>>24784018
>Immoral FOR WHO? Yourself? This is just a commandment, an order.
If you are assuming what the Bible says is true, that means God is the ultimate judge of what is right and what is best, not you. Therefore, following God's orders is required, and sinning is never an end that justifies the means. Under that paradigm, God is a better judge of what is right to do than you are. It doesn't make sense to assume that the Bible is true but then also decide to reject the value judgement contained in it, that's self-contradictory.

>actually a better fate than any of us who must toil through this trial
I'm not willing to say that any sin whatsoever, even the slightest sin, has an end that justifies the means, nor am I willing to say this either.

In Ephesians 2:10 it says, "For we are his workmanship, created in Christ Jesus unto good works, which God hath before ordained that we should walk in them."

And in 2 Timothy 1:9, "Who hath saved us, and called us with an holy calling, not according to our works, but according to his own purpose and grace, which was given us in Christ Jesus before the world began,"

Frankly, the whole line of logic being pushed against the basic thought being repeated above is self-contradictory, since it's 1) assuming the Bible is true, but then 2) claiming that its judgements are false. Which is it? It can't be both. It's also self-apparently satanic in addition to this, since it is repeatedly expressing a desire to kill unborn and newborn children, and deliberately obtuse to the value judgements given in the Bible.

>>24784076
>I'm not willing to say that any sin whatsoever, even the slightest sin, has an end that justifies the means, nor am I willing to say this either.
You can acknowledge the fate of the killed unborn child is a good one without saying that the ends justify the means, but I suspect you are balking because admitting this part of your belief system undermines the whole thing, making you the dishonest one in this exchange.
>It's also self-apparently satanic in addition to this, since it is repeatedly expressing a desire to kill unborn and newborn children, and deliberately obtuse to the value judgements given in the Bible.
Is it satanic to secure the best possible outcome for a child's soul? Again, you seem to hold that going to the arms of Jesus in heaven is the best possible thing in life, while also holding that sending people there quicker is a bad thing, and your only justification is to appeal to "because God said so". You are evincing a manifest contradiction and cognitive dissonance and you even go so far as to refuse to look at it at all. You simultaneously value this life as of supreme importance while also deeming this world a corrupt fallen world which is a trial and a vale of tears to be endured and borne as a heavy burden. You can't have both. Either you value life above all, which means no fate after death can be better than life, or you think the fate after life is better and thus all killing which sends a person to that fate is a good thing. Remember, God is constrained by the laws of logic, there are certain formulations which are inviolable (otherwise, why have evil at all?). Your system of belief does not stand.

>>24776957
We just saw Jonathan Rinderknecht ritually burn a Bible and then go out to burn down the Palisades.
Maybe Ehrman is right. (In fact I think he mostly is, on points.) Look at the people who are taking Ehrman to heart. They're disasters and they are bringing fire and murder to the rest of us, who just wanna grill.
That's why we're going for Christianity. Not necessarily the fundie kind which Ehrman's mostly debunked. Orthodoxy or Catholicism will do.

>>24784175
Illusions won't save civilization. They are what bring it down.

>>24769603
your christology is lacking
quite, quite lacking

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>>24782803

>>24782803
Youtube grifters used it in their thumbnails.

>>24782803
Because people didn't read the book and all they know is Judge Holden is supposed to be LE EVIL, which he is, of course, but through the book people keep treating him as if he came off as very likable and trustworthy.

>>24782803
Because deviantart and blood meridian share the same fanbase.

>>24782803
Judge Holden is such a good character, but sadly very few people understand him. A couple years ago I wrote an effort post on reddit explaining why he represents cowardice, but obviously the redditors didn't get it.

https://www.reddit.com/r/cormacmccarthy/comments/15camvj/judge_holdem_represents_not_war_or_evil_but_human/

>>24783633
https://voca.ro/15nNvQLFlSy9

does anyone here have experience learning a classical language (greek or latin) by just reading basic texts and comparing with translations?

I have knowledge of one romance language and am considering learning either Latin or Greek. Just don't know if this could be an efficacious way to learn. By just reading texts

>>24784174
dekaglossai recommends it

>>24784174
Works fine. Ultimately everyone has to transition to actually reading at some point, the debate is just how early that is practical. Do what is fun for you. Caesar or the Vulgate might be good for this since the Vulgate uses very repetitive grammar/wording and core vocab and Caesar also uses a pretty small core vocab.

