>combat is worse than both bg2 and divinity 2>somehow its way more popular than bothI don't get it.
it's the sex scenes
>>3652526>RTwP>DOS2 Armor SystemYuck
>>3652526i think bg3 has better combat than any ie or other larian games, but combat has nothing to do with its popularity. right place, right time, and production values are the thing, exactly like witcher 3.
>>3652531>bg3 has better combat than any iesure, although that's a low bar to pass
>>3652529>>RTwPObjectively better than turn-based.
Combat was fine.
There's plenty of things to criticize about BG3, but I don't think that the combat is one of them. Likewise, I love BG2, but combat is not its strongest point.
>>3652526Your problem is in trying to understand why a thing is popular. That's like trying to understand why someone won the lottery. There's no secret in the numbers. Sometimes people get lucky, that's all there is to it.
>>3652583>Your problem is in trying to understand why a thing is popularIt's popular because it's a dating sim with good graphics, anon
>>3652526Casuals and normies don't care about that. They just care about playing an RPG for 10-20 hours total a little after work for a week or two.And by "playing RPG" I mean make their character, fumble around with the early quests and start some romances. That's it.I would even wager that's how most people on this board play RPGs.
>>3652568Only an actual retard would think this
>>3652602Only a retard thinks rtwp or turn based are objectively superior always. It always comes down to execution.It's also a fact that most games with turn-based combat has dogshit combat, including BG3. Retards are just more forgiving of shit when it comes to turn based because they don't have to overwork their brains.
>>3652602Turn-based is always too easy.
>>3652526Because just like BG2 it's more of a package deal.
>>3652586This. If game is medicore or plain shit you just glue up as much cimbait as you cn and try to sell it as "daring". Happened to television decades ago
>>3652526you can fuck a bear.
>>3652526>combat is best in genere >anon have no brain and must shitpost Many such cases
>>3652604As opposed to RTWP where you just order your guys to attack the enemies after buffing for 5 minutes and then just sit and watch?Just admit you have shit taste
>>3652528You mean the grand total of 10 minutes of sex and romance content in the 120 hour long campaign?
>>3652526>I don't get it.It is hard to grasp that other people view and value things differently from me. Like, are they stupid?
>>3652626>As opposed to RTWP where you just order your guys to attack the enemies after buffing for 5 minutes and then just sit and watch?You're whining about things which boild down to execution. Example, you whine about pre-buffing when games with turn-based combat has allowed for it.Also, if you don't like to "sit and watch" then turn based is by far the worst offender of that, since almost all of them force you to watch individual allied and enemy units take their turns one after the other. It's so bad it's even one of the reasons why turn based combat tends to involve so few controllable and enemy units, because combat otherwise takes too long and you spend so much time watching units just moving one by one.
>>3652626If they don't get stuck because of shit pathfinding. RTWP is objectively garbage for any games with more than one character to control.
>>3652711>You're whining about things which boild down to execution.You keep using that word without any understand what it means.>Example, you whine about pre-buffing when games with turn-based combat has allowed for it.Think very carefully why buffing in a turn based system is different to real time. Hint, it the word turn.>Also, if you don't like to "sit and watch" then turn based is by far the worst offender of that, since almost all of them force you to watch individual allied and enemy units take their turns one after the otherIn tbs games you can speed up animation while in rtwp you can't. >turn based combat tends to involve so few controllable and enemy unitsWtf are you talking about? Most turn based games have double the amount of controllable party members and enemies because rtwp pathfinding makes it impossible to properly have a large amount of enemies/controllable characters.
>>3652627NTA but yes, exactly. Most players for the game because of these thing.Most of what you see people commenting around BG3 is how astarion is sexy, about shadowheart pubic hair, how they want to fuck the froggy waifu, about the bizarre octopus sex etc. So yes, It i popular because It is a dating sim in fantasy land.Have you ever seen anyone here make a thread, no, replying in a thread without being prompted about how memorable a Dungeon was in this game? Or a Boss fight? Or about an interesting build they came up with?I havent. And I spend more time than I find appropriate n here.
>>3652721>Have you ever seen anyone here make a thread, no, replying in a thread without being prompted about how memorable a Dungeon was in this game? Or a Boss fight? Or about an interesting build they came up with?If you were actually alive during bg2 era you would know the majority of praise was the characters and romance and none of the gameplay. Normies do not play rpg for anything except story/romance, gameplay is a inconvenience to them. This has been the norm for decades.
>>3652724What a smart boy you are!! Thats exactly my pointAnd did I even mention BG2? Niggas here will try to say things that have barely anything to do with the point being made just to sound smartIm Just answering OPs question and replying to the guy that tried to dismiss someone else's point because he very correctly mentioned that romance and sex scenes are what made BG3 more popular that the other two games.
>>3652721Yeah, characters leave more of an impression than dungeons. You have to be a robot not to understand that.
>>3652714>You keep using that word without any understand what it means.You're the deranged monkey that doesn't understand that 95% of what makes something good or not is all down to execution. How it's actually designed, implemented, balanced, what the sfx, vfx, etc are and yada yada.Meanwhile you try and make the case of a fucking retard of blanket statements like>murrrrrrrr turn based is always better than rtwp *drooling on the table*If you can't even comprehend that execution is the defining factor you're not even worth replying too. Because you're factually too braindead to educate.But who am I kidding, you're an ignorant, mentally immature shitposter.
>>3652726Sure, but should they? There are plenty of great popular games out there that are remembered and praised for things other than their characters.
>>3652526>different people like different things>"I don't get it"That's why people call you autistic, retardbro.
>>3652727So no arguments other than yelling about "MUH EXECUTION!!!!!!!".Pro tip, my points were about gameplay, which is tied to execution you glue eating retard.
>>3652728>Sure, but should they?Yes. It's a sign the characters weren't awful or non-existent.People like talking about things they enjoy, especially if others enjoy it too. Enjoying characters is something they share and have in common, often enough.Now, people enjoying and talking about characters doesn't mean the other things are irrelevant.You could complain about discussions being superficial, if you care enough to do that.
>>3652733I explained to you what "execution" means for your clearly ignorant mind. You now clearly disregarded all of it because you're a close-minded monkey that can't handle being wrong.Turn-based is not inherently better than RtwP, end of story. It all comes down to how it's executed. The end result.The end result can different to such extremes that whatever drivel is clogging up your shit filled mind is irrelevant.You're a mentally immature toddler that have already decided that you hate RtwP and love turn-based. You outright admit to being a retard.
>>3652737>I explained to you what "execution" means for your clearly ignorant mind. You now clearly disregarded all of it because you're a close-minded monkey that can't handle being wrong.So basically, you have a made up definition of something and don't understand you can't argue using said definition.> It all comes down to how it's executed. The end result.The end result sucks as my arguments have shown. Or is there a magical RTWP game with perfect pathfinding and ability to skip animations? >The end result can different to such extremes that whatever drivel is clogging up your shit filled mind is irrelevant.I am sure this sounded great in your head.>You're a mentally immature toddler that have already decided that you hate RtwP and love turn-based. You outright admit to being a retard.Or maybe, i am a person who played both types of games and prefer tbs. I can bitch about Temple of elemental evil flaws all day, but the combat alone is generations above the garbage in BG and Neverwinter.
>>3652526Graphics and the dating sim.
>>3652724> If you were actually alive during bg2 era you would know the majority of praise was the characters and romance and none of the gameplay. Normies do not play rpg for anything except story/romance1. Normies weren’t playing RPGs in the late 90s. Hell, normies weren’t really playing PC games in the late 90s at all, it was still just nerds.2. BG2 was praised when it came out because it was an epic adventure, a continuation of the popular BG1, and a fun campaign to play through. And Irenicus’ VA gave a memorable performance. I don’t recall anyone praising it for the romance.May I ask what year you first played BG2 in, and how old you were at the time? This sounds rather anachronistic to me.>t. played it when it came out
>>3652736I dont think its a great thing that RPGs are being played more for their quirky characters than for their effective gameplay.And yes discussions are superficial, but that is expected, they illustrate that in current year the whole enjoyment of RPGs is superficial.
>>3652779Yes that is very demeaning to RPGs and we as gamers need to be betterIt's 2024 y'all
>>3652778t. normalfag who got into RPGs in the 90s
>>3652732Ai generated post.
>>3652779>And yes discussions are superficial, but that is expected, they illustrate that in current year the whole enjoyment of RPGs is superficial.>>3652043>>3650071>>3649087There are so many that I can't even link half of them without being marked as spam. Like the board is so bad I cannot even discuss it without being filtered. I will link the rest later.This is all the first page and it's all fairly obvious all of these threads have been bumped by the same person in a very lazy manner. The reason rpg discussion is superficial is because it's actively enforced to be that way and a focus effort is being made to disrupt and slide discussion. There have been plenty of serious discussions regarding BG3 and it's many merits. The people who have played that game have moved on now. You can see in the OP here >>3652526 that this is a low effort post with no supporting arguments and a random screenshot pulled off Google. This is obviously not an appropriate thread for serious discussion and yet it will be bumped infinitely. This is because these threads are about controlling real estate and pushing a narrative. You don't have anything intelligent to say about BG3 and you never will. You overvalue what little intelligence you have and you will never contribute anything of value to this place, where that is a tooth pick sized hurdle to clear, let alone society at large. There is no reason to continue this thread, nor 90% of the threads on this board at this point. Now make a thread asking what the best rpgs on the Wonderswan Color are.
