[a / b / c / d / e / f / g / gif / h / hr / k / m / o / p / r / s / t / u / v / vg / vm / vmg / vr / vrpg / vst / w / wg] [i / ic] [r9k / s4s / vip] [cm / hm / lgbt / y] [3 / aco / adv / an / bant / biz / cgl / ck / co / diy / fa / fit / gd / hc / his / int / jp / lit / mlp / mu / n / news / out / po / pol / pw / qst / sci / soc / sp / tg / toy / trv / tv / vp / vt / wsg / wsr / x / xs] [Settings] [Search] [Mobile] [Home]
Board
Settings Mobile Home
/lit/ - Literature

Name
Spoiler?[]
Options
Subject
Comment
Verification
4chan Pass users can bypass this verification. [Learn More] [Login]
File[]
  • Please read the Rules and FAQ before posting.

08/21/20New boards added: /vrpg/, /vmg/, /vst/ and /vm/
05/04/17New trial board added: /bant/ - International/Random
10/04/16New board for 4chan Pass users: /vip/ - Very Important Posts
[Hide] [Show All]


[Advertise on 4chan]

[Catalog] [Archive]

File: IMG_0541.jpg (298 KB, 550x806)
298 KB
298 KB JPG
Talk about poems/poets you like, post your own work, and critique others.
105 replies and 25 images omitted. Click here to view.
>>
You guys ever ask AI to generate images based on your poems?
>>
In the snow
Out in the cold
I pet a giant glowing cat
Also I am a ghost
>>
>>24951252
Are you a vogon?
>>
>>24968952
no - something even more vital. i work in marketing.
>>
>>24966381
How exactly do you expect to appreciate the poetry in other languages without speaking them?

File: neetzuh.jpg (150 KB, 1164x1242)
150 KB
150 KB JPG
The bulk of western fantasy (yes even today) is based on Christian philosophy, or its bastard child humanism. Good and evil, sin and redemption, sacrifice, justice, moral character arcs, etc.
The remaining works that aren't, are largely based on some flavor of nihilism or existentialism.

There's nothing wrong with this, but I want something fresh. Off the top of my head the only western fantasy series that isn't really based on the above is the Earthsea series.
13 replies and 1 image omitted. Click here to view.
>>
>>24972402
Fantasy fiction is more than a series of cliches like monsters and magic swords, it's a distinct genre with its own history and rules. People writing fantasy fiction aren't creating something new, they're working within a genre that was created by writers like Eddison and Tolkien. Using "fantasy" descriptively ignores that. Norman Mailer wasn't writing fantasy when he wrote Ancient Evenings, but it still has a lot of fantastical elements. Same with Borges - it's schlock on the level of lowbrow fantasy, but he and most of the world thought he was writing literary fiction.
Also fantasy writers know that they're essentially playing make believe. Homer believed in Poseidon, the Greeks had shrines to Odysseus and believed that they could visit the island that Circe or the Cyclops once lived on. It was real to them, but Middle Earth was never real to Tolkien and even less real to any author who wrote fantasy to make a buck.
>>
>>24972441
I see, but OP asked for fantasy outside of those of the crypto-christian and nihilistic variety. Odysseus might have been real to Homer, but he isn't real to OP, hence why I thought he might be able to appreciate the Odissey as one would appreciate fantasy fiction. I don't necessarily agree with your assessment of fantasy fiction, I think the original meaning was closer to what we today might call "fantastical literature" and that got lost to time due to the popularization of Tolkien and his derivatives.
>>
>>24972214
There's other famous examples of heroes like Beowulf and Achilles
>>
>>24972027
King of Dragon Pass
>>
>>24972027
>existentialism
Can you give some examples?

File: 1766355992844610.jpg (21 KB, 214x306)
21 KB
21 KB JPG
Spooky Psychic Vampires Edition

>Old:
>>24957211

>Recommended reading charts (Look here before asking for vague recs):
https://mega.nz/folder/kj5hWI6J#0cyw0-ZdvZKOJW3fPI6RfQ/folder/4rAmSZxb

>Archive:
https://warosu.org/lit/?task=search2&search_subject=sffg

>Goodreads:
https://www.goodreads.com/group/show/1029811-sffg
197 replies and 40 images omitted. Click here to view.
>>
i been doing some light & cursory reading on insurgency in Vietnam, Iraq and Afghanistan and the guerilla warfare and the tactics they employed were absolutely brilliant!! such an embarrassment for the greatest military power in the world...