I was actually considering dabbling in italian by just doing a pass of a page of Dante's Inferno in italian, reading it in english, then rereading in italian.

>>24782628
Yesterday, I read 35 pages of LLPSI. Today, I read zero Latin, but I did 5 write-throughs of the active indicative table. When I am less depressed I will read more.

>>24784278
Not that that's the main reason I didn't like it.

It's not like I hated it either. It was fine.

>>24784008
>I thought women didn't like sex or intimacy or men
>where the fuck did you get that idea?
Advice for you anon. Never get on the internet again. Move to a smaller town, dress like Boromir, spend 7 hours a day chopping wood, join the fire department and adopt some stray animals.

I, too, watch shoeonhead

>>24784008
>rajas
Leave Jeet.

>>24784008
They're far more perverted than men it just manifests more subtly (I.e. in social interaction and less visually)

>>24780286
Beyond being successive teachers of each other? The two points unifying them appear to me to be a kind of judgement of Pre-Socratic philosophy as having been in certain respects inadequate, and the importance of taking one's bearings, at least initially, by the opinions or things said about the phenomena being investigated, and then making one's way to inquiry into nature.

Your question about superiority is a harder question to get into without it just amounting to asserting one's tastes, and you'd have to come to some clarity about what measure you want to be deciding from. For example, Aristotle is more precise in his surviving writings, offers accounts of the connections between the subjects of his studies, and covers a greater breadth, most evident in his studies of biology and natural phenomena, whereas Plato and Xenophon's Socratic writings are more allusive, partly owing to political circumstances necessitating more reserve (for example, per Apology 18b-c and Laws 967a-d, the study of the heavens was associated by the many with atheism and impiety). So on that point, Aristotle readily appears more clear, systematic, and willing to elaborate on and establish answers concerning the subject of nature, and by that measure, I think most people would agree that Aristotle comes out in a superior light. But to give due to Plato and Xenophon's Socrates, they more clearly show something like the circumstances by which philosophic inquiry arises, the conditions that are hospitable or otherwise to that activity, and how people may or may not turn to philosophy, whereas Aristotle's surving treatises, seemingly meant only for students within his school, already presupposes that one has made that choice to pursue philosophy, so that, absent Aristotle's dialogues, where he may have been equally clear as Plato and Xenophon, some number of the problems involved in starting to philosophize are less clear, because he's addressing those already convinced (but I would not say all such problems, since he alludes to some of those difficulties throughout his corpus).

If the deciding factor is over who's right, that will run into difficulties given the modern rejection of both of them from the position of modern science, but even trying to ascertain who is, at least, more right would require taking each of them seriously while prodding and testing each to see if the answers they put forward are decisive or only provisional and tentative, naturally follow or are perhaps forced, and so on. People have spent lifetimes reading any of them and butt heads regularly over how to understand basic points, so it's not as clear cut as one may like.

I have reached the conclusion Plato is not worth reading and further that he is an extremly overrated writer that we are forced into seeing as great.
If his dialogues rotted away in the 14th century not much beyond good prose would have been lost.

>>24781253
Plato is peak midwit

Bump

Any good modern translations of Plato's work? I've been trying to read The Allegory of the Cave but I can't even get past the first 10 pages. The writing is too archaic and convulted. I have to read every sentence multiple times to figure out what it means.

>>24784182
>former
yawn

>>24784257
Why? He's supposed to be her daughter's old classmate. Also her daughter went to the school she teaches at.

>>24783040
>Plowing Etc

Agreed, very average book. Empusium as a premise is basically designed to make /chan/cels rage, but at least it has some amusing Mann pastiche and nice descriptions of place/heathen idols

>>24783530
This anon gets it: the prize wasn't for her cheap detective novel, it was for making Poles angry

>>24780272
Ishiguo wasn't even listed as having odds when he won it (was literally getting a haircut when they announced it kek). The Swedes will do what they like.

>>24771780
>Paul Simon
The guy from Simon and Garfunkel?

>>24784216
Yep

Apparently Murnane has never left Australia and refuses to fly so that would be a funny win

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Wings or no wings /lit/?

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>>24748733
Besides crab monsters and sea serpents, what are some good choices for beach-dwelling monsters?

>>24782083
Jelly fish, sea Turtles, land sharks, eels(technically different), coral monsters(walking reefs)

>>24782083
Piranhas

>>24782083
Crocodiles and dire plovers.