>>3652807>I will link the rest later.Here's more.>>3649734>>3648450>>3646121>>3647712All of these are off topic attempts to keep discussion as braindead as possible.
>>3652808Oh and we're not done yet.>>3647346>>3649664>>3647423>>3647023You can't complain about discussion being superficial when things are artificially being kept this way. And no, hiding it won't make it go away. Any statement you make about the quality of current rpgs will be dishonest and one sided until this behavior stops.
>>3652526it's turn based, that makes it a billion times better than bg2
>>3652602there has been some contrarian revisionism lately on /v/ and it's spreading here it seemsever since bg3 came out, turn based is now bad and rtwp is le good
>>3652526The most wrong opinion I've read all day.
>>3652814It's one very mentally ill person.
>>3652779no, having believable and fun characters to interact with does add to an RPG and that doesn't make the game shittier or fakei want to be immersed in the world, and having good characters helps with thatrpgs are not just spreadsheet simulators, this should be reserved for higher difficulty gameplayat their core they are for roleplaying, the main point of the game should always be roleplaying
>>3652807>The people who have played that game have moved on now.You’re still here arguing about it every single day, though.
>>3652817Roleplaying is the spread sheet. RPGs are about assuming the role of a character and that means working within their limitations. This is a shitpost spam thread made by a retard.
>>3652818I don't constantly make threads about it. I don't spend years arbitrarily trying to make people say witcher 3 is good or whatever. If you didn't make these awful threads every day there would be no threads on BG3. This is why you are a dogshit and I am not. Your life is not valuable and your posts reflect how worthless you are. You can't just spam BG3 is bad every day until people grow tired of responding to you. That does not change reality. Every time you have to make a new thread complaining about BG3 that is just yet another concession to how utterly wrong you are, otherwise 1 would have been enough.
>>3652817It's weird how people/devs can't grasp the importance of character interactions in RPGs. What do the most popular RPGs have in common?>BG3 went mainstream popular like mass effect back in the day>hmm must be the numbers? Turn based combat maybe??
>>3652841Don't reply to yourself
>>3652842Aww, are you disappointed I didn't respond to your little schizo tantrum? Shut the fuck up.
>>3652844Give Moeblob a break. He's been having a hard time since Kamala lost
>>3652844>>3652845Still doing it
Why is the /pol/ tard that spams this board constantly such a pussy? I don't think he even plays rpgs.
>>3652850Erm, what the sigma?
>>3652845Are you here to talk about rpgs or gaslight about politics while trying to push your normal tard game of choice?
>>3652857It's the same routine every day.
>>365280710 threads does seem like overkill.
>>3652798AIs can't call you retard, retard.
>>3652857>>3652860Shhhhh. It's okay, little guys. I know you're scared, angry and confused, but I promise, we'll get through this together
>>3652814nah, that fight is p. old, though i think the broken english dude here using it has no actual beliefs or opinions of his own and just wants attention
>>3652807>>3652808>>3652811>hiding it won't make it go awaycrying about it won't make it go away either, nothing will, but now that dude is like "hell yeah, i'm getting to this twerp, i'm le master troll manipulating this board". i don't see but one of these threads in the catalog and no reaction is given by me to them.
>>3652877Don't you have like 90 threads hidden? Seems retarded. What will you do when it's 100% of the board hidden?
There is a concerted effort to turn this place into /v/. If you ignore it then more retards will just come here and start sucking each other off and trying to invent new ways to make the least on-topic threads possible without getting banned. If this place is going to just be another /v/ then it may as well be deleted, because it's only spreading rpg discussion thinner.
>>3652885i'd just do something else for a week or two. hasn't come to that yet though and it won't, because there's always diamonds in the rough, that's how the internet works in general. my board experience is just far more pleasant, i fuck with that guy, or that discord or bot or whatever, too when i want, but it can't "get" to me in any way.>>3652891it has neither grown nor stopped since i started posting here. it was shit from day one, this board is a subset of /v/ with added rpgcodex refugees and resident whackos. welcome to the internet without severe moderation.
>>3652897>welcome to the internet without severe moderation.There is plenty of moderation here.
>>3652907not nearly as much as other places. besides, the focus of that moderation is with regards to what? i don't want to be manipulated by problem, reaction, solution either.
>>3652915>not nearly as much as other placesThere's a lot more than you think and I can't really take your opinion on the board seriously when you have 90 threads hidden.
>>3652920>deflectionaren't you complaining that there isn't enough moderation? make up your mind and outright state your vision for the board.
>>3652526russian lolcow spamming 24/7
>>3652925I think everyone should be held to the same standards. Either way the problem will be fixed.
>>3652930state those standards. state the solution.
>>3652932Come on, he can't just come out and say he covets the powers of a janny
>>3652932If OP can spam whatever he wants then so too should I. If OP can scream about jews constantly then I should be able to point out that slavs are retarded. Or we could disallow both of these things.
>>3652932Why is someone allowed to make 20 threads about how they dislike a game to divide discussion but if you go in the designated thread for a video game and start talking about why it's bad that's not okay? This board is very strange.
>>3652932The solution is killing russian bronies.
>>3652936i've shit on slavs before, isn't very fun, but doesn't seem to provoke anything except confusing insults in broken english.>>3652941i've never had anything happen from shitting on a game in any thread.
>>3652936>If OP can scream about jews constantly then I should be able to point out that slavs are retarded.>t. still assblasted about the Pale of Settlement
>>3652946We can look at threads on this very board and see it happening. If you want to know who the problem is then look at who you can't criticize.
>>3652526Combat isn't the draw for normalfags at all.That said, BG3 did a remarkable amount of things right. The combat is actually good, the build variety is there, the itemization is fucking great. They actually went way beyond what basic 5e dnd does to make the game fun to play for mechanics focused nerds
>>3652948where, exactly? stop being vague and give a specific example of a deleted post from the archive dealing with what you are talking about. and don't conflate it with some mass deletion of your posts due to ban evasion or whatever
>>3652951he's talking about dragonirian shitting up tons of boards with his threads.
>>3652951If he gives you the specifics he'll get banned for discussing moderation, that's how this works.
>>3652954why does that matter if he constantly ban evades due to unfair moderation? no, this is cagey nonsense. where's the solution? what's the actual goal? for all i know he's the one making the threads and then arguing with himself about it in order to shit up the board.
>>3652955>where's the solution?humiliation rituals. its how /v/ defeated the russian.
>>3652955Who said he's ban evading? You seem weirdly defensive.
>>3652957no idea what that means.>>3652958i know he ban evades. i like to argue.
>>3652960If you like to argue then you should prepare better arguments rather than asking the same thing over and over. It's a waste of time to argue for the sake of argument, especially when one side is being dishonest.
>>3652958Everyone knows that dragonirian is an IP hopper its why the new post timer exists for IPs.
>>3652962He's talking about the person complaining about "dragonirian". The argument is "if you complain about the problem then you must be the problem".
>>3652961>don't call out my deflectionno, i'm gonna keep requesting an actual statement about how an anon plans to "fix" this board by posting on it.
>>3652963>the personno, i'm talking about moeblob. new to this board?
>>3652965Do you think it's unreasonable that the same rules should apply to everyone?
>>3652967what does reasonableness have to do with rules, they are about the ability to enforce your will. state your rules, state your vision. i'm actually curious.
>>3652963He isn't though. He's deflecting because he's dragonirian.
>>3652969If you can cry about jews but not slavs then change the listed rules to honestly reflect that or enforce them as they are currently stated. That's not going to happen because no one would post on this website. We have here 10+ instances of the same thread but it doesn't count as spam. Why is that? Many important questions here. Nothing unreasonable being asked. These things exist because of 2 conditions:1) Stated rules are not enforced.2) People are not allowed to speak freely.It can only exist in a protected environment.
>>3652971but i cry about slavs at will? lol, slavs are retards, can't make an rpg to save their life. never caught a ban. it's the mods that don't like being cried about. that's what gets you bonked.but again, what's your plan to oust the existing mods and take over the board? cry in 1000 more threads? start an internet petition?
>>3652975>cry in 1000 more threads? It’s this one.
>>3652975There's a line of posts in the Witcher thread that got removed because some said something to the tune of "slavs sure are retarded" in response to someone saying it was okay witcher was a movie game in broken English. And you are being dishonest. Make ten identical threads right now and see if you get banned. You will. No one has said anything about mods until now. Now you are gaslighting and ramping up for the deletion again.
>>3652977999 to go, then you'll level up and god will grant you the power to delete any thread you want.
>>3652949>That said, BG3 did a remarkable amount of things right.It didn't and that's the worst part.All that money spent on the game for something subpar that dazzled the normies with the production values.
>>3652986The only game with combat as interactive as BG3 is Knights of the Chalice 2 and it has none of the interactivity outside combat. Your statement is objectively wrong.