anyway, got any recs for military sf or fantasy that deals specifically with militant uprisings and/or guerilla warfare?
>>
>>24968728
There's something about his books I loathe. It's like reading technical manuals. It never actually feels like a novel.
>>
File: IMG-20140221-WA0051.jpg (36 KB, 576x576)
36 KB
36 KB JPG
>>24971819
The classics will always be the best choice.
>>
File: 1742116042533686.png (636 KB, 620x1000)
636 KB
636 KB PNG
I'm almost a third way through The Bonehunters now.
I don't really like it, probably the worst Malazan for me so far, a third of the way into the book that is I hope it gets better.
>>
>>24972584
>the greatest military power in the world
>has never won a war

File: 1742838327388615.jpg (1.8 MB, 4361x2768)
1.8 MB
1.8 MB JPG
ruins edition

FAQ:
>What is worldbuilding?
Worldbuilding is the process of creating entire fictional worlds from scratch, all while considering the logistics of these worlds to make them as believable as possible. Worldbuilding asks questions about the setting of a world, and then answers them, often in great detail. Most people use it as a means of creating a setting or the scenery for a story.
>"Isn't there a Worldbuilding general in >>>/tg/ already?"
Yes, there is. However, that general is focused on the creation of fictional worlds for the intended purpose of playing TTRPG campaigns. Here you can discuss worldbuilding projects that are not meant to be used for a roleplaying setting, but for novels, videogames, or any other kind of creative project.
>"Can I discuss the setting of my campaign here, though?"
If you want to, but it would probably be better to discuss it on >>>/tg/ . We don't allow the discussion of TTRPG mechanics, however. If you want to discuss stats or which D&D edition is best, this is not the place.
>"Can I talk about an existing fictional setting that is not mine?"
Yes, of course you can!
>"Does worldbuilding need to be about fantasy and elves?"
Worldbuilding, as already stated above, and contrary to what many believe, does not inherently imply blatantly copying Tolkien. In fact, there are many science-fiction setting out there, and even entire alternative history settings which do not possess supernatural elements at all. Any kind of science fiction book has an implied setting at least, which involves a certain degree of worldbuilding put into it.

Old thread: >>24868365
15 replies and 5 images omitted. Click here to view.
>>
File: worldbuilding flow.png (287 KB, 595x499)
287 KB
287 KB PNG
>>
>>24971965
Something like that should be highly dependent on the rest of the setting.

Like if I started describing wuxia style temples with cultivation as a center piece of the culture and influences but you are writing a urban fantasy set in the near future my input would be useless.

I say decide what fits your setting then look at real world architecture for inspiration.
It's simple, relatively quick, and works unless your world is very weird. In which case use other inspiration, like natural forms or artwork that hits a similar vibe you are going for.
>>
>>24970041
>What's theatre like in your setting? Are there any great acting troupes performing the equivalent of Shakespeare?
No because I don't feel like writing that shit and theater kids always annoyed me as a kid as brown nosing attention whores who would do literally anything for external validation.
The fuck does this question have to do with the rest?
>>
File: Atlantis .jpg (108 KB, 720x900)
108 KB
108 KB JPG
>>24970029
What do you have to consider when including entire lost civilizations like Atlantis? And what such civilizations have you already made?
>>
>>24972646
>What do you have to consider when including entire lost civilizations like Atlantis?
Depends on the project, especially it's scope.
Could be inconsquential if you are mainly doing tight pulp style short stories that happen to be set in the same general setting.
Or it could be of extremely vital importance to every single aspect of every major point and character that have ripple effects on all aspects of the world.

It is really too general of a question to answer coherently without directly referencing a complete work.
It also is only really important to ask if it actually comes up in your story or project you are actively working on.

Overly broad questions deserve overly broad answers.

sansa edition

ASOIAF wiki: https://awoiaf.westeros.org/index.php/Main_Page
Blog: https://georgerrmartin.com/notablog/
Old blog: https://grrm.livejournal.com/
So Spake Martin (interviews): https://westeros.org/citadel/ssm/
Book search: https://asearchoficeandfire.com/
SSM search: https://cse.google.com/cse?cx=006888510641072775866:vm4n1jrzsdy
General search: http://searcherr.work/
TWOW samples: https://archive.org/details/411440566-the-winds-of-winter-released-chapters

old: >>24922194
264 replies and 67 images omitted. Click here to view.
>>
>>24949686
>>
I once saw a suggestion that fire wights were dark souls undead. Instead of being bound to Winter and the great other, they fuel their immortality with themselves. Life, memory, emotion. All of it is fuel for the fire. I rather liked that. Any ideas on other forms of immortality in the series? The current Hightower lord probably bound his life to a glass candle, and I expect it's possible to bind becoming unaging into kingship.
>>
File: 45544.png (1.02 MB, 791x687)
1.02 MB
1.02 MB PNG
This official map from "World of Ice and Fire" it os so shit, it doesn't even make Whispering Woods near Riverrun.
>>
'My dragons have two legs because real life birds don't have four.'

