures from a certain vantage point. A figure appears to strike at the heel of the central man on the cross (the one who will judge the living and the dead), or perhaps he is engaged in the act of supplication. Either way his skull is presented like John the Baptist (because Jones means 'Son of John') to a woman. The dancers psych themselves up for their trip to the underworld, and they're seen on a pyramid attic-barge. Ultimately David Jones appears in the new heaven and the new earth, effectively the new city of David, or the new Jerusalem.He's essentially saying that the video for Blackstar is his Death-Guide, he is David Jones and this is the sum total of his spiritual quest particularly as illness entered his life. The artist is relating himself back to the Creator (who he is in fear of due to his power) but the message appears to be a peaceful one and most of the images in the video should appear fairly straight-forward.>Lord, I kneel and offer youMy word on a wingAnd I'm trying hard to fit amongYour scheme of things
>>7361385Oh my god, are you the guy that did the October challenge in lsg. One of the reasons I was able to improve was because of your comments. Because of that, I was motivated to keep drawing and I've held onto that inspiration ever since. I must apologize as well as it seems from your response that I'm too retarded to be able to articulate my ideas correctly, especially with the way posts work on 4chan. Anyways, forgetting about my retarded post above, although I've only seen a handful of your work, I feel like everytime you draw, it looks like you draw the same way and for about the same amount of time for each piece.
>>7361476>your commentsThat's good. I try to be positive and give advice where I can; I know how rough it is to not get positive criticism. I'm glad something good came of me trying to draw. >articulate my ideasI think your ideas are coming out completely clear for what it's worth, but if you're having difficulty articulating your thoughts, honestly just type in your native language and I'll be able to parse it better with google and a dictionary.>retarded postIt wasn't retarded - you didn't even say anything wrong. It's just that you didn't know some things. And it's fair that you didn't know them because you've likely never had the issues that they seek to address and its probable you never will.>you draw the same wayYeah, this is mostly true, but in the same way as I believe it's mostly true for everyone who draws. Everyone has a process they work with. I'm always trying to improve it though. >same amount of timeNot true. That's probably how it seems due to how low quality my art is, but length definitely varies. For figures, I usually aim for around 10 minutes. I never spend more than an hour (only exception is a barque plate, pic rel, didn't turn out good) on pieces because it would be better just to move on than polish a turd.
>>7361507Ah, I'd like to know then, do you ever attempt the same piece again? And for your figures drawing, do you ever erase them then trace them and see if you can figure out the forms you drew? Also I think its ok to polish a turd every now and then as long as you look at the turd and realize what you did wrong, or have someone tell you.
>>7361520For reference, I recently started doing a mastercopy after realizing I am completely clueless when it comes to taking a piece further beyond the pencil sketch phase. It also showed me how I sometimes don't understand the forms I'm drawing either.
>>7361520>>7361523>do you ever attempt the same piece againIf I'm drawing a "piece" and not just a study, I usually draw it in full once or twice before so the final one will look nicer. I haven't tried to redraw any of my old pieces yet because I'm not much better if at all, so that's just a waste of time. Much better spent doing studies. I'm not like you; I don't improve dramatically from week to week.>figures drawingI really don't even know what you mean by this. No, I've never erased figures and then tried to traced over the lines. I don't really see what that would accomplish. I'm at least pretty competent at seeing the problems in my drawings>polish a turdPolishing a turd would be sitting down and erasing all the sketch marks and making the lines bolder and rendering as well. There is no reason to do any of that if the underlying sketch itself looks bad, that's why its called polishing a turd. The rendering and better line quality make it look better, but if the framework is bad there's no reason to waste time on it UNLESS you're just drawing for fun, then it's totally fine. I'm very cognizant of the issues in pictures I draw.>have someone tell youAs I said earlier to Pawell, I think I can count the number of times someone has responded to me with criticism on one hand. Usually the replies I get are just "ngmi," which aren't wrong. All that aside, I'm going to incorporate what you've said. You're significantly better than I and you've only drawn for a month, so it's either you have it all figured out or you have a real affinity for drawing, probably a bit of both.
>>7361536Ah, by piece I just mean anything you draw. I don't really know art vocab.>No, I've never erased figures and then tried to traced over the lines. I don't really see what that would accomplishFor me at least, digitally, I did lineart for my sketches and realized my forms were too vague and I really had no idea what I was doing. Lineart is pretty much tracing the form you're trying to communicate with your sketch no?>There is no reason to do any of that if the underlying sketch itself looks badI mean yeah, but sketches are just that. They're just a step in the process of art, unless your goal is to make appealing sketches. I do understand that you do only dedicate at most an hour usually though. I'm sorry I've only seen a handful of your work but this is just what I think when only seeing what I have so far.