>>3652979>There's a line of posts in the Witcher thread that got removed becauseyou don't know why. causation isn't correlation. all posts someone made can get deleted when certain bans are handed out. happened to farquaad all the time, complete excision.>you are being dishonestnope, i'm calling you out. now you are mad.>Make ten identical threads right nowdo it over the course of days and it's probably fine. i have no interest in doing so though.>No one has said anything about mods until nowso the mods are great and nothing to do with the awful state of the board according to you?>Now you are gaslighting nope>ramping up for the deletion againwut?
>>3652989>do it over the course of days and it's probably fineNo it won't be fine and you won't do it because you know what will happen.
>>3652990it's easy to test, make 10 threads about the same game with different pictures and different ops over the course of a week and nothing will happen, change it up and praise the games and their political stance even. i'm just not that bored.
>>3652988I find a common complaint about bg3 is that things like hold person and haste are too strong, but this is how it works in gold box games except those spells are exponentially stronger, not subject to counterspells, and cannot be concentration broken. But I think most people who complain about bg3 don't play games like that.
>>3652986>something subparEasiest way to tell this nigga has never played another crpg before.
>>3652989>causation isn't correlationThere are no posts in that thread that warranted deletion and there were no posts elsewhere that got deleted. I know the cause for deletion because I checked /bans when I noticed it happened.
>>3652994>haste>too strong in BG3This is another tell that these niggas probably haven't even played BG3, haste (as in the spell) is unironically a trap option.
>>3652988>The only game with combat as interactiveFucking horrible "bar" to set.If you really want to go down that route, Midnight Suns dumpsters BG3 in terms of combat design.>>3653001Or rather I have clearly played more than you and actually has some semblance of standards. I bet you're one of the clowns that kept thinking>this is the best rpg i've ever playedwhen you played BG3.
>>3653007>Midnight Suns dumpsters BG3 in terms of combat design.No it doesn't. No nucom clone has well designed combat.
>>3653007>actually has some semblance of standardsBased ESL.It's also highly unlikely you have played a particularly large amount of crpgs, if you had you'd have realize long ago how dire the circumstances of game design are in the genre and how rudimentary the vast majority of games are, most games of the past two decades failing to even live up to games from the late 80s and early 90s.
>>3653009If you're going to samefag then back up your statements and make those comparisons, because no modern game has worse combat than fallout 1 or the infinity engine games and it has just been explained to you how bg3 is superior to gold box.
>>3653008>No it doesn't. No nucom clone has well designed combat.You outed yourself as an ignorant idiot. Well done.>>3653009>nooooo someone doesn't praise a game i like, bg3, to the higher heavens???? esl!!!You can't even make this shit up. You then start pulling more random baseless shit from your ass to fit your mongoloid headcanon. Bravo, you outdone yourself in pure retardation and delusion. What's the next step in embarrassing yourself?
>>3653009BG3 is quite literally a victim of this "rudimentary" and thoughtless design you're going on about. It takes bog standard trun based combat, rips d&d rules not matter how terrible and shoehorns them into the game and then ties it all together in a smorgasbord of incompetent design. You'd think after the fiasco of the combat in DOS1&2 they'd hire a competent combat designer.
>>3653012>how bg3 is superior to gold boxlol
>>3653003maybe the mod just doesn't like that particular poster, for some extremely odd and baffling reason, and that post was a good excuse.
>>3653021There were no identifiers for that poster. Why keep moving the goal posts? This is getting more and more silly. The simplest explanation is often the correct one.
>>3653056i remember that post, i laughed and knew immediately who it was.
>>3652989I was an active participant in that threadthe comment did get deleted even if I did disagree with that specific poster vehemently for posting a bs post
>>3652814The funny thing about the RTwP vs Turn-Based debate is that the turn-based side on /v/ or /vrpg/ is VERY defensive, it's obvious that most people who dislike RTwP just can't handle it, at least the people on youtube comments are more sincere with themselves.you can't handle it
>>3652526>combat is worse than both bg2 and divinity 2Not anymorehttps://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eExf2d7W4o4
>>3653872rtwp sucks.1v1 one me in sc2. bet you won't.
>>3653893RTwP rulesNever played sc2, are you trying to prove that you have high APM, if that was true you could handle RTwP instead of crying about it.
We endured the RTWP fad because we had to, not because we wanted to
>>3653898Now the inverse is happening.
>>3652626>As opposed to RTWP where you just order your guys to attack the enemies after buffing for 5 minutes and then just sit and watch?This is the single most retarded take that's often repeated on threads like these.RTwP is just Turn-Based happening simultaneously in real time, if you can buff for 5 minutes then win by auto-attacking in RTwP then you can do the EXACTLY SAME THING in Turn-Based and it will be even easier, and longer and more boring.
>>3653902Not participating in this conversation but anyone stupid enough to pretend the sky isn't blue worth replying to. You'll see none of his statements are logically justified, just stating asinine things and not being able to back them up.
>>3653902>conflating simultaneous turn based with sequential turn basedLol, lmao
>>36539076s
>>3652739>So basically, you have a made up definition of somethingThe term is industry standard and not hidden at all. You being ignorant about it is your problem and making the case that if you don't know about it, it doesn't exist is delusional.Even then the explanation and what execution is should make it plain to anyone that it is indeed what matters most.You're saying "red paint is better than blue paint, always". You don't think how something is painted or who paints with it matters, so you think having some 4 year old you can barely communicate with to paint your new house in red paint will result is a better result (or "execution" if you will) than a professional house painter you can give clear instructions to using blue paint.If you argue against execution not mattering, then you're just a lunatic, end of story.
"I-i-i like RTwP because it saves time!">Obscures the fact his game is full of meaningless piss easy time wasting trash encounters
>>3652526I played my fair share of CRPGs and JRPGs and i say that Larian makes the best turn-based combat and gameplay in general.Divinity Original Sin games were a good start for them to show the potential but i feel with BG3 they upgraded it further.I'm excited for their next CRPG to see what they will come up with.BG2 has a different combat system but its undoubtedly weaker in depth and mechanics, i always found Rtwp to be a cheap budget copy for RTS, but i could still enjoy it if it was well made, in particular i find the Pillars and Icewind games to be the best current attempts at emulating that system but both of them don't reach the potential of a well made turnbased system.Divinity OS2 systems are great the physics, the spells and the dynamic are fun, but it has some flaws mainly in its armor mechanic, itemization and unrealized potential, i had no big issue with dividing damage into 2 and locking CC behind it, but it takes up from strategical depth, the itemization inspired by the Diablo system were lame and repetitive and the enemy variety being the biggest issue.BG3 fixed every issue here, its enemy variety is incredible, there is a lot of different strategies to apply, tons of spells, tons of power-up, itemization can play crucial role in the fight and the DnD ruleset feels more refined due to decades of build up.Combat feels tactical and fun, and adding to all those good qualities, the animations & sfx are smooth and looks nice.If someone has some TB recommendations for me i'll happily play them.Favs: BG3,JA2,HOMM3&4,XCOM2,DOS2
>>3653966You should try Jagged Alliance 3, Disciples 2,
>>3653916So answer the question i asked? is there a magical RTWP game with perfect pathfinding and ability to skip animations?Or are you gonna write more shit not related?Why am i even asking, of course you will.
>>3653974Why should I answer irrelevant random drivel when it doesn't refute the original point. That execution is what matters.You still haven't refuted (i.e. answered) the original point, so no one needs to do anything to please you.If you claim exectution doesn't matter, then you're saying something is automatically good just at inception. Like literally every single game that has a turn based combat system is a 10/10 combat system, since clearly how it's designed, balanced, sound mixed, vfx, AI, system design, skills, etc. doesn't matter in your argument. Since execution doesn't matter.Until you refute the very original point, you're the one posting unrelated shit.
>>3653974And before you start autistically screeching, the entire discussion surrounding execution started here >>3652604 and you have not refuted it at all
>>3652526Well, those were two very popular CRPGs. People really liked DOS2.Larian simply gave the people what they wanted, which was an epic chungus safe horny romance simulator.
>all those options from people who did not play the games they are talking about
>>3653896believe it or not, people have preferences that go beyond their skillset. plenty of people hate shit they are good at or love shit they are bad at. your theories are just braindead.
>>3653995Refute what? You are literally contradicting yourself by stating that almost all tbs games suck while saying it comes down to "execution".You are just a typical rtwp fanboi trying to appear neutral.
>>3654006>TheoriesFacts
>>3653974>perfect pathfindingIs there any "magical" game with perfect pathfinder whatsoever? I'd like to see it.>skip animations>in RTwPJust why, nigger?
>>3654015Posting a youtube comment as an argument. RTWP fans just keep going lower.
>>3654016>Is there any "magical" game with perfect pathfinder whatsoever? I'd like to see it.So you agree with me? Tbs doesn't have this problem. Why include a fundamentally flawed system in any game then? And this is for basic movement, not something really complicated.>Just why, nigger?A large amount of trash mobs where you have to spend minutes just watching how you clean up.
>>3654015this isn't a fact, it's an anecdote from a dumb bitch in a youtube comment on god knows what channel which you extrapolated into a theory in order to bait people who might be even dumber than you. unfortunately for you, there aren't that many below you here.here's my theory based on a reddit post that i haven't bothered to look for but could easily find: adhd kids can't stand turn based because they aren't able to sit still and think anything that isn't constantly moving and flashing at them is "boring".