FIREWYRMS AND WYVERNS AND BASILISKS DON'T EXIST IN REAL LIFE EITHER YOU OLD CUNT. SHOW ME THE TAX CODE YOU BRAG ABOUT. SHOW ME WHERE ALL THE WOOD COMES FROM, GEORGE. WHERE'S ALL THE WINTER WOOD? WHY DO WE STILL HAVE FORESTS?
>>
>>24972620
that one jon dream implies it's possible to simultaneously be a fire and ice wight

Any book recommendations that are similar to this
147 replies and 17 images omitted. Click here to view.
>>
Bump
>>
>>24970952
Muslim women are sold as prostitutes by their fathers to be fuckslaves for africans and hindus. Who are you trying to fool?
>>
>>24971495
>Hindus

Lmao pajeet claws are just writing fan fiction here, India will be majority Muslim and indians are literally whipped to death in the Gulf states, in sha Allah
>>
>>24971549
Jeets are poo people but even they mog desert rats. You're bitches for BIC
>>
>>24971586
Nigga just typing stuff

Nietzsche ruined an entire generation of atheists
>>
Twitter told me he's the most misunderstood philosopher

File: IMG_0585.jpg (23 KB, 379x527)
23 KB
23 KB JPG
Why are French/Belgian comics considered literature but american comics and manga aren’t?
16 replies and 6 images omitted. Click here to view.
>>
>>24972549
> There is thought to theme, structure, plot, story (different from plot), character, and even the prose (of dialogues, thoughts, narration) that cannot be found in the equivalent of other countries.
I honestly I think this simply is it. The French treat it as a serious art. Japanese and Americans treat it as entertainment.
>>
>>24972456
Is Tintin really about the inner world of the characters at a significant length?
>>
>>24972573
Is it not?
I thought it was like those early Disney movies, where there were cryptic stuff for the mature audience, but they can also be enjoyed by a child.
>>
File: 17.jpg (1.85 MB, 1920x2539)
1.85 MB
1.85 MB JPG
>>24972563
>The French treat it as a serious art. Japanese and Americans treat it as entertainment.
i swear to god literally none of you retards have looked at french comics ever. they're specifically entertainment. they're all comedies, horrors, westerns, fantasy sagas. they are mass entertainment, consumed the way you'd buy a tom clancy paperback at the airport. even the famous respected creators like moebius primarily worked in entertainment genres.

the difference is that american comics got hit by extreme censorship back in the day, so they pivoted towards costumed heroes and ended up for decades as a marginal medium aimed at children. meanwhile the french market had no such limitation so an adult could go buy a comic about gangsters or something with a little bit of blood and nudity in it and it would be seen as the same kind of activity as going to the movies, not something particularly childish or nerdy. that's it, that's the difference. it's just a normal medium like tv or movies. it's not any more "serious" than netflix, it's just not actively stigmatized.
>>
>>24972558
>>24972560
God you are so full of shit.
Are you actually French by chance?

File: Untitled.jpg (175 KB, 854x510)
175 KB
175 KB JPG
I know this isn't /pol/, but as a board for people interested in literature, academics, and perhaps aspiring to join those fields themselves, this article was quite sobering. I don't know how someone could come away from reading this and not conclude something is deeply broken, and that young white men are actually responding rationally to discrimination.
71 replies and 6 images omitted. Click here to view.
>>
>>24972208
I have been thinking about this recently. What is the critical mass of female participation until something become "female coded". Academia has become female-coded, so even if a man wins at academia, he is winning a girls game, so what the point. Same with white/brown participation. This might sound left field, but take fashion. Slacks and a collared shit used to be considered a professional look. Now everyone in the third world dresses like that, so now its a law status look.
>>
>>24972623
It's low. I would say once 4/10 of professionals in any field are women, it begins to lose its prestige.
Law is next. Rather, law is already for women because the majority of graduates are women.
>>
>>24972282
You have it backwards. For Whites, it was Right makes Might. Humans demand a moral idealism first, before they can act. Its like how a person needs an artistic vision before they can create the art. Might Makes Right is just animals lashing out, which is what you are seeing from non-whites. Its the eternal battle between civilization and barbarism.
>>
>>24972623
Perhaps it would be wise to value things for what they are instead of playing silly status games. I don't particularly like my leather jacket less just because psychopaths like Moldbug and greedy fucks like Jensen Huang like to wear one too.
>>
>>24972625
>>24972631
I agree. And I think the silly status games are a big problem. but it is something I swear I have been observing.