>>7361471>sling it is technically a sling because it's strapped around their heads, but I mean those bandages or blindfolds with the eyes cut out.
>>7361546>piece You're probably using it right, I just use music vocab because it's whats most familiar to me. >my forms were too vagueI think I see what you're saying now. I've been doing a lot of Michael Hampton lately to try and address this. I work a lot on the lowest level foundation of my art with mannequins and blobs because that's usually where my biggest problems lie. >sketches are just thatSketches don't have to look bad though. And yeah any finished piece starts as a sketch, so that does make it a step, but that doesn't mean the sketch should look bad. Like look from my post here >>7361020 , glaringly, the girl in the middle's neck is too long. That didn't come about in the lineart phase. That happened in the sketch and construction phase, but I only noticed it after I started doing the lines. Since these were timed 10 minute figures, I really just had to live with it and couldn't go back and fix the sketch without probably being unable to finish other things. Maybe it's different on digital where you can move and resize things, but on paper if there's a mistake in the foundation it's pretty awful to go back and fix it. >I'm sorryThere's nothing wrong you've said so far, why apologize? You're right that my art is rushed and you're right that it looks like I haven't improved. I understand that what I make is bad, but I am improving. Like I said, I'm probably on par with or slightly below par with other people who have drawn for ~7 months. The only difference is that I have spent much much more time drawing than they have, so there's some deeper issue I've been trying to address.
>>7361440still having trouble with faces and hair?
>>7361570Oh my god, I just realized, your drawing 10 minute figures plus lining them, and your noticing the mistakes. Literally because your doing trad and refusing to go back and fix it, your figures keep the mistakes. You would be so busted on digital cuz you could just lasso shit and make quick corrections. I think you'd get crazy gains by making it a habbit of making corrections. Personally, I've done quite a bit if work with a pencil and sticky notes (that's all the paper I got lol) and I love doing untimed observation studies of random shit like screenshots from anime and artwork i like. I think you would benefit from doing untimed stuff like that. You obviously know what your doing wrong, but your too hung up on proportions on what is an especially difficult excercise imo (full body is hard as shit!!!) What you don't see is that I sketch one pose for hours cuz i keep fixing it trying to make it right. If you absolutely cant figure it it out then move on and ask for help. Your too hard on yourself!!! Do some observation studies and make corrections. Trad is hard as shit and bothersome but I feel like you can certainly do better.
>>7361625kinda, trying to more than just simple frowns and smiles, but i gues i still down really get the logic of where everyting should be, and how big the lower face should become when she opens her mouth. (pixrel is what i had going before.)whats wrong about the hair tho? T-T
>>7361669>refusing to go back and fix it>making it a habit of making correctionsYeah, those are both things I do now when doing untimed studies, as soon as I notice a mistake I go back and fix it. I do it on timed exercises too, but sometimes it's too big to correct and I just need to work around it. >digitalI do think digital would definitely help my art out, but I can't afford it and likely won't be able to til sometime next year, so I'm just gonna have to really try and perfect the foundations. >too hung up on proportionsI see proportions as one of the most important parts of drawing a person honestly, more important than anatomy at least. I think the only thing more important is perspective. >sketch one pose for hoursI hope it didn't seem like I was saying you were just pure talent and didn't work hard. I know you put a lot of time and work into drawing. >you can certainly do betterI certainly can, just judging by how fast others improve. I'll try to draw some more from things I like and make mistakes as they crop up, hopefully that will iron out a lot of the sloppy marks I make. Thanks for all the advice and words of encouragement; I'll try to make use of them as much as I can.
>>7361684I didn't think you were demeaning my hard work, I think I was more projecting and comparing your 10 minute figures to my 5 hour sketch lol. And yes proportions are very important, I just wanted to reiterate that you absolutely notice the errors in proportions and that you should go back and fix it even if it's been some time later. Your a great artist and im a fan. I can't wait to see yourself unrestricted.
>>7361674Her far eye is way too small and you keep repeating the same size "spike" shape in the bangs which makes them look repetitive and monotonous. Always have a big shape surrounded adjacent by medium or small shapes and never have the same size shape adjacent to each other. You keep spamming the same small sized shapes repeatedly.
>>7361674
Doodling
>>7361738Mmm, you're right. Do you mean them ending in spikes or that all spikes look way too similar?>>7361881Thanks. Really should just use these as a general face reference until i just get the feeling for it.