>>3652526>round robin means keeping weak enemies alive while fighting stronger enemies a viable tactic >armor system making versatile parties inefficient >ground effect destroying the map, eyes and turning everything into a clown show divos 2 is unironically the most retarded game I've played and the worst purchase I've made on steam
>>3654023>the worst purchase I've made on steamp. good record then tpqhfrimo
>>3652526BG3 has better encounter design than both.And I say it begrudgingly....I suppose a good argument against BG3 is an utter lack of balance. Funny how honor mode fixes mechanics I assumed to be bugs....BG3 has that "fun trumps all" design philosophy.It's a cRPG with a teaspoon of goat simulator.
>"""real""" """"""time""""""" with """""""""""""""""pause""""""""""""""""">Still has rounds, rolls and shitlollmao
>>3654017>>3654022She's the perfect picture of a normie, normies hate RTwP because they can't handle and most fags here are same.>b-but not me, I p-play sc2, I have high APM!You're the exception that proves the rule then.
>>3654021>So you agree with me? Tbs doesn't have this problem.It does. You see mobs in BG3 walking around or getting stuck in their turns all the time.>A large amount of trash mobs where you have to spend minutes just watching how you clean up.Retard, RTwP is already fast, you need animation canceling for Troon-Based not RTwP.
>>3654027This, it's just the same shit but happening simultaneously.
>>3654061And then to compensate for RTwP being faster and saving time, devs populate it with numerous piss easy trash encounters. So in the end turn based games and RTwP games both waste as much of your time equally
>>3654064Turn-Based games are full to the brim with trash encounters, see any JRPG, BG3 is an (somewhat) of an exception but even DoS had plenty of trash encounters, and if we're talking about exceptions, I can bring up Dark Envoy. or the new RTwP mod for BG3, suck on it fagYour argument fails, what now?
>>3654058>It does. You see mobs in BG3 walking around or getting stuck in their turns all the time.Sure buddy.Any more made up shit.And plz post some early access footage to "own" me.>Retard, RTwP is already fastHow the fuck is a system where you have to watch very swing happen "already fast"?
>>3654064>trash encountersI'm not sure we'll ever get away from this. A lot of people play these games just rushing through story to get to the next fight. Dialogue, quests and all that are just a little pause to level up your character for the next test: combat.Combat is pretty much the only challenge you get, the only way to test your party's abilities.
Seriously though, can any turn-faggot bring some kind of interesting or intelligent critiscism of RTwP to the table? It's always>5 minutes buffs!>Zoomers ADHD>Trash Encounters because fastThey mostly don't even understand that in most CRPGs RTwP is just the same 6s turns happening simultenaoulsy so the combat is just turn-based in a different pace. You could bring up PoE where different characters actually have different recovery timers but I doubt they even know what that means.
>>3654069>Sure buddy.Any more made up shit.It's a common complaint, cope.>How the fuck is a system where you have to watch very swing happen "already fast"?Literal retardation. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=C0FBQknd0mU&t=2s is not fast enough for you? Go play Sonic Unleashead then zoom zoom.
>>3654072Probably depends how you play. If you find yourself mashing the pause button too often, it breaks the flow of the fight and it starts to look silly.
>>3654073Dude complaining that watching "every swing" is too slow, why the fuck this nigger is playing turn-based then?
>>3654015You're posting a youtube comment which is among the lowest quality posts you can make, how did you manage to be make it even worse by posting a blurry pic?
>>3654076See >>3654051
>>3654015>YT comments are factsProbably one of the dumbest post in this year.RTwP is shit, but not due these reasons.
>>3654080Another one who shits and piss himself when more than one character moves at the same time.
>>3654082>"not due these reason"Nigger you can't even read in real time.
>>3654084Any fag who complains about RTwP wich again in most CRPGs is just turn-based in a different pace is just a shitter who can't handle the speed of it and panics like a youtube coment normie girl.You can't change my mind, shitter, git gud.
>>3654088So wich is better, rounds like RTwP in Pathfinder/BG2 or recovery times like in PoE/Deadfire?
>>3654075One of these days you are gonna figure out that most turn based games can skip animations or speed them up.
>>3654073>is not fast enough for youThat is slower than a snail. So, a perfect pace for you.
>>3652568There are help groups for chronic contrarians.
>>3654131Faster than turn-based
>>3654088>can't read>retarded opinion>frogposterGo figure.
>>3654147Again, git gud, shitter. There's no reason to complain about RTwP over turn-based.
>>3654149>complain about RTwP over turn-basedBut I'm not. Yet again, you can't even read.
>>3654149Shit, forgot my pepe, look at him go.
>>3654151Yes, there's no reason to, glad we agree.
>>3654072There's nothing inherently wrong with RTWP, it's just that nobody's been able to design good encounters in an RTWP game besides Deadfire and Tower of Time.
>>3654160>design good encounters in an RTWP game besides Deadfire and Tower of Time.I disagree, DAO, FFXII, FF7R, Dark Envoy and even Tyranny somewhat have plenty of cool encounters.As an example let me pick DAO, the very first main dungeon the Tower of Ishall, you first enter into a firetrapped room, where hurlocks block your access to the shaman, then you move up and can let the pet dogs out to help you clean the horde of hurlocks that the tower thrown at you and even detter them at long distance with well positioned ballista shots culminating in a showdown against your first main boss fight, the Ogre, wich can pin one of your characters down, throw boulders at you, displace and charge.The High Dragon, the Darkspawn Chronicles, the ambush at Lothering, plenty of them.There are plenty of cool encounters in many RTwP games, one of the criticisms that I can agree about it is that Devs tend to just throw trash fights at you because of padding issues.Most of the sections in DAO end up a chore because it's just waves after waves of the same enemies deep roads
>>3654170DAO has the worst combat I have ever experienced in an rpg and I am not exaggerating. I would rather chug a five gallon bucket of gasoline than suffer through that snoozefest again, so you see, when you say incredibly retarded things like this you're only painting the picture of a complete moron with abhorrent taste and rock bottom standards.
>>3654177Then play more games, faggot.
>>3654177Kek, then try playing ToEE, you'll be chuggin 10 gallons buckets of gasoline by the time you arrive at the zombies on the top floor.
>>3654196I've beaten ToEE like 5 times.
>>3654205Here
>>3654206You should stop shitting up the board. This place is very so slow, so a person's behavior is extremely obvious. Judging by the top of the catalogue you clearly don't rpgs and don't belong here.
>>3654208>Nooo don't throw the bait back at my face like that!Get fucked faggot.
>>3654209I can see every single thread that is bumped by you. It's all shitty games and bad bait.
>>3654213Are they all as shitty as ToEE though?
>>3654216Yeah they're a lot shittier than ToEE.
>>3652528I hated all the sex interjection; its lazy and poorly written when the whole camp is trying to fuck you because you have to fulfill every single persons deviantart ships
>>3654217x
>>3654026>I suppose a good argument against BG3 is an utter lack of balance. Funny how honor mode fixes mechanics I assumed to be bugs.I played BG3 at launch and wasn’t impressed, and am currently replaying it since they’re done patching it now. I am astounded to read about how honor mode “fixes” shit like damage modifiers triggering each other to repeatedly add the same damage modifier multiple times, which is obviously a bug due to bad coding, but people have just been rolling with it this whole time like>lol I’m so good at this game my builds are greatAmazing.
>>3654051>normies hate RTwP because they can't handleRTWP was itself a casualization to appeal to the mass market. RTS was a huge trend and everything was chasing popular shit like Command and Conquer and StarCraft back in the day, just like for a while everything was chasing Diablo.
>>3654072>conflating simultaneous turn based with sequential turn basedDo brainlets really
>>3654298It's not a bug, everything beneath honor mode is more lower tier build diversity, whereas honor mode is focused on more higher tier build diversity.
>>3654299It backfired then, normies can't handle RTwP and Turn-Based is way more consumer friendly and accessible.
>>3654302>>3654298Crazy shit.There are many things that I find admirable about Larian. But at the same time I find many of their design choices completely alien.>Yeah, normal difficulty mode has things that seem like bugs and make no sense. New difficulty nevel fixes these thing.It would really bother me if I were a dev.
>>3654319It's just incompetence. People disregard it due to shiny graphics, romance and shit.You can see all their incompetent design in all their prior games.
>>3654304Normies didn't play RPG games when Baldur's Gate was released. They wanted more of the PC gamer market, which meant people who played RTS games. That's why Baldur's Gate plays like an RTS.
>>3654126>One of these days you are gonna figure out that most turn based games can skip animations or speed them up.Almost all Turn based games that uses some form of moving on the field are some of the slowest combat systems around.Units all individually move one by one, perform their actions one by one, slow transitions between each action and phases and the list goes on.It's one of the primary reasons why unit count tends to be low (3-5 controllable characters, and roughly the same amount of enemies, maybe a little more), otherwise combat slows down to a crawl.
>>3654302
>>3654319It's really not crazy when you realize normal mode is for the gameplay that normalfags would enjoy and honor mode is an anti-minmax/savescum gauntlet which would repel them. Normalfaggots would not stand for failing a dialogue check and being locked out of content, or their special snowflake build not working. So it's just a more creative approach to difficulty.