I think it points to a larger problem for WM. They lack a clear ideal that they are attempting to accomplish. If they had that ideal of, say, citizenry and civilization, and they knew that is what they were working towards, then sill status games would disappear. They would take the pathways and opportunities available to work towards those larger things.

Here is my sad attempt at an analogy. It would be safe to say that, for a long time, right-wing politics was just anti-left politics. The left had an idea and vision what they were attempting to accomplish, and the right just automatically took the contrary positions, regardless of what they actually were. WM, especially YWM, seem to be doing the same thing in society. They lack a vision for themselves and their communities (and their positions in those communities), so they are just drifting in contrarianism.

And as I write this, the online culture of looking to the past may confirm this. The whole vaporwave aesthetic. The early "art of manliness" manosphere may have been a very early intuitive reaction to a lack of an ideal.

And nothing beats a good leather jacket.

File: 1736365868174.jpg (12 KB, 225x225)
12 KB
12 KB JPG
A lot of trouble in fairy tails would have been avoided if, as soon as the ugly person with black hair appeared, the blonde haired people just killed them.
>>
Shut yo bitch ass up nigga
>>
>a lot
Ok, name five.

File: bombadil-1256374125.jpg (430 KB, 1300x969)
430 KB
430 KB JPG
>Sings Songs
>Is a completely unknown race
>Has a fairy wife
>Can hold a demonic ring and shrink it
>He doesn't give af
>Doesn't fit in the story
>Defies logic

Is he Eru Illuvatar or Tolkien taking the piss? whatever he is reminds me of a Leprechaun that's based
97 replies and 10 images omitted. Click here to view.
>>
>>24970406
weren't they the spiders of mirkwood in the hobbit?
Didn't Beren also encounter Ungoliants children on his adventures before meeting Luthien?
>>
>>24958855
>>24963771
>or the tentacled lake-monster
Naturally, when Ainur were sing-songing the world into existence, Iluvatar had sneaked in "For He's a Jolly Good Fellow" somewhere on his sheets of music, while tentacled thing was most lokely Melkor's creation of his avantgarde prog experimental folk.
>>
>>24963742
What would the point of book one be if there wasn't something unexpected and jarring
>>
>>24958877
>sneaked
it's a strong verb, you tard

>>24960077
>the roots of the Earth being "gnawed by nameless things".
clearly analogus to the dragon and the world tree in Norse myth
>>
>>24967158
Probably not. Clark Ashton Smith was very much the dilettante of the bunch and none of his fiction or poetry has the epic qualities of Howard. Tolkien probably liked REH because the Nordic bards would have also enjoyed reading Conan the Barbarian.

File: raining.jpg (2.27 MB, 3840x2400)
2.27 MB
2.27 MB JPG
English is such a shit language. For me the nail in the coffin for English was when I learned that the problem of ambiguity between argument and explanation, where all you have to disambiguate is context, which they talk about in logic books, is not something which is universal in logic, but rather is a problem of English. Other languages don't have this problem. English is a low IQ language. All it's good for is dumbing down the masses.
91 replies and 12 images omitted. Click here to view.
>>
>>24970466
And you also didn't click my link, which says:

>Romanian 24 weeks
>French 30 weeks
>German 36 weeks
for an English speaker to reach the same level

This is Foreign Service Institute data.

You have more cognates in German, but the grammar is harder to learn and that cancels out the cognates, making German overall more difficult for an English speaker, making it take more time to reach the same level of proficiency. French is easier to learn than German.
>>
>>24965277
>>24966373
>english is such an illogical, unclear language that all anglo philosophers have to become hyper autistic analytics to compensate.
>french and german are so clear that continental philosphers have to become hyper-obscurantists to compensate
>>
>>24969937
>I'm too retarded to appreciate that a native speaker's intuition invalidates the obsessive, hyper-autistic nonsense I've been seething over, so here is my attempt to mock someone else's opinion.
>>
>>24966491

Only ELS thirdies are concerned with the author's "intent". In fact, it is integral to literacy as such to mind, or even to enforce, the distance between what the text actually says and what the author is supposed to have "meant".
>>
>>24972598
hard disagree.
Actually I think you cannot separate art from artist. At the same time I think English allows you a better way of knowing him. Almost intuitively rather than logically.