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What it feels like to say "I don't know" in response to shit you didn't care to talk about in your setting.

>what is the tax code?
>what do they eat?
>why is there new world crops?
>why don't they use nuclear reactors instead of natural gas?
>how come the thieves' guild hasn't been stopped yet?
>if there is ghosts does that mean there is an afterlife?

I don't know (I don't care, imagine your own answer).

>>24784338
I said its not exclusive to the left not that its a majority thought. I'm not even a supporter of this whole thing.

>>24784340
well, youre just wrong i don't know how you can be on 4chan and think that to be honest its been pretty common here as both a leftist talking point and rightist talking point forever. i don't know what twitch streamer you get your news from but its a bit lopsided.

>>24784342
You won't find normal centrist or normal conservative people supporting the abuse of the welfare system. This is contained in some far left reddit boards.

>there is someone in this thread right now who cannot comprehend people dislike it when people abuse the welfare system and it's not a one-sided outlook

What causes this?

>>24784359
Small internet bubbles

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>>24784266
WTF DID YOU JUST SAY ABOUT KING ARTHUR, TASTE MY BLADE, HIIIYYYAAAA
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UQ3nqf7Ndeo&list=RDUQ3nqf7Ndeo&start_radio=1

>>24784248
Based. Did you get bored of your middle class lifestyle and crashed out drunk and now have found yourself in a drug smoking meth?

And I'm descended from Arthur

>>24784290
No I was always poor.

>>24784303
Same, but also due to population collapse and statistics so is basically every European, just not documented, insofar as there was a specific king that the legend is based on.

Take this kamala-core garbage back to your containment board

>>24781613
You are so stupid that it causes me psychic pain

>>24780647
having never read vineland is the ending as ridiculous and marvel-esque as the movie?

i was surprised at how disgustingly bad the ending of one battle after another was, i think overall it would have been salvageable if the glowies killed bob and his daughter or at the very least left them to rot in prison indefinitely. really though i know i have no one else to blame but myself for expecting anything more than what you are given in this schlock of a film. a film about revolution is always going to be doomed to fail when its spawned from the anus of hollywood elite.

>>24783688
lmao internet anger is just impotent screaming into the void, in real life you’re just some meek guy with a low tone of voice. Being angry all the time when interacting with faceless strangers on social media only robs you of that energy you claim to be channeling and posions your soul in the process.

>>24784332
you're absolutely seething, m8

>>24783961
He thinks this is the Granddaddy of Marxism, and Marx was supposed to be a jobless bum. Imbeciles troll here.

My favorite chapter overall might be Religion just for the beautiful writing. The part about the luminous essence gives me goosebumps. I wish more people here read this book. To me Hegel is alongside Aristotle in that anyone who takes the trouble to understand him will respect him, and the people who attack him aggressively never seem to have read him at all.

>>24784015
The Aristotleanons can explain what Aristotle said, you guys just say he’s great but are incapable of describing what wonderful thing it is that he’s supposed to be saying.

>>24784026
If you expect a proposition (“God is the final cause”, “the will is evil”, “we only know phenomena”) there is none, any proposition is at best half true. So there is no way to sum him up in that way, sorry. My favorite attempt in this line would be from the preface: “The life of God and divine intelligence, then, can, if we like, be spoken of as a game love plays with itself; but this idea falls into edification, and even sinks into insipidity, if it lacks the seriousness, the suffering, the patience, and the labour of the negative.”

>>24784026
Whenever talking about Hegel, you may notice that people will criticize any attempt to summarize his philosophy, but this is a critical essence of his philosophy as a whole to begin with. His philosophy is of a spirit that is continuously engaged in growth and development. There is no fixed essence or absolute truth in the old sense of the term. The Absolute Spirit is always growing, developing, and being reshaped just as a lifeform reshapes itself in its process of growth. Criticism of everything at all stages and of all claims is necessary to complete the whole of the effort undertaken by him. It is only natural that a spirit of criticism of and among Hegelians would flow from such a philosophy.

>>24783367
>What now?
Our hearts our restless until they rest in Thee.

>>24784158
What if God doesn't exist
What then

>>24784115
Already get plenty. My diet, activity. And body are all healthy. I don't drink or do any drugs either. I only pray to God every night to be dead the next day. Thats the only thing I can look forward to anymore. I've just never enjoyed any bit of this

>>24784293
>Already get plenty
how? you don't go outside.

>>24784354
I already said I do everyday.

>>24784351
>k