>>3654051anon, you're just a normalfag whose window has shifted. you haven't even played sc2.
>>3654343You can still see on the furthermost triangle there is the greatest coverage of both lower and upper surfaces. You misunderstand the image. On normal and hard everything that isn't at the tippy top of the triangle is just a shittier more tedious experience and raising the floor would only drive people further to that singular tiny pinnacle. If we lower the ceiling instead there is a stark difference. There has to be a balance, where any shit build can't maul everything, and there isn't a super meta build, because both of these extremes make the content unengaging. Look at how bad BG2 is with multis, even arcane and divine spell schools diverge into extremely similar spells at very high levels and every character winds up playing exactly the same. BG3 is not like that. Owlcat pathfinder games have a very similar problem even though real pf1e isn't like that. So it's a failure on the devs to make an engaging game for real grognards and not dumb biodrones.
>>3654346Turn-based is casualized, acessible and user-friendly.Turn-based is for normies.Normies can't handle RTwP CRPGs.And no matter how many people who never played sc2 you can find, that's not gonna change, seethe.
>>3654347There's no build that works on honor that doesn't work on hard, right? Least area of building is honor mode, this isn't a bad thing, to reduce overpowered shit for people who can't help but always pick the optimal unless the dev slaps their hands, but it's what it is.
>>3654349>"normies" sure can't handle basic reflexes, derpanon, you're a normalfag, you're even afraid to type fag. you watch youtube videos and read the comments, lol. how many hours in assfaggots do you have? you know that super unpopular genre? played elden ring? that super unpopular action-rpg?
>>3654351>There's no build that works on honor that doesn't work on hard, rightNo, only the inverse.>Least area of buildingI disagree because just because a build is viable doesn't mean it's good. Like playing on easy mode technically means you can make the highest quantity of shitty builds but no one who engages with the systems in the game on a meaningful level wants that. What is important in the greatest diversity of meaningful synergy and strategy as those builds express themselves. Like if we played on easy and made a build where everyone just melees everyone to death and wins that would be dumb. This isn't to say honor mode is perfect in its execution, but it's a good idea.Something in fighting games is that all veterans eventually pick top tiers in their chosen games because top tiers are the greatest expression of all the mechanics in the game that the person enjoys. Like sentinel in MvC2 is a super character that can do everything, so naturally any MvC2 fan would gravitate towards sentinel even if it wasn't necessary because it's the greatest expression of that game's meta where you get to engage with every aspect of it. If the top tiers in a fighting game aren't fun, then the game isn't fun.
>>3654354>You can't say words!That's me >>3654075Also me >>3654187>You watch youtube videos and read the comments, lelYes>how many hours in assfaggots do you have?Zero, also, didn't the first assfagots come from sc2?>PopularPokemon? The most normalFAG turn-based game ever made that can be beaten by a fucking fish at an aquarium streaming on twitch?Show me a fish that can beat a RTwP game and them come back, until then, seethe and cope, Turn-Based is the most casualized and brainded form of playing a party-themed RPG.And I'm not even saying that all of them are bad, because there are some good tactical games wich are turn-based, but for traditional CRPGs RTwP>>>>Turn-Based and you can cry all you want about FAGgot.
>>3654359>Yeslmao, what a cuck>normalfag can't even understand the argumentthe most popular games have always been reflex games. god's truth. rpgs were always turn or phase(you probably don't know what that is, google it normalfag) based games, therefore to casualize rpgs is to make them action games, which was done, extensively. now you are trying to flip that script. bg3 is popular because of production values and not because the combat. now, cry.
>>3654359Man /tv/ posters are really dumb. That board should be deleted.
>>3654364>Haha he watches youtube, what a cuck!Picrel, the lenghts these faggots go for any kind of "win".>the most popular games have always been reflex gamesOh, the irony, talking about people who can't understand the argument? We're talking about RPGs and there's nothing more casualized than the most popular RPG in the world wich is Pokemon, wich can also be beaten by a fish in the aquarium, turn-based at it's core is the most casualized way of playing, and casual = normalfaggotry.>bg3 is popular because of production values and not because the combatTrue, but give normies the chance to play turn-based and RTwP and you have.>I panic and I'm overwhelmed naow!!Wich also strikes true to most faggots who cry about RTwP, they can't play it, go to any Pathfinder thread that has both, it's always:>RTwP for most fights and Turn-Based for boss fightsImagine having to tune-down to turn-based for fighting a boss, kek, now cry more.
>>3654365I rather send back faggots like these >>3654364where they belong >>/trash/
>>3654371>pic of him cryinglmfao>Haha he watches youtube, what a cuck!no you read the comments. a braindead pit of morons. guess you see them as compatriots.> the most popular RPG in the world wich is Pokemondo kids play the pokemon for the combat? do any real rpg fans consider it any kind of challenge? are you able to beat pokemon tournaments against other players?>give normies the chance to play turn-based and RTwP and you havewe did, you cried about it being "too slow" because you never played board games as a kid.>Imagine having to tune-down to turn-based for fighting a bosspeople do that for the feeling of control and so the boss doesn't go down in 2 seconds anti-climatically, pf games aren't particularly well made due to being bg clones with tb tacked on.
>>3654385>a braindead pit of moronsYeah, and they agree with you RTwP sucks, guess we find a place where you can finally belong, kek.>do any real rpg fans consider it any kind of challenge?Of course not, it's the most casualized form of rpg combat, wich is turn-based, that's the point>we did, you cried about it being "too slow" because you never played board games as a kid.Wrong again, normies complain that RTwP is too difficult at the mere sight of it, also, it IS too slow, imagine using a caveat needed for playing ttrpgs, importing it to vidya (wich doesn't need it) and considering it a win, kek, cuck mentality.>people do that for the feeling of controlPicrel, you just admitted you and those faggots can't control RTwP mode properly, imagine being unable to control a party of 5 to 6 characters lmao.>go down in 2 seconds anti-climaticallyThe same rounds that happen in RTwP are going to happen in turn-based, congratulations nigger, you just stretched 2 anti-climatically seconds into 20 anti-climatically minutes.All your arguments suck ass anon, stick to name-calling and oldfaggotry claiming, you were having more success there.
>>3654344I understand they wanted normal difficulty to be a playground for normies.But...They went really REALLY far in the "who cares if it makes sense, it seems fun" direction.>1 level dip gives access to the whole spellbook, if you have levels in other spellcasting class.> Scrolls with zero requirements.It's so messy it destroys the mechanics as a part of roleplay.>You play a dumb fighter? Sure, you can still cast powerful spells! Fun!!!...I don't expect devs to share my all sensibilities, but... for some reason this nonchalant approach to RPG mechanics seems jarring to me.Swen has RPG cred, I would assume he cares about mechanics.
>>3654402Just play honor mode.
>>3654336>It's just incompetence. Some of it, maybe.But I think it's all of it. Even most of it.I played BG3 and D:OS2. Both games, but Divinity especially, doesn't give a single fuck about mechanics as a part of the whole picture.- If you aggro some random fish merchant in later chapter, he starts blasting spells so powerful he could solo chapter 1.- A woolen shirt has better armor than Legendary Armor of MEgahitler from previus chapter.- In BG3 Minsc has generic ranger stats.- Low int barbarian casting level 9 spells from scrolls.Sure, a lot of devs don't care about that stuff. But Larian seems actively hostile to the idea of mechanics being a part of roleplay....Maybe I'm being autistic here, but this crap really annoys me.
>>3654402I still can’t get over how retarded “spell slots are shared among all classes regardless of the granting class” is
>>3654401>they agree with you RTwP sucksno they don't. that one person you cherrypicked doesn't agree with me at all, their reasons are completely different than mine.>the most casualized form of rpg combatit's the actual form of rpg combat, since rpgs aren't action based games. they casualized that and made rtwp and action-rpgs, which were very popular with kids like you.>normies complain that RTwP is too difficult at the mere sight of iti thought you liked rtwp? i'm confused.>it IS too slowi rest my case. no one played board games with you as a kid.>you just admitted you and those faggots can't control RTwP mode properly, imagine being unable to control a party of 5 to 6 characterscasting a bunch of buffs and then having an outflank beatdown isn't hard, anon. besides wanting a greater "feeling of control" isn't "having lack of control", it's about the "feeling" of not leaving anything up to pathfinding.>2 anti-climatically seconds into 20 anti-climatically minutesis this how adhd kids experience time?>All your arguments suck ass anonanon, you can barely follow them, your english is atrocious.
>>3654405That's not the point here.The point is that I don't understand their design philosophy.I understand weeb "rpgs". I don't like it, but I get the design.I undestand casual shit.But LArian... confuses me.This is like alien belgian branch of evolution. It's both, serious arpeegee and total casual crap at the same time.
>>3654408A line that stuck with me in the credits after finishing the game was in the dev thank yous section>thanks to my friend so and so who told me more than I ever needed to know about the first two games
turnbased dnd video games combat get really silly around the time you get multiple attacks per roundsimultaneous turns should be the norm outside the tabletop but i guess they don't want the brainlets getting filtered
>>3654454this is gonna confuse you, but originally d&d was phase-based.
>>3654414>The point is that I don't understand their design philosophy.Because you're an idiot. I'm not really sure what response you expect here.