File: plato.jpg (240 KB, 1280x720)
240 KB
240 KB JPG
For me its to power through the entirety of pic related and finish The Bible by 2027
13 replies omitted. Click here to view.
>>
>>24968307
I think Im gonna buy this when my next paycheck comes
Thanks for the idea
>>
I'm planning to improve my Russian literacy and finally embark on reading 20th-21st century Russian literature masterpieces (Master and Margarita, Doctor Zhivago, Day of the Oprichnik).
Also I may need to finish Bonjour tristesse before new year's eve, though recently I'm not in the right mood to read such a novel.
>>
>>24969038
>Start writing
Ehh don't do that, thanks.
>>
Going to finish reading all of Lovecraft. I’ve been posting my readings on YouTube to keep me accountable with my friends. I have a really bad habit of skimming when I read, so doing audio recordings means I have to make sure I don’t skip any words. Plus, it’s some nice pocket change. If I finish Lovecraft, I’ll move onto Poe, Bierce, Chambers…if I get to a million subs, I will do a full audiobook of Moby Dick.
>>
>>24968307
Finish reading an anatomy book I bought last year and 'law for laymen' book I bought a few months back.

File: 1736378575428528.png (1.8 MB, 1100x2497)
1.8 MB
1.8 MB PNG
It's that time of year again!
Vote for which books you wish to see on this year's top 100 chart. You can vote for as many books as you want. If there are any books not on the list that you wish to vote for, request the author and title ITT and they will be added. Responses can be changed after submitting.
Voting closes on the New Year, after which will be the tiebreaker poll. To prevent spamming, a Google account is required to vote, but will not be collected or stored.
Vote here:
https://forms.gle/LqHa5xS1q5CVikem6
282 replies and 19 images omitted. Click here to view.
>>
>>24970579
>>24970533
Kek
>>
>>24971048
Added
>the list should have included MUCH more non fiction books like scientific treaties
Added Hippocrates, Galen, Archimedes, Ptolemy, Copernicus, William Harvey, William James, Freud, Einstein, Keynes, Alfred Marshall, and Henry George.
>>
>>24962296
Why Joseph Smith? That's not the claim
>>
Can you add The Stand by Stephen King?
>>
>>24951578
Jane Jacobs - The Death and Life of Great American Cities
Hesiod - Works and Days

File: 5.jpg (258 KB, 820x864)
258 KB
258 KB JPG
Give it to me straight. How bad is it out there for fantasy authors that don't write for women?

I love writing, but I think I would be depressed if I spent 5+ years writing a series if only 13 people bother to read it.
3 replies and 1 image omitted. Click here to view.
>>
>>24972061
You wouldn't even be able to write a story for men either.
>>
>>24972093

I can tell they’re not a serious write because they love it. A good writer hates writing.
>>
>>24972088
>they’re looking for “historically underrepresented voices”
even this is only if you deliver the message they want
>>
Writing is a hard game no matter who or what you are Writing for.
The market is hyper saturated and it's difficult to get or maintain attention even if you are very good.
Marketing is a totally different skill set to writing and extremely few are good at both.

My advice would be to write shorter works, polish them well, then put them out and see what gains a audience. Once you have found a audience write more substantial works for that audience. Eventually you will get a small but dedicated fanbase that you can count on to show up and read your epic fantasy series, or whatever big project you long to create.

That said don't expect it to pay the bills. Only a microscopic fraction of the top 1 % of writers earn their primary income from writing. Think of it as a hobby or way of expressing your self. That way you won't be frustrated that money never seems to roll in.
>>
>>24972088
>>24972061
If this is such a big problem in the US, why don't you guys just pretend to be women or minorities? It can't be that hard


[Advertise on 4chan]

Delete Post: [File Only] Style:
[1] [2] [3] [4] [5] [6] [7] [8] [9] [10]
[1] [2] [3] [4] [5] [6] [7] [8] [9] [10]
[Disable Mobile View / Use Desktop Site]

[Enable Mobile View / Use Mobile Site]

All trademarks and copyrights on this page are owned by their respective parties. Images uploaded are the responsibility of the Poster. Comments are owned by the Poster.