>>3654466Nooo~!I have been shown who the is the smarter man!Anonerinooos, avert your eyeEes...!
>>3654414The reason you don't understand is you don't have access to their extensive analytics from the extended EA. EA players made normal.
>>3652526Who plays RPGs for the combat?
>>3654507People who like RPGs.
>>3652586>t's popular because it's a dating sim with good graphics, anonI've beaten the game multiple times and never interacted with the romance system at all. Definitely not a dating sim lol.
>>3654523>I've beaten the game multiple times and never interacted with the romance system at all. Definitely not a dating sim lol.I've beaten the game once and I killed every origin character and stayed out of the whorehouse and Withers made fun of me for not getting my dick wet. Doesn't mean that that's not how the majority of players are treating it.
>>3654524>Doesn't mean that that's not how the majority of players are treating it.According to data telemetry roughly 15.6% of players did not engage with romance at all, which is a lot. Like literal millions. And to say the focus of the game is "dating" is also misleading, as it has less focus on those interactions than BG2 did, and certainly much less than something like Owlcat games. So what's left here is that its popular because... It has nudity and sex scenes? Except it advertised itself on the absurdity of the scenes rather than their seriousness? (If you can fuck a bear that must mean you can do anything!) Gunna be honest, you sound mentally retarded.
>>3654536>I’m not like those 85% of normies who play this popular and casual game that’s full of transsexuals, pronouns, vitiligo sliders, and non-binary feminine penises, I play it because I’m le redpilled chudYou are dumb. You are so dumb that you are no longer capable of recognizing how dumb you are, yet think you are smart. You are the bottom quartile of the Dunning-Kruger effect.
>>3654537>I play it because I’m le redpilled chudI am not a "redpilled chud". That would be embarassing. I'm not even the same person you are replying to. This is why you are on the defensive and asshurt right now. I don't think its strange or unnatural that if a sex scene were viewable people would click on it. Rather, I am relieved there is a good game attached to the sex scenes instead of Witcher 3 where there is a bad movie attached to them.In the context of my reply, I am simply pointing out that objective data points out that you are wrong and deluded.
>>3654538>I'm not even the same person you are replying to.You are not the anon to whom I was responding. I know exactly who you are, and I'm telling you how dumb you are.
>>3654543As I am able to parse objective data and put it into the context of reality, this objectively makes me less dumb than you are. Now your responses are getting rather boring so I'm going to ignore you, as you clearly are a vapid nitwit who has nothing interesting to say, like all BG3 haters.
>>3654546>hatersUse of this word is objectively a sign of an objective lack of wit.
>>3654546>As I am able to parse objective data and put it into the context of realityYou're the worst type of autist, the low-functioning autist who is unable to distinguish between your subjective opinions and objective reality, due to lacking theory of mind. Let's look at the original claim:>[BG3] is popular because it's a dating sim with good graphicsThen we have two anons chiming in that they did not engage in romance in the game, and then you chime in with the statistic that, allegedly, 84.4% of all of BG3's players did indeed play it like a dating sim. Wow! That's certainly the vast majority of BG3's normie-core casual fanbase. Sure sounds like you were agreeing with the original claim after all, but attempting to pilpul for mere contrarianism's sake.>to say the focus of the game is "dating" is also misleading, as it has less focus on those interactions than BG2 didObjectively false. BG3 features fully motion-capped sex scenes and a playersexual cast, all of whom will aggressively pursue the player regardless of their sex, race, or anything, really, you end up being forced to turn them down left and right. BG2 had a handful of romance options that were limited by sex and race (some player characters literally could not romance anyone if they wanted to), and all of it was quite tame by today's standards.
>>3654587Continued:>transsexualsObjectively in the game. Shadowheart's friend Nocturne.>pronouns, vitiligo sliders, and non-binary feminine penisesAlso objectively in the game, one need only fire up character creation to see.You may personally like these things, or at least you like enough of the rest of the game to tolerate them and put up with them, yet when you approach the game without nuance and blindly lump all criticism of it into "haters", you simply become the mirror image of that which you argue against. Why do you assume that there cannot be anons who also liked the aspects of the game that you like, but simultaneously disliked the cultural Bolshevism that Larian shoved into the game? In that case, you're no better than the anons who talk shit about the game without ever playing it, shitposting about BALDY GAPE THREE and so on. You're like an animal, reflexively responding to stimulus without the ability to think about why.>so I'm going to ignore youSee you tomorrow, faggot.
This dude has been fuming over getting owned by moeblob for 3 hours, holy shit
>>3654134Factually false.
>>3654598I laughed
>>3652568I wish rtwp were viable in current year, I had a prototype pretty much done a long time ago but abandoned it
>>3654507"That guy" the friendless loser kicked from every table.
>>3654616>>>/tg/
>>3654609>abandoned itNOOOOOO
>>3654666How about a KOTOR final fantasy 12-like
>>3654668That's even better
>>3654507People who like cRPGs.RPGs originated from tabletop tactics games.Duh.
>>3654538I 100% agree with you, but can we leave Witcher 3 out of this, there is way worse examples that fit better like Bioware games especially Dragon Age.For all its faults, Witcher 3 still has some of the best cinematics, visuals, voice acting, dialogue and choice and consequence implementation in its genre, it also has iconic music, good variety of quests, a cool little minigame and interesting characters and immersive atmosphere, its definitely a tier above all movie-like rpgs and the sex scene with yennefer on a unicorn or the one with triss in witcher 2 or shani in hearts of stone are better than any sex scene any rpg dev pulled out so far.I get why you don't like the game but its objectively better at what it tries to do than any other movie rpg ever attempted to.
>>3654680>but can we leave Witcher 3 out of thisNo.>aestheticsThere are many more artistically appealing RPGs than Witcher. If anything its pretty generic looking.>choice and consequence implementation in its genreIts implementation of CnC is regressive and poisonous.>it also has iconic musicIt has mediocre music.>good variety of questsAll of its quests are fundamentally the same and revolve around autorunning to waypoints to engage in cinematic dialogue or watch literal cutscenes, which is also regressive and poisonous.I don't understand why people get so asshurt about shitting on Witcher 3. Its an absolutely terrible game and anyone who enjoys it cannot be taken seriously. That fact isn't ever going to change.
>>3654683I have seen your favorite games grid, you don't like any cinematic game, none.Can you name just 5 cinematic story-driven RPGs that are better than it? like action rpg/crpgs/jrpgs whatever you like is allowed, just name 5 better than it if you can.
>>3654683>Its implementation of CnC is regressive and poisonous.>All of its quests are fundamentally the sameThese two comments mark you as being inhumanely retarded, ignorant and fictitious.No game to date has better quest design than Witcher 3. None. If you had even a hint of understanding of quest design you would understand this. This is something you cannot refute and you know it.Then considering the scale of the game and that it covers 3 games, there are only a handful (if even that) of other games that comes close to doing as good of a job in terms of choice and consequence. That includes games which are not even RPGs, like the Mass Effect series.This is once again something you cannot refute and prove wrong. Only shitpost about because you're actually incapable of making any sort of rational arguments backed up by fact. Instead your go-to strat to cover up your immaturity and close-mindedness is>n-no, you're just dumb witcher 3 fanboys!Which is the most sad, pathetic and embarrassing behaviour one could have. Deflection and ad hominem.
>>3654683>tranime retard degen>shitty takeEvery time
>>3654690No you are wrong my dude, i appreciate coming here to defend me lol but you don't understand how this goes.The anon thinks its bad quest design because from a gameplay perspective you can't influence anything, like all your agency is implemented through dialogue choice, so if someone is looking for RPG with choice via gameplay W3 is going to be disappointing as its gameplay is shallow and you can't influence anything without pressing on dialogue button.As for the quests i was talking from narrative perspecitve, every quest tackles new themes and feels like its whole subject, but that anon refer to quest being the same mechanically which they are, you press the vision and investigate then fight some monsters in shallow combat system then you will watch more cutscenes and pick dialogue, great from a story and cinematic pov but bad from gameplay pov.Lets not turn this thread into pointless debate, i know what im arguing with here, we focus on what Witcher 3 does well, the cinematics, immersion, atmosphere, worldbuilding, writing, presentation all that stuff.
>>3654688Cinematic isn't a descriptor for a video game. That would imply I'm watching a movie instead of playing a game. If I wanted to do that why wouldn't I just go watch anime instead? I've praised kiseki many, many times and its a very narrative driven game. However, you spend a lot of time controlling your character, exploring the world, and seeking out people and answers yourself, so there's like 13 games. I've praised Disco Elysium which is dialogue heavy, but that's more like playing a regular RPG with only a face archtype at your disposal. Another issue is that you keep labeling Witcher 3 as an RPG and that's wrong, since you seem to agree that Witcher 3's RPG mechanics are its weak point. If its a better "movie" than an RPG then its a movie game, not an RPG. GTA isn't a racing game just because you can drive cars in it. Except Witcher 3 isn't a good movie game either and if we fairly compare it with other movie games its pretty average. You seemed to be obsessed with the idea that lazily replacing gameplay with rote numbers progression sets it in an imaginary sub-genre that shields it from criticism and comparison, and that's retarded. So its not that I don't like X style of game, its that you're retarded and don't like games at all. Like you can't squirm your way into liking awful braindead console shit being a valid hill to die on. That's just not an option, its a place of ignorance, not a valid category. Which is why I say people who like it can't be taken seriously. Because they are in a place of ignorance and your attempted defense squarely affirms my belief in that observation.
>>3652721My guy, my brother and his wife are ultra casual gamers and played BG3 for hundreds of hours on a fucking PS5 of all things and they don't give a shit about romance. It's a major cope to attribute its popularity to le sex and romance.
Modern Dungeons and Dragons has a huge inbuilt fanbase of people who will shill for anything related to it for no other reason than that it's DnD, and on the other hand will relentlessly shit on anything that isn't DnD for the crime of not being DnD. Quality is utterly irrelevant to them, they like BG3 because it's DnD5e.
>>3654695>The anon thinks its bad quest design because from a gameplay perspective you can't influence anything, like all your agency is implemented through dialogue choice, so if someone is looking for RPG with choice via gameplay W3 is going to be disappointing as its gameplay is shallow and you can't influence anything without pressing on dialogue button.King of Dragon Pass is infinitely deeper than Witcher 3 despite all of its choices occuring in a dialogue window or adjusting a cow slider. The quest design is objectively bad in witcher. Running to a way point and pick A or B in a branching series is not complex or good quest design. Any idiot could implement that on a budget on zero dollars and its a lazy and cheap solution to avoid the permutation insanity of games like BG3. This is a theme in CDPR games, constantly cutting corners.>we focus on what Witcher 3 does well, the cinematics, immersion, atmosphere, worldbuilding, writing, presentation all that stuff.None of these have anything to do with RPGs so there's no point in comparing them only to RPGs. It would only be fair to compare Witcher 3 at games as a whole. However, Witcher is a hideously designed video game where footprints need to be made made to glow on the ground because the visibility is so poor. I would argue Deus Ex has far superior visual presentation, music, writing, etc, despite being focused on well executed genre defining gameplay mechanics which are infinitely more memorable than anything in Witcher. I can list examples all day even when you arbitrarily stack the deck in an unreasonable and retarded way like this. Like I can just completely handicap myself and still just endlessly shit on this game. Witcher 3 is not good. It really just isn't.
>>3654697>my brother and his wife are ultra casual gamers and played BG3 for hundreds of hoursAh yes, casual gamers that play for hundreds of hours in the same game.
>>3654696I didn't play kiseki so i can't comment on it.But i played Disco Elysium and its not the same, Disco is more like a book and its not cinematic at all, the only common thing between DE and W3 is that both have dialogue with choices.>you don't like games at allWhat makes you assume that? i like a wide variety of games i just happen to enjoy cinematic games in some cases.Witcher 3 has rpg mechanics like leveling, stats, skill tree, progression and all that stuff, we can't just ignore this fact, its an action rpg, period.You can argue its rpg side or its gameplay side is shallow and i will agree with you, but its still a rpg.Within its genre, the cinematic rpg or what you call movie game its imo the undisputed king, only rivaled by mass effect series but even mass effect doesn't reach its level. all other bioware games can't compete, all jrpgs like final fantasy 16 can't compete.So what is left is that you will compare it to actual movie games, fair, which ones do you think do it better? I can say Death Stranding for example has better cinematics, the cutscenes are better but it has no side quests, no actual worldbuilding at play, its full of boring chores that lead to nowhere.You can argue with Uncharted or The Last of Us if you want, but i think both are not as good, as Uncharted feels like a cheap copy of Indiana Jones meets Tomb Raider and aside from its shallow third person shooting galleries all it has is some sarcastic lines and beautiful graphics.Maybe Red Dead 2 is a worthy rival or Metal Gear Solid 3, but like we are talking about the top 5% of cinematic story-driven games here, so how is it bad? I mean look at the competition, Horizon Zero Dawn? don't think its better.Maybe Alan Wake 2 is better but its not for everyone and i found the writing in W3 to be superior, but i respect the game.
>>3654702>Disco is more like a bookNo, Disco is like A Dance With Rogues except you pick brains instead of locks.>not cinematicThis doesn't mean anything.>Witcher 3 has rpg mechanics like leveling, stats, skill tree, progression and all that stuffGTAV has all of that. Asscreed has all of that. Numerical progression is not an RPG feature. Every AAA game has that now.You're literally arguing that Witcher 3 has the best cutscenes as its only redeeming quality. *You've already lost.* And here's the real kicker. You're still wrong. Despite being made with a budget of 1 dollar this is infinitely more memorable than anything in Witcher and I will never forget it:https://youtu.be/feY5KhdXsUQThe absurd dialogue, unique visual style, and catchy musical motif make this a hood classic. I can't remember a single line from Witcher 3. You can't just throw money at something and make art. All you get is goyslop. And even then BG3 outslops it with stuff like bear sex and ice pick surgery.
>>3654700I think the fact that you bring up other genres is a solid proof for me that Witcher 3 is indeed the best RPG at what it tries to do, sure you may not like it but i don't think you will be able to list 5 cinematic story-driven RPGs that are better than it, because frankly there is none which is why its still relevant to this day.Deus Ex is a masterpiece assuming you talk about the original and not the sequels which are halfassed at best, but Deus Ex is an immersive sim and its not comparable in any way to a game like Witcher 3, as its very old and doesn't really focus on cinematics as a form of storytelling, sure there are some cutscenes in the game but they are just there as a change of pace.I never once mentioned that quest design is good in Witcher 3, i said vareity of quests and i was talking about themes, each side questline deals with certain themes be it about love/loyalty, superstitions/cult behavior. tradition vs progress. parody, grey morality stuff, romance, tracking a serial killer/solving a crime, political intrigue or simply engaging with your friends aka the side characters.Like i played Dragon Age as a build up for the new game Veilguard and its side quests for example don't come close something like Witcher 3, they are just generic fetch quests.If you want to make a generic fetch quest, you either have great gameplay and quest design to make up for it or you just dont make them.At least for CDPR in Cyberpunk and Witcher the quests while shallow mechanically they tend to offer interesting narrative and cinematic set pieces that can be thought provoking or trigger something relatable or emotional to the player to make them care and engage with the content, that can't be said about most side quests.
>>3654706>GTAV has all of that. Asscreed has all of that.Come on now, GTA has leveling and skill tree? where?Yeah the new Asscreed has it.Do you think Asscreed and GTAV are better cinematic games than Witcher 3?Do you think GTAV has better story, characters and quests than Withcer?Asscreed is better? GTA V completely relies on its stereotypes, its directly taken from Hollywood and reality TV shows, its unoriginal and lame and whats worse is that they have done it since the days of Vice City, so yeah zero innovation/creativity 100% budget.At least with CDPR you could say 30% creativity 70% budgetAsscreed just picks a random historical era and inserts lame and generic quests into them.
>>3654707>but Deus Ex is an immersive simYou keep inventing these imaginary absurd goalposts. I'm genuinely starting to think you have schizophrenia. Like you've already invented a new imaginary genre, "the cinematic rpg", like thats a scene. If Veilguard is the only game you can compare Witcher 3 to its a bad game. This is like when people say Morrowind is a good game by comparing it to Skyrim. This is the tactic of delusional liars and idiots. I only compare good games to bad games when I want to show how bad a game it is. When I want to show how good a game is I compare it to good games. I was only continuing this conversation to see how much more retarded you could get, but it seems you're stuck in a loop now so I guess we're done here. Good job completely embarassing yourself. Now have a meltdown and start samefagging again.
>>3654706>No, Disco is like A Dance With Rogues .........
>>3654708>Come on now, GTA has leveling and skill tree? where?https://www.ign.com/wikis/gta-5/Skills
>>3654710My job isn't to convince you that Witcher 3 is a good game, i can't do that.I'm telling you that your example above would be more fitting if you include an actually bad movie game instead.Witcher 3 genre is Action RPG.but all the qualities of Witcher 3 exists in the cinematic rpg sphere, which is a thing many devs do. See. God of War, The Last of Us, Horizon Zero Dawn, Ghost of Tsushima, Asscreed, Uncharted, RDR, Dragon Age, Mass Effect, Nu-Final Fantasy, Nier, Tales of Arise, Kojima games, Star Wars Jedi, Xenoblade Chronicles, Max Payne etc Those are different genres but they all be played for their cinematics and stories more than anything unlike lets say a game like Cuphead, Souls, Resident Evil, Heroes of Might and Magic and Breath of the Wild which are games that you play for the gameplay and level design.Cinematic RPG isn't a genre, its a quality, i mean its a RPG that is focused on delivering a story-driven experience throughout its cinematics and dialogue (presentation) its a modern and very popular approach to games.>>3654712You don't get to choose any of them though, they level up automatically and they are same as RDR, in witcher you level up certain skills and can actually make up builds as limited as it is, there is actually different builds in Witcher.
>>3654713>an actually bad movieAll movie games are bad anon. This isn't reddit, people don't like movie games here.
>>3654714As with all genres i like some of them and i dont like some of them.In that sense yes i do like some movie games especially as i stated if the atmosphere is good, its immersive, i like the cast, i find the worldbuilding intriguing, i like the music, aesthetics and i can believe that its a world that can exist.I think im the exception here but i do like some movie games, i like this game called SOMA, its a walking simulator basically but i love it.As long as i can articulate why i like/dislike something i'll always feel confident in my takes.
>>3654712not a skill tree, you dumb fuck>>3654706>discofaggotof course
>>3654702You are arguing with a tranime retard, wasting words
>>3654750He is one of the best posters here even if we disagree on some things i find his posts insightful for the most part, in fact i enjoyed my exchange with that anon here.I gained some new information from his posts, and i got some games out of his grid to play, overall not too bad, he got me into buying legend of grimrock 2 although i still need to play it, but i got sick and didn't play for the past month, just got back recently into games and i have been enjoying returnal.
>>3654593>be Moeblob>say you’re done responding>get owned>immediately respond and refer to yourself in the third person>I-I’m n-not owned, y-you’re owned!Many such cases
>>3654710>I'm genuinely starting to think you have schizophrenia.We’re reaching levels of projection that shouldn’t even be possible
I feel betrayed by Larian.
>>3654752>i find his posts insightful for the most partThe only insights to be gained from his posts are to illustrate the dangers of anime-induced autogynephilia.>Verification not required.
>>3652526The "west" is a very small market, and non-whites have absolutely shit taste. Someone had to say it
>>3655473Feel free to make a thread that isn't shit at any time.
>>3655482you know you're arguing with a bot, right?
>>3655514Bots unironically can't be that dumb.
>>3655517they can be anything, they just copy and make amalgamations of other posts. i've seen this bot absorb my posts as well.
>>3655514>>3655517>>3655523The last desperate refuge of those with no rebuttal.
^see? it's just generic amalgamations of common shitposts. really boring bot.
>>3655544>^see? it's just generic amalgamations of common shitposts. really boring bot.Precisely what a deflecting bot would say to allay suspicion. I'm coming for you, faggot, it's time to get disassembled, bolt by bolt. Start singing "Daisy".
>deus ex reference>2001 referencestill not one novel sentence. that's the problem with bots, they can only repeat. and people think they are the future of creativity, lol.
Wasted quints. Nothing of value to say, nothing to contribute, just meta-shitposting.
>If only you knew how fake and gay things were
>>3652526(you) can fuck a bear.
I'm a video game player. I don't play rpgs to see my character say words. I want to see them gain power, gear, and abilities. I want them to defeat more powerful monsters and challengesReal time with pause just lends itself better to my sense of fun. I can watch my character actually autonomously fight, use abilities and gear, and its awesome. turn based, execution being equal, is going to always be worse than real time with pause to me.
>>3655793>I can watch my characterCuck mentality
>>3655793>watch my character actually autonomously fightlmfao
>>3652526I don't think you've played DOS2 vanilla in awhile. It's unplayable withount mods that remove the armor system.
>>3655793>I can watch my character actually autonomously fightUnless it's DAO heavily modded or PoE (also heavility modded) you can't.Unless you're playing on story mode.
>>3654412>their reasons are completely different than mine.Too late, you already hinted at losing control on RTwP. Scrub.>it's the actual form of rpg combatRetarded take #1, HYTNPDD?>no one played board games with you as a kidNot an argument, here's an argument: "It IS too slow" cope more faggot.>casting a bunch of buffs and then having an outflank beatdown isn't hard, anonRetardeed Take #2, If you can do that in RTwP you can also do that in Turn-Based (it's also easier).>not leaving anything up to pathfinding.Kek, what a faggot, user your mouse you retarded, you leave your chars up to AI and them complain, what a shitter.>is this how adhd kids experience time?Dunno, I don't have to play turn-based to watch tik-toks between each character movement, so you tell me zoom-zoom.All your arguments suck ass anon. I'm still waiting for you to bring a good argument about why Turn-Based>>>>RTwP for traditional party-based CRPGs, but what you have is >you didn't play gameboards! You watch youtube videos! Ttrpg is turn based!What a pathetic faggot.
>>3655845my argument was that just because you don't like something, doesn't mean you are incapable of doing it. i'm saying that you don't need to make theories to explain why other people don't like what you like based on youtube comment anecdotes.
>>3655523>i've seen this bot absorb my posts as well.Name three.
>>3652526it's just a well made game. for all its faults, it's just jammed full of 5 years of early access funding. you can easily drop in and out of your friend's games with new chars, it's a game changer on a technical level.
>>3655818>filtered by armorgit good
I'll play this game when they give me the option to set companions to become AI controlled during combat.
>>3656950low quality bait, here, i'll give you a pity (You)
>>3655835>click on monster in bg2>my character attacks it on his own until one of them is deadcant do that in a turn based game, every battle stops the game and turns it to a standstill where you need to micromanage everything
>banishment nerfed to two turns because it's too strong apparently>tavern brawler feat buffed so throwing weapons one shot everyonewhat's the point of homebrewing this dumb shit in
>>3657915>passive take-10 perception? Nah roll that shit every single time lolzEarly access was hilarious too, you got advantage for flanking behind enemies so combat was everyone leaping over each other in combat to get behind each other for a backstab. I hate 5th ed but Larian did so much silly homebrew shit.I never realized this back in EA, or release, but now that I’m replaying their “it’s done” version of the game, reading about the mechanics is mind-boggling. So many of these busted builds abuse bugs where additional damage from items and such repeatedly triggers each other to stack damage add-ons in what can’t possibly be intended functionality, to the point that Larian add to add an alternate game mode that nerfs some of their own goofy bugs.
>>3657918Also I just killed Elminster last night and you get 1000 xp and not even any commentary or dialogue. What the fuck, game
>>3657919isn't the big e in bg3 just a simulacrum or clone
>>3657929Not sure. When I played and finished the game at launch I killed every origin character so I never met him, so I haven’t seen how the rest of Gales story goes. Really, I just saw the “attack” button on dialogue and was curious what would happen.The dialogue for the scene was pretty bad though, the only options were essentially “noooooo Gale I won’t let you die to save the world, that is MONSTROUS!” Or “good fuck him I hope he does blow up lolz”
>>3657676If your char can autoattack a monster to death in RTwP then it can also autoattack a monster to death in turn-based.You're playing longer for the exact same experience, you're bullshiting yourself.
Game for bronies
>>3658718Repeating the same basic attack in BG3 over and over is generally slower than executing a combo kill or using skills/items/abilities combined with the terrain to oneshot. Even Champions get better if you use the build in weapon skills or get skills from feats, even with a Champion you can finish up enemies with a push if they get close to the edge of a cliff.
I just hate turn based because it always turns into a 40 minute chess match. With RTWP in Pathfinder WOTR you can buff and kill shit in a few minutes.
>>3652600Most people didn't even reach act 3.
Give it a rest man. No one likes reading your posts. You ruined this board. You and that polish retard.
>>3658965>40 minute chess matchyou are simply bad at the game
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0nTcq8mUPYYNew test just dropped, there's no way for turn-fags to spin this around, this already looks so much better.
>>3652526it's actually much better
>>3659536Now THIS is speed racer.BG3 is exhausting it's no surprise most people dropped it before the end.
>>3652817>astarion is believableretard
>>3652807Op here, I have no idea what you're talking about I barely ever post here.
>>3659536that's a lot of visual noise
>>3652526>>3652528To be honest it really is. 90% of any discourse I see around this game revolves around the sex and romance. It's all so tiresome.Tourists do this shit all the time.
>>3652568>Objectively Elaborate
>>3652526>>3652528To correct the first post: It's the interactive movie simulator cutscenes to appeal to the normalfag audience.
>>3659833We used to have build autism threads but it has been a long time since the game came out. Some people have played BG3 for over 1000 hours. This is a singleplayed game mostly so there is only so much you can do talking about builds.
>>3659612>BG3 is exhaustingIt can be fun at times, but it really is. There's so much downtime and fiddling and fussing with shit, picking up trash items and selling them, reorganizing the inventory, sorting bullshit, shuffling items around. It just feels like a chore and paying a tedium tax.And the game is basically dice fetishism. So many of the out-of-combat rolls in the game could've just been take 20, or even take 10, and it would've flowed far better and been less silly. Passive perception is explicitly supposed to be take 10. And the homebrew to auto-fail skill checks on 1, and auto-pass skill checks on 20 is just dumb, it leads to failing shit you shouldn't be able to fail, and then passing shit you shouldn't be able to. This is all on top of 5th ed being the most random and swingy of all editions. Just feels bad.
>>3652526the combat is fine, way better than bg2 anywayyou gotta play it on the ironman difficulty though or else it aint fun
>>3661682At launch, I died and had to reload on the act 3 hag fight because my 20 STR character jumped really far, and I clipped up through the roof of the basement and fell through the map boundary and instadied. I can’t imagine wiping 100+ hours of progress in a buggy Eurojank single player game like that.
>>3661688thats why you wait a year for them to fix their eurojank shit instead of being an unpaid beta tester cuck
>>3661698It still feels roughly as buggy now as it did a year ago.
>>3661716well it aint, i did two playthroughs and only ever had one small bug which didn't really affect anything
>>3652604>don't have to overwork their brainsHuh? In pathfinder you cast some buffs then attack move through the entire level and destroy everything with 0 thought.
